Sky high battery costs, and dropping warranties

[heyhar]

It's all Obama and the EPA's fault.

At least thats what XCM told me.

Prolly is! Gotta get those people in the battery plants working again. Earn back all that stimulus money.

I just had to replace the green top Interstate battery in my '96. Two months shy of five years old. Ouch. I tested it when I came home from work, after it didn't start that morning, sitting now for 24 hours, and it read 11v post to post. A little over 2v cell to cell, except an end cell, which read about half a volt. Out of nowhere, a dead cell? I've been using Interstates for over twenty years, never had one that didn't give a warning when it wanted to be replaced.

This is why you keep a spare XJ...Fired up the '92 and went to work.

I replaced the original Delco green eye battery in my '78 Firebird when it was 18 years old. Still worked fine, too, but it was old, and I just didn't trust it. Never stuck me, though.

 

[hubs97xj]

Thanks, I will contact them tomorrow and find out what the current warranty really is now.

I bought my Duralast in May, and the warranty is 2 year free replacement, 7 year prorated. I can't tell from their website if it's changed, or they're just unclear about the warranties.

 

[old_man]

Check Sam's Club. Their batteries seem to be about 20% lower than the rest.

 

[tbburg]

I see they have (or still show) different warranties, some prorated, some not, interesting!!

Yeah, that's why I paid the extra 20 bucks. It's probably cheap internal construction. Thinner plates and less robust connections to save manufacturing costs. We can still get decent batteries and get a good warranty by buying the hi-line product, just got to pay for it.

I've been running AGM batteries of one stripe or another since I came out to AZ, first an Exide, then a pair of Optimas. Killed the first two through abuse. Got tired of paying the premium for the spill-proof bat. in the DD, especially since I'm not getting the lifespan out of them. Seems most standard lead-acids die out here about every 2 years. Figured I'd go ahead and warranty it out as it starts to go down hill and save the extra hundred bucks.

 

[Ecomike]

Yeah, that's why I paid the extra 20 bucks. It's probably cheap internal construction. Thinner plates and less robust connections to save manufacturing costs. We can still get decent batteries and get a good warranty by buying the hi-line product, just got to pay for it.

I've been running AGM batteries of one stripe or another since I came out to AZ, first an Exide, then a pair of Optimas. Killed the first two through abuse. Got tired of paying the premium for the spill-proof bat. in the DD, especially since I'm not getting the lifespan out of them. Seems most standard lead-acids die out here about every 2 years. Figured I'd go ahead and warranty it out as it starts to go down hill and save the extra hundred bucks.

Are the AGMs used more by the serious off roaders, for safety, fear of damage and spills, or are they more durable when being tossed around, road bumps, rock crawling etc.....? I have yet to figure out what their attraction is?

Never heard of Hi-line?

What kind of "Abuse" in your case killed them?

 

[Ecomike]

Check Sam's Club. Their batteries seem to be about 20% lower than the rest.

How long have you used Sam's Batteries? Is there a best brand there, or just one brand? Would you rate them average, or above average?

I noticed their current online prices are still way lower, so far, than what I am seeing at other places online and in Houston.

As an EE, can you share some of your know how and wisdom with us on how best to keep them alive longer, especially ones that are not used every day?

I once ran across a product the US Army was buying just after the Gulf War that as best as I can recall ran off the battery, but periodically it did something electrically to the plates to keep them from sulfating. Some sort of capacitive charge, discharge, electronic EE wizardry. The army was concerned about rediness, rapid deplyment of the vehicles after the Gulf War, when a large number of stored vehicles had DOA batteries going into the prep for the war. The products only source of power was the battery, and they claimed to be able to keep the stored rig's batteries from sulfating in long term storage. I assume they still had to start and run the rigs periodically, but you and I know how fast a battery that is not used, can sulfate and go down hill to a sudden death.

 

[XJLI]

i only use Deka (east penn) batteries. the one in my 93 lasted the life of my jeep plus a few months after in a buddy's XJ.. so about 4.5 years. that includes a 2.5 hour drive home when my alternator blew out in the middle of the night, countless nights and days playing the radio (and sub) for hours and running angle grinders, drills, and saws off of a power invertor without the motor running... plus i DD'd and beat the crap out of it for most of it's life. never needed a jump.

bought another deka 70 for my 98 last year and i expect the same from it. if you're super against lead acid batts, they make an AGM batt.

http://www.dekabatteries.com/default.aspx?pageid=10

 

[Ecomike]

i only use Deka (east penn) batteries. the one in my 93 lasted the life of my jeep plus a few months after in a buddy's XJ.. so about 4.5 years. that includes a 2.5 hour drive home when my alternator blew out in the middle of the night, countless nights and days playing the radio (and sub) for hours and running angle grinders, drills, and saws off of a power invertor without the motor running... plus i DD'd and beat the crap out of it for most of it's life. never needed a jump.

bought another deka 70 for my 98 last year and i expect the same from it. if you're super against lead acid batts, they make an AGM batt.

http://www.dekabatteries.com/default.aspx?pageid=10

Thanks for the input! I am a little confused by this statement:

"if you're super against lead acid batts, they make an AGM batt". Are you comparing wet to dry, both lead acid, or a non lead acid battery option? I know they make AGM (dry) lead acid batteries, but they are still lead acid.

 

[Ecomike]

I found some interesting info on the tech side of our XJ batteries!

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_restore_and_prolong_lead_acid_batteries

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/corrosion_shedding_and_internal_short

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it

What is sulfation? During use, small sulfate crystals form, but these are normal and are not harmful. During prolonged charge deprivation, however, the amorphous lead sulfate converts to a stable crystalline that deposits on the negative plates. This leads to the development of large crystals, which reduce the battery’s active material that is responsible for high capacity and low resistance. Sulfation also lowers charge acceptance. Sulfation charging will take longer because of elevated internal resistance.

