ok, buy American... but this is redickulous! :(

[Fred]

2nd point-outsourcing

This is a quote from the Dean of the London Business School. I see her point, but I'm not sure that I agree.

"According to standard economic theory, the outsourcing of services, like the outsourcing of manufactured goods, is good for the American economy. It'll enhance the productivity and competitiveness of U.S. companies and increase the demand for their goods and services and the U.S. workers who produce them. In addition, as foreign incomes grow, the demand for U.S. exports will expand, providing new domestic high-wage job opportunities."

I'm an overeducated, hard working, old guy who has been out of work for 6 months, and is a partner in a little engineering/consulting company that makes no money, so I'm not real happy about any jobs disappearing, but you can flame me anyway.

Fred

 

[dogtired]

Yes, that was back when I tried to carry 2 gas cans, a high lift jack and a 33 inch spare on the swingout all at once and then drove on the crappy Los Angeles concrete freeways. The bumper carried the load but the unibody couldn't take it. As long as I stayed off the freeways with all of that loaded on there it was fine. I ditched that mounting configuration but the bumper is fine otherwise.

edit: this is mine
too much load in the rear, that would transfer the weight well if you are in a rain ... I would imagine more stable. I had a pickup truck I wish I had some weight at the time of my wreck, it would have saved me and my truck.


Please respond to this:



I did, I guess the message got buried somewhere, or, you didn't read too well... :read: here is my objectivity as a quote from myself:

"However, I did make a statement about the company, I never attacked the individuals personally, because I simply do not know them. I did make a remark that critised them as a business entity. For example, don't we knock the government for all its bureuacracies and their bumbling and mistreatment/mishandling of funds/people and we the people of the United States continue to support them? But I digress. But as a business entity, they have made a poor decision to sell a particular product. I honestly wish them to be successful, but I think they are shooting themselves in the foot."

 

[dogtired]

Wait, so dogtired, you're saying you don't like people spending their own money as they want to, because they spend it on something that you feel is overpriced?

no you got it all wrong, I said I felt something was overpriced and I felt obligated to inform to my fellow Jeepers (was trying to look out for ya) that this is a raw deal, so after I announce the message... you have your own thoughts if YOU decide whatever is right for you, it is your money, you make up your own mind. Now, I would think you have made a mistake when there are a lot of companies offering a much cheaper bumper that is comparable to the more $$$ bumper that bulletproof is offering. If bulletproof was the only company selling a bumper for the XJ, then that is a completely different story, because you need a bumper and one store is selling what you need, and he is the ONLY source! So therefore, if there is no one selling it besides him there is no competition. Simple law of supply and demand! This is basic economics! And I STILL think it is too overpriced! Sheesh. If you have read :read: very carefully from the beginning it would have made all the more sense. Some fool thought it was me attacking him, because he bought an expensive bumper and somehow I made him feel bad, so went attacked me verbally in this forum. And I responded in kind. I even had respect for him and was really nice to him in the beginning, till he opened his mouth. :twak: :dunno:

 

[Grant]

The first point is that people buy them, and have bought them for at least five years. While the price may be objectionable to some, others find it a good value. That is the whole idea of capitalism. If your product is worth it's price, people will buy it. Worth/value is subjective, and there are 6 billion, more or less definitions of it.

Dogtired, go ahead and post your opinion that the bumper isn't worth the money, but don't question someone else's sense of value. Unless you would rather live in a communist economy.

Fred

What Fred said.

 

[Beezil]

born downtown, lived in lincoln park (5 min. north of downtown) moved to the irish southside (beverly/morgan park) moved back to the northside(rogers park)for a couple years, lived in an apartment in edgewater before I bought a place a couple blocks away from wrigley field..

I know where you once lived, which is rogers park/"west ridge" or west rogers park.

rogers park officially ends at western avenue (2400w) and maplewood is something like 2500 west, a couple blocks away....

that area is crazy, your family probably won't recognize it, it looks like any street in new delhi or something.....

 

[kirby]

This has to be the weirdest all over the place thread that I've ever read. I mean he stated his opinion and now it's blown up into lost jobs, I hate you because you said my bumper was overpriced and so on. Some people have the cash and want to spend it. If you like a particular bumper over another and have the money buy it. If you don't then don't. There's a bumper for everybody's price range (I guess except for those with no money) so buy the one that suits you and that's it.

