My 44/9" full width cherokee build

I put a hard spacer in to keep the tie rod from rolling over,
tightened all miy heims,
reset my caster to 7* (one side is 8.5*) (tough to gauge with an angle finder)
tightened my jam nuts,
changed a misalignment spacer (put a wider one in),
new steering box (torqued to spec),
tightened all my control arm bolts,
set the toe to 3/8"" toe in,
greased all my tierod ends,
checked my dog-tracking (my wheelbase is now set at 101" by the way),
found a wobbled out trackbar mount hole and shackle bolt hole... fixed both of those,
changed my upper trackbar bolt,
checked my shock mounts,
checked the wheelbearing, and ball joints- they are tight
The lower trackbar bushing looks kind of suspect, but still ok-- I'll try replacing that and add another 1/8" toe, and check the caster with a different angle gauge (I've been checking it by placing a magnetic angle finder on the flat part on the lower ball joint and checking how flat the ground is beneath it)

And I still have death wobble... wtf??? Any ideas? It tracks great and I had her up to 80mph but big bumps give my death wobble.

I practically wrote a book on fixing death wobble (http://www.utah4x4club.com/index.php?showtopic=364) and I'm still kinda stumped.


Also I just swapped in new Teraflex 1.5" shackles, so my Teraflex Relovers are for sale.

(shackle angle is terrible... like 90*, I may have to do the relocation fix like opie and others have done)
 
Added the JKS over the axle bracket and cut and shortened my trackbar about 4" to get it parallel with the draglink.

I cut it down, beveled the edges to get a good weld, hammered in a 4" long "spud" and drilled a couple holes on either side for plug welds.
IMG00284.jpg

the drag link and trackbar are perfectly level and it killed all bump steer.

and I still have massive death wobble....wtf? ;)
 
I would be looking in the direction of your front axle itself then. Im not really familiar with these 44's just yet (I just know put one under mine), but you may want to take a look at your wheel bearings. I know some of the 60's had a kingpin setup, forgive me if Im completely wrong as Im just taking guesses, but could it be something in that area?
 
99XJWhitey said:
I would be looking in the direction of your front axle itself then. Im not really familiar with these 44's just yet (I just know put one under mine), but you may want to take a look at your wheel bearings. I know some of the 60's had a kingpin setup, forgive me if Im completely wrong as Im just taking guesses, but could it be something in that area?
Click to expand...
It isn't kingpin: the axles are from a 76' but I'll mess with it more this week, it's got to be something I've missed :confused1.



I haven't messed with the Jeep much lately because I've been too busy working on a side project: my friend and I have been building an 85 4runner for an old school rock crawling competition in Delta, Utah that we just competed in this weekend.
DSCN4647.jpg


We got third place party1: you can read more :read: about it here (http://www.utah4x4club.com/index.php?showtopic=6897&hl=)
 
Gravesdiggerxj said:
and I still have massive death wobble....wtf? ;)
Click to expand...

I believe that minimum caster and maximum toe-in is best for reducing death wobble. I would try 4-5 degree positive caster and 3/16 toe in and see if that helps. Also any enlargement of the axle end trackbar bolt hole will contribute to death wobble. I know a lot of people say a steering dampner isn't necessary, but it can prevent a bump induced shimmy from escalating into full blown death wobble.
 
I know a lot of people say a steering dampner isn't necessary, but it can prevent a bump induced shimmy from escalating into full blown death wobble.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm only on 31's, but my steering is real loose... I SWEAR that the dampner has saved my ass a number of times!
 
hey stratt whats up man. I need to give you my new number. I lost yours. My old phone took a crap so I am using carlees 2nd line. I will get you that number man.
 
Sierra and everyone: is this what you mean by positive caster?
caster2.jpg


That would mean the lower ball joint centerline is "in front of" the upper ball joint centerline: is that correct?

Right now I have my caster set to -7.5* (as illustrated in the picture) and toe set at 1/2" toe in (measured centerline to centerline in front of and behind the tires)

I replaced an outer wheel bearing last night that had a little play in it.
I also got a rebuild kit for the Rubicon express flex joint on the trackbar and a new bushing and sleave for the lower mount, We'll see if that helps tonight. I still need to remount my steering dampner from when I added the JKS over the axle bracket. (Thoughts on mounting? Like how Sierra Drifter or XJeeper did it maybe?)

Sierra Drifter and slcpunk74: you have pm's
 
hey send me the name of that bumpstop company.

Woot woot still no dw?
 
slcpunk74 said:
hey send me the name of that bumpstop company.

http://www.prothane.com/pages/productguide.html they are listed under coil spring insterts. Timbren is the other one.

Woot woot still no dw?
Click to expand...
Well I did get dw on the way to work today... it seems to be worse while braking... looks like I'll be playing with the caster more tonight.

add to the tally
:rebuild kit for the RE trackbar: $21.34
 
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My guess is your death wobble is caused by your 1/2" toe in. Take that out to about 1/16" (toed in). I had dw like crazy, screwed with the caster, made sure everything was tight, changed parts- nothing. I finally checked my toe and found it in 1/2". Now it's between 0 and 1/16" and I have not had a problem since (on a D 30 or fw 44).

-Jim C
 
are your tires balanced? it's just a thought, but if they're not, it can throw you off...
 
99XJWhitey said:
Im running fullwidth with 3.75 backspacing and 13.50" tires and I measure 83" to the outside of my tires.
Click to expand...
you must live in a place where tires sticking out doesnt bother the cops. do you think with more backspacing it would be possible to get under maybe a set of bushwhackers?
 
Well I had a chance to speak to FordGuy yesterday and he explained it in some terms that my engineering brain could wrap around. Thanks also to Sierra Drifter for the suggestions.

Basically he explained that as you add caster you get more return to center (i.e. the wheels return to straight). When you hit a bump this return to center causes the wheels to center themselves which preloads the suspension, as that preloading releases, the tires go past center then correct and go past center again and again, this oscillation is death wobble. I understood the loading and unloading that causes the oscillation, the thing he explained that I didn't understand was the "WHY the oscillation continues."

Less caster means less return to center and less chance of wobble. The steering is a little more responsive (less return to center) but I can live with that.


I knocked it as close to 0" toe as I could (I'm between 0 and 1/32" toe in) and down to 5* caster (4.5*) on the driverside, and seems to help, I also remounted my steering stabilizer, it drives pretty decent other than a tire balance issue...



looks like I "need" some new tires... my MTR's are pretty unbalanced (the airsoft thing :doh: ) and are about 1/4 tread. I could pull out the airsoft and get them balanced... but why waste $50 when I told my wife I "needed" new tires ;)

also it improved my pinion angle quite a bit
 
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