Truly sickening...

[8Mud]

Anybody that´s ever been a part of a large scale deployment, knows what's going on.
Any deployment is only as good as the chain of command.
Imagine a joint services deployment, with no set chain of command.
You take a thousand troops and spread them out, one every 25 yards and you have a thousand people spread out over 25,000 yards. These people also have to be feed and resupplied. It most always trickles down to the Sergeants and squad leaders to control the mission. Typically it takes 6-7 soldiers to keep one, front liner, resupplied and functional.
You throw Sergeants and squad leaders together that have never trained together. From different force structures, joint services, various departments of government and relief agencies. And they are bound to operate in a disjointed manner.
You have a force that is almost impossible to control and/or resupply.
I doubt the inaction is any less frustrating to the people rushing in to help than it is for the victims and the public.
Having said all that, how hard would it be, to put together, a million, three day survival packs, designed for one person that weighs 30 pounds or so. And pre position the kits in catastrophe prone areas. 2000 kits per container, 500 containers. When the shelf life was near finished, they could be provided to the third world needy.
Prior planning, prevents piss poor performance. Kind of springs to mind.

 

[Darky]

then how 'bout get the soldiers back where they're really needed??

Shut up. I'm sorry, but this isn't exactly the place to complain about that...Besides all the soldiers in the world wouldn't have stopped this hurricane from comin ashore and wreaking havoc...

 

[Darky]

What's goin on down there really sucks, but I can't help but think more of those people could've gotten out somehow. I knew about this storm like 2-3 days in advance. I dirt poor right now myself but I would've found a way out. As far as opening the bases to people, it'd never happen. With all the looting and stupid crap they're doing right now, what base would ever let them on? It can be difficult for someone to get on even if they're in uniform and just don't have a decal on their vehicle.

 

[Ramsey]

many of those poor people simply have no transportation or money to have gotten out. there were tons of operational school buses, they should have loaded them up and sent them out. but its too late to say what should have happened. they just need to get going with the now

 

[GSequoia]

I knew about this storm like 2-3 days in advance.

Yes but if I recall it was a Cat1 at first but quickly became a Cat5 storm, that makes a big difference.

One beef I have is that the instant it became a real threat (Cat5 instead of 1) FEMA and the National Guard should've staged themselves around the area to be ready to sweep in. It's a no brainer that if the city is killed like it was (and it was not a surprise, this is exactly what the worst case projection was, the only surprise is that it happened the day after and not during) that people would freak out and looting and anarchy would begin.

Secondly if I owned a store with guns when I secured it I would take the damn guns with me to whatever place I went to. I'm not against guns but don't leave them lying around in a lawless environment, that's asking for trouble.

 

[Darky]

BTW one of my uncle's roommates (crazy old guy, thinks everything's a conspiracy) believes that this hurricane was created and steered by the US Gov't to take our eyes off Iraq...

 

[Ramsey]

my uncle thinks the lack of response is just because the gov wants to rid itself of NO. the way things are going almost makes you think that

 

[Darky]

My wife just told me the gov't just sent in 10,000 troops or something. I didn't hear it but she's been home all day and watchin the news and such...

 

[Ramsey]

about fawkin time, lets see what they do

 

[Darky]

Hopefully people will be smart enough to stop acting stupid when they see them. Ya know, no threatening other people or the troops...Those are both situations in which deadly force is authorized...

 

[Ramsey]

let the first one be set as an example and order will quickly follow

 

[Bent]

What's really ridiculous is that most people care more about some dumbass runaway bride or Michael Jackson's addiction to boys...

Truly Sickening indeed.

By "most" I assume that you mean those who eat up the media tripe by the bucket full?hasta

 

[WrenchMonkey]

Hopefully people will be smart enough to stop acting stupid when they see them...

I doubt it. These are people who've been acting stupid their entire lives.

So yes, I'm gonna be another cold-hearted asshole...

Headline/header from MSNBC:

Chaos erupts amid New Orleans’ desperation
As parts of hurricane-flooded New Orleans descended into anarchy Thursday, storm victims were raped and beaten, fights and fires broke out, corpses lay out in the open, and rescue helicopters and law enforcement officers were fired on.

I don't care how "desperate" I get, raping rampages and taking pot-shots at cops is NOT going to occur to me as a solution.

And I don't care how hard my financial times may be, I'll always have some basic form of transport that will limp me a couple hundred miles out of harm's way, and enough "savings" for a tank of gas to get me there. ESPECIALLY if I choose to live somewhere in the path of every other hurricane to come around, that also happens to be 20' below sea level.

And I don't care how many times a hurricane will knock down a house, the federal aid and insurance companies will keep on rebuilding it, in the same damn spot, and then raise my taxes and ins rates to cover it.

I don't care that some people see the enormous risks they've put themselves in, fail to do anything to avoid, and then riot and rape because big brother didn't come bail their butts out quick enough.