 

[woody]

There are a few things in life I've learned.

One of them involves making public judgements about a man's Jeep parts purchases.

If the owner likes it, it suits their purpose, and isn't endangering me/my peeps or my rig... WTH works for me :dunno:

 

[biscuitboy87]

like woody said. i was glad to have the info, even tho i will be making my own bumper. its cool to see the opinions here. i learn something daily be it cracked heads or faulty guages or the weaknesses of the xj from year to year. its all good. there is alot of knowledge here and i intend to use it along with my sometimes good judgement. lol. thats my two cents...inflation...five cents.

 

[BLUTO]

well american life is more important than any other nationalities is because we are americans, well most of us anyhow. it all goes back to the simple principle of Cover Your Ass (aka CYA). Basically anything that is yours is more important to you than anyone elses whether it be the last 3 beers in the cooler that someone wants you to share or your way of life.

whether you like monopolies or not, they run the world and line the pockets of the rich. OPEC is a good example and DeBeers diamonds are another. Diamonds arent scarce like you are led to believe, one family owns the world market of them and has warehouses full at that, they just control the price and advertise (though very little) to make you think they are. They are so controlling they can not even do business in the US.

Yes, america's poverty levels are wealthy compared to the world. but many things hold back the world. Religion and refusal to change their way of life is the main draw back. for example in some countries in africa for every 1 person who has full-blown aids and out of work they have another person taking care of them at all times. that represents 2 people out of the work force. so that just makes it harder on those in the work force. many countries over there dont rotate crops either. there are tons of reasons why we are wealthy and they are poor. hell many developing countries still measure their wealth in acres of farm land where we use the gross domestic product.

does it suck to be them? sure does. do i feel bad about it on ocassion? only when i see a feed the children commercial. do i send money over there or wish we were all equal? no chance in hell


Hunter

Amen brother!
This is America atriot: The Land of Milk and Honey. The Land of Opportunity. the streets here are paved with GOLD :sunshine: !
You don't see us going over to these other shithole, mudpuddle 3rd world nations and forcing their people to come over here to run our party stores, 7-11's, and gas stations....do you? No, they come here freely (sometimes they sneek in). We educate 'em, feed 'em, clothe 'em.....give them health care (often for free). If you think I'm BS'n you, you don't know too many immigrants OR how we coddle some newcommers because we're (US Gov't) trying to kiss-ass with some oil-rich, sand-breathing, bong-smoking, terrorist-loving, in-bred dickweeds 1/2 a world away! :soapbox:
If we don't start protecting what is OURS, somebody else will! And if we have to "get in shape" to fight-off those who would want to take it away....then that's what we have to do. We start by educating ourselves and our children. We get involved (to some small extent) politically. We get off our lazy asses...away form the TV (WWF, VH-1, all-nite cable) and learn something marketable....be it a trade, profession, or just plain hustle. I work at DCX Tech Center, you wouldn't believe the number (ratio) of Asians and Indians/Pakistani's that work in this building?! I'm talking "right-off-the-boat" immigrants who learned engineering back home and came over here to live. Not all of them are H-1B Visas either, a lot are permanent. They work 12+ hour days x 6+ days/week. Chrysler can ask their salaried employees to work up to 10 hrs/week of O.T. (40 hrs pay + 10 hrs) before company policy states that they pay O.T.......This is what they are used to doing in the "old country" to keep their jobs: nothing new for them....kinda suck-ass for most modern Americans. If you wanna be an "employee" in the future get used to it ... OR... start setting some ground rules now, before this gets too far out of hand!

 

[Handlebars]

Man, this is pointless in trying to reason with him, all I was trying to do was raise awareness that this company is charging too high of a price for a bumper that is not much better than other well made ones that are similar in design and selling for way less. And I wanted to get the message across to my fellow Jeepers in this forum and others.