There are two types of sulfation: reversible (or soft sulfation), and permanent (or hard sulfation). If a battery is serviced early, reversible sulfation can often be corrected by applying an overcharge to a fully charged battery in the form of a regulated current of about 200mA. The battery terminal voltage is allowed to rise to between 2.50 and 2.66V/cell (15 and 16V on a 12V mono block) for about 24 hours. Increasing the battery temperature to 50–60°C (122–140°F) further helps in dissolving the crystals. Permanent sulfation sets in when the battery has been in a low state-of-charge for weeks or months. At this stage, no form of restoration is possible.

 

[XJLI]

Thanks for the input! I am a little confused by this statement:

"if you're super against lead acid batts, they make an AGM batt". Are you comparing wet to dry, both lead acid, or a non lead acid battery option? I know they make AGM (dry) lead acid batteries, but they are still lead acid.

i must have confused the terminology. i always called regular batteries lead acid and the optima-esc ones AGM. they make a spillproof "optima-esc" one called the intimidator.

 

[Westernhunter]

Funny thing is.... My 3 yr old Yellow top decided that it would crack and die. I took it to O'Reilly,s and they could not find it in the system. Seems like they were a Checker auto then and the computer records were lost. So we compromised and he gave me 50% off on a replacement yellow top. So I get home and think, I should have had a free replacement, so I dig thru all my receipts and find that I got it 38 months ago. Warranty is 36. I will say nothing
I hope that this one is better. I think it should last longer as this is not a DD. oh well.

JD.

 

[Ecomike]

Funny thing is.... My 3 yr old Yellow top decided that it would crack and die. I took it to O'Reilly,s and they could not find it in the system. Seems like they were a Checker auto then and the computer records were lost. So we compromised and he gave me 50% off on a replacement yellow top. So I get home and think, I should have had a free replacement, so I dig thru all my receipts and find that I got it 38 months ago. Warranty is 36. I will say nothing
I hope that this one is better. I think it should last longer as this is not a DD. oh well.

JD.

That reminds me, the last 1000 CCA battery I replaced ( on my 85 Diesel XJ, Red top AZ battery) was getting aggressively attacked at the brass clamps I use. It was obvious and it continued till I noticed the post turn a little, while cleaning and replacing the clamp. Then I realized it was H2SO4 acid leaking up the post and eating my clamp!!! The battery was not very old, but I still got stuck with a prorated cost to replace it at AZ.

 

[tbburg]

I used the term "hi-line". 'Should have said "high end" or at least properly spelled "high". Sorry about the confusion.

Rock crawlers like AGM batteries mainly because they're spill-proof. If you spend a fair amount of time on your side or lid, they pay for themselves. There's also mounting setups that use the spill-proof feature to mount multiple batteries on their sides.

'Not sure if AGM batteries are tougher then conventional "wet" lead-acid batteries. They should be more vibration-proof simply because of plate construction(better support) In my own experience AGM batteries are more susceptible to complete failure when subject to discharge abused.(run dead)

 

[Crusher16]

I just put an Energizer battery in my XJ a few weeks ago when my alternator died.

Had an interstate battery from Sam's Club before so they pro rated the new energizer battery. I think that the energizer battery is basically a rebadged interstate battery, but I'm not entirely sure.

 

[Ecomike]

I used the term "hi-line". 'Should have said "high end" or at least properly spelled "high". Sorry about the confusion.

Rock crawlers like AGM batteries mainly because they're spill-proof. If you spend a fair amount of time on your side or lid, they pay for themselves. There's also mounting setups that use the spill-proof feature to mount multiple batteries on their sides.

'Not sure if AGM batteries are tougher then conventional "wet" lead-acid batteries. They should be more vibration-proof simply because of plate construction(better support) In my own experience AGM batteries are more susceptible to complete failure when subject to discharge abused.(run dead)

Thanks!

I had wondered about that. Now the AGM craze, if you will make mores a WHOLE LOT more sense to me. I am not an off road person, and my daughter has not gotten into the off road stuff yet eyes, but she has busted up one wet acid battery on a city street in just her first 2 weeks of driving, and it does make a nasty mess.

 

[MaxxXJ]

Thanks!

I had wondered about that. Now the AGM craze, if you will make mores a WHOLE LOT more sense to me. I am not an off road person, and my daughter has not gotten into the off road stuff yet eyes, but she has busted up one wet acid battery on a city street in just her first 2 weeks of driving, and it does make a nasty mess.

Look don't even have a battery hold down brace on mine and I rock crawl, amateur jeep speed and (cross my fingers) I have had no issues so far

 

[WB9YZU]

Nothing holds your battery in place?

That don't sound Kosher.

-Ron

 

[Ecomike]

Nothing holds your battery in place?

That don't sound Kosher.

-Ron

Actually gravity holds it in place, LOL.

I must have been interrupted when I made my last post, that sentence should have read:

Now the AGM craze makes a WHOLE LOT more sense to me.

 

[xcm]

To sum up why I personally run an optima... To not have to think about a god damn battery, or even read any of the links below. My Optima has never let me down, I know others would dissagree.

Im not here saying 'get an optima', just trying to help explain.

I found some interesting info on the tech side of our XJ batteries!

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_restore_and_prolong_lead_acid_batteries

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/corrosion_shedding_and_internal_short

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it

 

[xcm]

Btw, that whole 'gravity holds it down', doesnt work. I dunno how yours hasnt met the mechanical fan yet, and im not gonna say your lieing, but ive broken battery mounts, and instantly been able to tell what was going on when the battery hit the fan.