In short, I guess I just can't sympathize.

I just don't care.

Damn. I am an asshole.

Robert

 

[xjblue]

Yes it's an absolutely frustrating situation.

There is no way evacuations could have been conducted for all those poor people without means of transportation provided for and by decades of pre planning. Just no way.

It's easy to start playing the blame game and ask why can't this happen why can't that happen when you can't do anything yourself. Because it hurts to see those people suffer. Here we are essentially powerless to do anything for the lady passing out in front of the camera and it breaks our hearts. Except for the few lawless ones of coarse...

The reality is anytime an infrastructure gets wiped out that badly it just takes time. Even if staged, it would be hard to just sweep in. You have to expect it will get even worse for many of them even while it starts to get better. I doubt there is a single person in charge over there or with anything to do with the rescue effort that hasn't been giving it everything to the best of thier power and ability to help all the people effected they can, they must be ready to drop dead themselves by now and hopefully reinforcements are arriving by the minute. I can't even imagine whats going on. That link with the radio scanner, you could hear the stress and frustration in the voices last night, but there was also this plodding resolve to just keep doing.

On the plus side, 3 times the money has already been raised compared to the same time frame after the tsunami. The dome in houston has been booked for a year in case it takes that long, that just feels good. That is only the tip of the iceberg of the acts of selflessness and the help that is on the way or already implemented. Man the things we can do when we all pitch in.

Hopefully great lessons can be learned. Prepare, build up a supply of basics, food, water, personal health products etc. Store stuff you use and actually like so you can rotate it to prevent shelf life issues. Companies are out there that make 24 hour (or more) emergency kits.

Here we have the Wasatch Fault. Eastern most edge of the fault block system of mountains and valleys caused by large masses of earth grinding past each other at an angle instead of parallell, all part of the same crushing forces highlited by the San Andreas Fault. And we are supposed to have a big one some day as well! 24 hours notice? no way. I wonder what would happen and sometimes contemplate it while driving to/from work, some overpasses already look like they are in bad shape. My Geology instructor in school years ago showed us a map of the major fault line, liquifaction potentials, and subsequent amplification factors that he used in determining where it was safest in the valley to buy his home. He also would have nothing to do with buying a home near a mountainside, near the mouth of a draw or canyon, or in any flood plane.

 

[Bent]

I don't care how "desperate" I get, raping rampages and taking pot-shots at cops is NOT going to occur to me as a solution.

I'm curious as to why Jesse Jackson has been so quiet. Maybe it's just a media plot to increase racial tensions, but where are the Asian, Puerto Rican, Cuban, Mexican or white looters?

Enact Marshal law, try the rapists on the spot and then shoot them. The looters? Bullet to the head and leave them lay.

What we are not being shown are the people that putting the needs of others before their own even though the share the same situation. We are also not being reminded of how critically important our right to bear arms is.

 

[wilson]

hi im an American living over sea. can anyone tell me were i can get the real news. I got FOX news and CNN London. somthing of the net?
Just think if this happen in 2...3....4...ect... at the same time?

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

Updates from:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/interdictor/

Thursday, September 1st, 2005
10:46 pm The Real News
The following is the result of an interview I just conducted via cell phone with a New Orleans citizen stranded at the Convention Center. I don't know what you're hearing in the mainstream media or in the press conferences from the city and state officials, but here is the truth:

"Bigfoot" is a bar manager and DJ on Bourbon Street, and is a local personality and icon in the city. He is a lifelong resident of the city, born and raised. He rode out the storm itself in the Iberville Projects because he knew he would be above any flood waters. Here is his story as told to me moments ago. I took notes while he talked and then I asked some questions:


Three days ago, police and national guard troops told citizens to head toward the Crescent City Connection Bridge to await transportation out of the area. The citizens trekked over to the Convention Center and waited for the buses which they were told would take them to Houston or Alabama or somewhere else, out of this area.

It's been 3 days, and the buses have yet to appear.

Although obviously he has no exact count, he estimates more than 10,000 people are packed into and around and outside the convention center still waiting for the buses. They had no food, no water, and no medicine for the last three days, until today, when the National Guard drove over the bridge above them, and tossed out supplies over the side crashing down to the ground below. Much of the supplies were destroyed from the drop. Many people tried to catch the supplies to protect them before they hit the ground. Some offered to walk all the way around up the bridge and bring the supplies down, but any attempt to approach the police or national guard resulted in weapons being aimed at them.

There are many infants and elderly people among them, as well as many people who were injured jumping out of windows to escape flood water and the like -- all of them in dire straights.

Any attempt to flag down police results in being told to get away at gunpoint. Hour after hour they watch buses pass by filled with people from other areas. Tensions are very high, and there has been at least one murder and several fights. 8 or 9 dead people have been stored in a freezer in the area, and 2 of these dead people are kids.