Without name calling and with arguments supported by facts please explain how this bumper is overpriced. Anybody can look at their website and price list and draw the conclusion that it is an expensive product. You must have access to some other source of information proving that they are an unscrupulous outfit preying on otherwise unsuspecting jeepers, that without your warning would be ripped-off. Your personal experience with that company or their products is perfectly acceptable for this argument. In fact, this personal experience is just what I look to the forums to hear about. This is the closest thing that I could find to justification of you position in your rambling argument:

In fact, I do feel very qualified to tell the entire Internet what I think... and Handlebars... you want to know why I feel very qualified? It is my MONEY or lack thereof on that entitles me to speak on what to purchase.

Lemme get this straight: you can't afford their bumper so it must be a rip-off? Because you can't afford it you don't want anybody else to buy it? Are you even in the market for a new bumper?

I paid hard earned money for my Bulletproof bumper and have lived with that bumper for 3 years and 50,000 miles. I have 'wheeled with that bumper all over California and the southwest in that time. I lived in my Cherokee on the road for 4 months. I would have found out by now if that bumper were not a top quality product. I believe that you have to pay more to get better quality, this is a case where that has proven true. My Cherokee has seen thousands of off-road miles in the time that I have owned it, how about yours? I only post advice from experience, I keep my speculation to myself. Do you know why it is important to have a durable bumper on a trail-driven Cherokee? Please tell me that this is not how you learn everything you know:

Do we not watch television to learn and SEE some far distant land and its native people/animals and how they live? I can accept that fact, by watching television, I can pretty much get the gist of it.

Dog, you really need to get out of the house and see the world for yourself instead of regurgitating what you see on TV. You also really need to spend some time on the trail in your Jeep before you can form an educated opinion about what equipment works and what doesn't. There is only so much that you can learn from the internet.

Your turn! Once again, please support your arguments with facts, not hearsay. Be aware that arguments opposing your point of view are not insults. Also be aware that your insults do nothing to support your argument.

 

[woody]

"Be aware that arguments opposing your point of view are not insults. Also be aware that your insults do nothing to support your argument. "

Before fiery fingers get you carried away, understand very clearly that intentionally insulting people on 's forums WILL have consequences

 

[Beezil]

please explain how this bumper is overpriced

what do you mean no name-calling!????

handlebars, you are lucky, I learned some nasty ones on the playground today.....

The only way I can determine that bumper is overpriced, is from knowing I could build a duplicate for half the price and make some nice profit. Of course, I would have to make them in 100qtys to do it, but I know it could be done......

maybe thier methods are different and their manufacturing costs are higher which would justify thier price.

I would still consider that "overpriced" since I think their customers might be paying for thier own short-comings....

I think there's a difference between something that is overpriced, and declaring that you've been "ripped off"

 

[CRASH]

Support Crash, buy URF.

CRASH

 

[Handlebars]

I would still consider that "overpriced" since I think their customers might be paying for thier own short-comings....

Hey, I plan on getting that operation done....really!

Seriously, I have neither the desire nor facilities to do any fabrication. It is worth my while to simply buy the products that somebody else has already designed and manufatured to fit my Cherokee and bolt them on. Sure, you can sell them for half the price that Bulletproof does and still make a profit...why don't you?

 

[XJJPR]

Dogtired,

Correct me here if I'm wrong, but you have posted here and other forums that the only thing you are doing is warning people that YOU think this bumper is too expensive?

WHY are you doing this?

Has BP given you poor service?
Has BP not answered your e-mail/phone calls?
Has BP not sent the bumper you ordered?
What is the attack on BP about?

Yes this type of thing is an attack and can be considered slander!

Attacking on a non issue, such as a price value, of something is pretty low on the totem pole of ethics without prior product issues such as I paid $5000.00 for this bumper and it crumbled on the first rock I hit. Do you do this with houses being sold in your neighborhood, restaurants, hotels and such or just BP? If it is just BP it sure looks more and more like slander and not information.

As for the American thing, America is the only place you'll find such a free market to have all levels of product available to you as a consumer. If you don't want to pay for a real Rollex go buy a knock off, but make sure you wear it proudly! I'm sure it will be of the same quality! RIGHT!

Price Value is as much a personal decision as if you like chocolate or vanilla ice cream. Some people pay for what they might see as quality and some people see a chunk of steel as the same thing no matter what it looks like or has as features. Until you start to compare thing with exact identical make-up, like gold, it will always be hard to have everyone agree on price value. If the market says BP is too expensive or terrible stuff the market will stop buying and BP will go out of business, they haven't yet and seem to still be growing!

