Detroit True Trac both ends

[IXNAYXJ]

While sort-of off topic, I don't understand the ant-locker mentality that comes with snow driving. I've spent a lot of time in the snow and I love my dual full Detroits. :dunno:

-----Matt-----

 

[IXNAYXJ]

Here's Megawatt's TrueTrac sucking the big one:

-----Matt-----

 

[CanMan]

While sort-of off topic, I don't understand the ant-locker mentality that comes with snow driving. I've spent a lot of time in the snow and I love my dual full Detroits. :dunno:

-----Matt-----

I dont have any complaints about my spool or aussie either.

What is a 'big one' Matt?

 

[XJourney]

While sort-of off topic, I don't understand the ant-locker mentality that comes with snow driving. I've spent a lot of time in the snow and I love my dual full Detroits. :dunno:

-----Matt-----

I don't know about locked front and rear. But True Trac front and locked rear is the sh!t in compact snow/ice as long as your on the throttle. It was hard to lose control and I tried.

 

[Handlebars]

I've tried it a few times. Seems to help, but it's difficult to do when running a clutch at the same time.

There's no need for a hand throttle if you learn how to force your IAC to raise the idle for you. Here's how:

With your right foot firmly planted on the brake, slowly engage the clutch partway, creating a drag on the engine to slow the RPM below 500, but not to the point of a stall. Within 5 seconds or so you will hear a very loud sucking sound from the engine as the IAC opens all the way.

Slowly release pressure on the brake pedal at the same time as you fully engage the clutch. If you have 2 airborne tires, they will spin as if you have open diffs at this point and the IAC should be holding the engine at 1500-2000 RPM.

Move your right foot over to the gas and your left foot to the brake. Smoothly and gradually lean into the brake pedal as you give it enough gas to prevent a stall.

If the 2 tires on the ground are wedged good it may take a surprising amount of pressure on the brake pedal and a floored gas pedal to gain forward progress. By floored I do not mean spinning the airborne tires at high speed, you never want to do that. TrueTracs are torque sensing LSDs, not speed sensing. A big speed difference makes it harder for them to work. Ideally you want the airborne tires to spin just fast enough to keep the engine from stalling with the clutch fully engaged.

At this point you should start moving. Let off the brake and the gas, giving it just enough throttle to keep you going. It takes a bit of practice and finesse to master this technique but is gives you a surprising amount of control... like being able to park a Jeep with an airborne tire on top of a staircase.

An easy way to practice this is to stall you Jeep on a very steep hill, start it up and try to get moving without rolling back at all by forcing the IAC to open by slowly engaging the clutch against the brakes. It sounds like a lot is going on here but it takes less than 10 seconds from start to finish and uses the parts that are already on your Cherokee.

 

[Goatman]

Alex, I've also seen guys break front axle joints by using too much brake. Nothing wrong with dual limited slips, but you need a good reason for getting them instead of a locker. Sooooooo many people drive with lockers,even in the snow, and are totally happy with them, and most don't bother to post on threads like this.

 

[MudDawg]

I had Tru-Tracs in the Heep....broke them both with a lil ole wheezy 2.5 and auto trans.....did I forget to mention the Nitrous??? The MJ#1 has full detroits and has excellent road manners...no snow here...but lots of wet road stuff on oily slick pavement.

 

[red_01_xj]

ive had my tru-trac om the rear for only a week and love it...i have a powertrax up front...i felt more comfortable with an LDS than a full locker mainly becuase we see alot of snow and alot of ice

 

[goodburbon]

I have broken my front axle 4 times now. I think those 4 times were because of the Truetrac. I hit some pretty advanced trails and often use left foot braking to force a lock. I have broken 2 ring gears, one joint and one shaft with one of the wheels in high traction and the other lin low traction with me applying brakes.

 

[Handlebars]

Alex, I've also seen guys break front axle joints by using too much brake. Nothing wrong with dual limited slips, but you need a good reason for getting them instead of a locker.

Were they using too much brake... or too much wheel speed? In 5 years of wheeling with TrueTracs & 33 inch tires I have never broken an axle or driveline. I use the minimum amount of power needed to get over obstacles and spin the tires as little as possible. The procedure I shared states to use smooth, gradual application of brakes, clutch and gas. I doubt my 176k mile 4.0 puts out enough power to break something unless I bounce a rapidly spinning tire into something with a lot of grip, which is something I try to avoid. Also keep in mind that with a manual transmission you don't get the torque multiplication applied to a wedged tire like you do with an automatic.

My good reason- I don't do hardcore trails and don't plan to. Dual TrueTracs have never denied me off road, are seamless in operation and are invisible on the road.

 

[Vince]

I've never had a problem with the Truetracs in my '93 in the seven years they've been installed. I reckon I have a similar driving style to Alex as that Jeep has a D35 and it's still on its original 14-year old axle shafts and has been running 33" tires since the Truetracs went in. The Jeep has been driven regularly offroad on a mix of terrain across Europe, mostly mud and some rock, mostly granite.

Now that I have had some seat time in an XJ with ARBs in Utah and California I think my old Jeep may have had a hard time coping with some of the trails I've driven in the US.

MJR drove my old Jeep up a wet granite hill climb in Wales(UK) in pouring rain on 33" tires. He amazed me how well he managed to keep it moving in the rain when only a few minutes before, vehicles with 35" tires and ARBs were having a hard time at the same obstacle. It's a pity they all left quickly as only EnglishXJ and I were around to watch. I wish I had video of it as the Jeep really didn't look like it had enough tire diameter to do it.

 

[cal]

To the original poster, you may also look at Auburn Ecteds. They are a limited slip when "unlocked" and lock up the clutches when turned on.

A few people here have had unhappy experiances with them, but most of the time asking enough questions shows you they used the wrong kind or amount of friction modifier, or had an early production run of the dana 30 model that didnt unlock correctly. Auburn customer service goes above and beyond in correcting the situation, though, and in general people seem to really like them.

If you think a trutrac is "enough" for you, the ected may be a lot better at the same price range.

 

[Mike H.]

I wanted to bring this to the top for folks that daily drive thier rigs and wish to maintain civil manners, yet run difficult trails.
Like Handlebars, I am running 33's and true trac's both front and rear.
On the road, you have to understand how they work and be deliberate to make them known... so, 99% of the time, you'd swear you have the proper manners of an open/open rig.
I run a 5spd, and the whole 3 pedals 2 legs deal is a real concern, ONLY if you are running anything less than appropriate gearing.
I run 4.56's in the axles, and a 4:1 in the t-case.
I typically run rather aggressive trails where one wheel in the air is typical, and crossed up with 2 wheels dangeling is common.
With the e-brake properly adjusted, and running "slight" brake pedal to clamp the disks, locking all 4 wheels at idle is as easy as pulling out of a paralelle parking spot on a hill. I'm certain you could rev it up good and apply break and blow the spider gears out of it, but, that ain't much of a driver now really now is it?
Yes, it involves some driver finesse, but I'll take that all day every day over the snap pop bang crack, correct your steering action of lockers every day... and, I enjoy running at high speed in the desert as well, and, I am more than estatic to not have lockers in that situation.

In summery:
Proper gear oil weight is benificail, as it should be.
Proper gearing is benificial, as it should be.
A little bit of driver involvement is required... hey, I'm 'wheeiling, I rather enjoy that.
And, when driving to/from the trail, or in everyday situations, you'll never know you've got traction aids in the diff's.