The people are so desperate that they're doing anything they can think of to impress the authorities enough to bring some buses. These things include standing in single file lines with the eldery in front, women and children next; sweeping up the area and cleaning the windows and anything else that would show the people are not barbarians.

The buses never stop.

Before the supplies were pitched off the bridge today, people had to break into buildings in the area to try to find food and water for their families. There was not enough. This spurred many families to break into cars to try to escape the city. There was no police response to the auto thefts until the mob reached the rich area -- Saulet Condos -- once they tried to get cars from there... well then the whole swat teams began showing up with rifles pointed. Snipers got on the roof and told people to get back.

He reports that the conditions are horrendous. Heat, mosquitoes and utter misery. The smell, he says, is "horrific."

He says it's the slowest mandatory evacuation ever, and he wants to know why they were told to go to the Convention Center area in the first place; furthermore, he reports that many of them with cell phones have contacts willing to come rescue them, but people are not being allowed through to pick them up.


I have "Bigfoot"'s phone number and will gladly give it to any city or state official who would like to tell him how everything is under control.

Addendum: Bigfoot just called to report that "they" (the authorities) are cleaning up the dead bodies at the Convention Center right now.

p.s. POS Jessie J has already been stirring the shitpot... Check the backlogs for a day or two ago on that blog for details....

 

[Ramsey]

I'm curious as to why Jesse Jackson has been so quiet. Maybe it's just a media plot to increase racial tensions, but where are the Asian, Puerto Rican, Cuban, Mexican or white looters?

Enact Marshal law, try the rapists on the spot and then shoot them. The looters? Bullet to the head and leave them lay.

What we are not being shown are the people that putting the needs of others before their own even though the share the same situation. We are also not being reminded of how critically important our right to bear arms is.

your foolish to think only black people are looting. the large majority of people down there are probably black due to poverty the area and means of transportation, however there are plenty of white folks doing just the same i guarantee it. just read the livejournal thing someone posted and you'll see. in fact in our paper was a black man who had been rescued and all he had for shoes was rubber bands and a folded up map under each foot. not all are looting and not all looters are black.

 

[XJJPR]

Well I'll go with the cold hard asshole approach here:

The people left down there were people who didn't have the money or car to get out, the majority. There are those who stayed just for the potential looting. There are those that stayed for the fact they wanted to try and save their home, the least amount.

The area that got flooded from this is some of the poorest in the country. Most couldn't start a fire to save their own life. They know nothing of taking care of themselves. Its not like they have jeeps and camping gear to survive with. Most here have more in their jeep to survive than these people have period and that was before the storm. The unemployment rate down there WAS in the 30% range, that is huge! My wife went there often for business and she says she would rather hang in East LA than some of the neighborhoods down there. Lots of these people have no idea how to help themselves.

This IS a on going disaster. There has been lots of help but the trouble area grew so huge so fast NO ONE could have seen ALL this! Not unless DECADES of planning went into it the work years ago. The locals have been wanting to rebuild the levies for decades and kept being shot down for the money. This was a disaster waiting to happen for a very long time according to the civil engineer experts.

Some of the crimes is mind boggling. Why would you be raping and shit when you need food and water, WTF is with that? It is just poor stupid people waiting for whatever they can get.

Now these people need help and are getting it, slow and maybe not all seen up front. But every once and a while a news program will show the lines of people being fed! People being rescued from the water. But man there are a lot of people that need that help. I say lets make sure we look at the good side of this and do what you can to help, not hurt. Money and time are the only things that will help right now. And no matter what most these people are good and deserve the help, but a few need to be shot to make go away, so we can help the good ones.


hinkley

 

[Bent]

your foolish to think only black people are looting. the large majority of people down there are probably black due to poverty the area and means of transportation, however there are plenty of white folks doing just the same i guarantee it. just read the livejournal thing someone posted and you'll see. in fact in our paper was a black man who had been rescued and all he had for shoes was rubber bands and a folded up map under each foot. not all are looting and not all looters are black.

Go back and RE-READ. Try reading ALL the words this time. Focus on words beginning with "M" taken in the context of the entire sentence.

BTW I have been reading the afore mentioned blog. If it is accurate (true) the national guard is going to need to bring plenty of ammo. Maybe some strafing runs in helicopters?

EDIT: Sitting here in sunny SoCal it's easy for me to judge these people. There is little in my life in which to compare with what they are dealing with. When I see the images my heart aches for these people, even those shown for the media's own agenda. Directing anger at them comes easy for me. That seems to be how I am releasing an overwhelming frustration; this immense need and I feel as though I am sitting on my hands. After three days of pictures and video feed, it is staggering to realize that is only the tip of the iceberg and the rest may well be beyond my ability to comprehend.

May God help them all.

TIM