So I ask again Why are really doing this?

mark

 

[Dirk Funk]

well american life is more important than any other nationalities is because we are americans, well most of us anyhow. it all goes back to the simple principle of Cover Your Ass (aka CYA). Basically anything that is yours is more important to you than anyone elses whether it be the last 3 beers in the cooler that someone wants you to share or your way of life.

whether you like monopolies or not, they run the world and line the pockets of the rich. OPEC is a good example and DeBeers diamonds are another. Diamonds arent scarce like you are led to believe, one family owns the world market of them and has warehouses full at that, they just control the price and advertise (though very little) to make you think they are. They are so controlling they can not even do business in the US.

Yes, america's poverty levels are wealthy compared to the world. but many things hold back the world. Religion and refusal to change their way of life is the main draw back. for example in some countries in africa for every 1 person who has full-blown aids and out of work they have another person taking care of them at all times. that represents 2 people out of the work force. so that just makes it harder on those in the work force. many countries over there dont rotate crops either. there are tons of reasons why we are wealthy and they are poor. hell many developing countries still measure their wealth in acres of farm land where we use the gross domestic product.

does it suck to be them? sure does. do i feel bad about it on ocassion? only when i see a feed the children commercial. do i send money over there or wish we were all equal? no chance in hell


Hunter

As someone who has always had an American citizenship, but traveled to over 30 countries worldwide, 3 continents and lived in South Africa for two years in the early 90s, I feel I have a unique perspective on the American way of life.

Don't anyone dare call me unpatriotic, but alot of "patriotic Americans" are freakin idiots. I'm not talking about anyone on . I'm talking about the 13% of the American population that can't identify the USA on a freakin globe.

Of COURSE we have it good. Of COURSE we can't expect everyone to enjoy our way of life. But should maintaining our way of life infringe upon other peoples livelyhood? Seriously, what do you all think? I think I'm sounding too much like a hippie...

I guess I'll shut up. This hangover is freakin killing me. I think my head is going to explode.

 

[biscuitboy87]

As someone who has always had an American citizenship, but traveled to over 30 countries worldwide, 3 continents and lived in South Africa for two years in the early 90s, I feel I have a unique perspective on the American way of life.

Don't anyone dare call me unpatriotic, but alot of "patriotic Americans" are freakin idiots. I'm not talking about anyone on . I'm talking about the 13% of the American population that can't identify the USA on a freakin globe.

Of COURSE we have it good. Of COURSE we can't expect everyone to enjoy our way of life. But should maintaining our way of life infringe upon other peoples livelyhood? Seriously, what do you all think? I think I'm sounding too much like a hippie...

I guess I'll shut up. This hangover is freakin killing me. I think my head is going to explode.

i saw one of those bumper stickers "think globally, act locally" and it makes sense to me. sounding like a hippie is a good thing. hippies are responsible for many good things in many communities (things like recycling programs come to mind)...but i get what you mean cuz i sound like one more often than not.
as for pride in my country...i have pride, but feel shame. foreign policy is not hitting its target, which should be to educate the world rather than let big business exploit it. i find it offensive that companies like RJR and phillip morris can make cigarettes which kill more people in a year than the taliban ever will. if you think about it like this, then the cigarette companies are nothing more than terrorists...globally and locally.
to end my soapbox raveings...we are lucky in the USA because we can vote. not is it only our right, but it is our duty...and it is the only way to right that which is is wrong.

 

[Beezil]

As someone who has always had an American citizenship, but traveled to over 30 countries worldwide, 3 continents and lived in South Africa for two years in the early 90s, I feel I have a unique perspective on the American way of life.
.

Was this during the time you worked for the Octillian Method?

 

[Dirk Funk]

Was this during the time you worked for the Octillian Method?

I don't care if you're Tom Googliatta, Yvonne Goolagong or you just like to smack the ball around. I say if there's grass on the field, you go ahead and play ball.

 

[Big_Ben]

I'm talking about the 13% of the American population that can't identify the USA on a freakin globe.

you meant 1.3% right? It's ignorant to say 13% of American adults can't identify the US on a globe.