Another overland/crawler build

[ruthlessone3k]

Hi guys, new here, but been a jeeper for a few years, already have a YJ and a JKU, just got my first XJ, a 2000 XJ Sport with a 98' engine and an automatic transmission.

My plan for it is an overlanding rig and rock crawler combo. Originally I had planned on just building it into a full V8 trail rig, but now overlanding is in the plans.

I'm postponing an LS swap for now, due to time constraints (I'm also building a house), and I'm not sure turning 40's with the 4.0 and an automatic is going to work. What size tires and gearing would you suggest for a crawler that still has to drive on the highway? Would 37's work or would 35's be better suited to the powertrain?

I'm picking up one tons on Monday, a Dana "super" 60 and a sterling. They currently have 3.73 gears in them, so regearing will probably be necessary. I'm ok with getting an atlas t-case or similar, if necessary.

This brings me to my suspension. I need to build it for my axles and my rear springs are already shot. I'm thinking 4-link in the front and maybe 63" leafs in the rear for now. Not really wanting to move the gas tank for a stretch yet. I'm open to suggestions though.

Also planning on replacing the rockers with 2x6 or 2x8(2x4+2x4)box steel sliders, and of course frame stiffeners. Any advice on frame stiffeners would be greatly appreciated. I'll be ordering those as soon as I figure out which ones are currently the best option.

Thanks.

 

[smokeyyank]

If you want an overland rig a lot of what you've outlined is beyond overkill. For a crawler you're on track but if you want an overland rig. 33s, build up the stock axles a bit, get some other things done and go.

For tons, 37s at a minimum. Gearing you'll probably be 5.13s or 5.38s. Or if you're going to go to the Atlas route probably get away with 488. You can get 63-in springs to fit but you're probably going to have to French them in up front and figure out something for the rear because those are huge springs compared to stock. If you aren't wanting to put a 4 link in the rear consider bastard pack springs with a shackle relocation box.

Plenty have used a stock engine a tranny for 40s+ lot of it depends how heavy of a pig you're trying to make.

As for stiffeners hooligan off-road make some really nice ones. Other option is iron Rock.

 

[ruthlessone3k]

If you want an overland rig a lot of what you've outlined is beyond overkill. For a crawler you're on track but if you want an overland rig. 33s, build up the stock axles a bit, get some other things done and go.

For tons, 37s at a minimum. Gearing you'll probably be 5.13s or 5.38s. Or if you're going to go to the Atlas route probably get away with 488. You can get 63-in springs to fit but you're probably going to have to French them in up front and figure out something for the rear because those are huge springs compared to stock. If you aren't wanting to put a 4 link in the rear consider bastard pack springs with a shackle relocation box.

Plenty have used a stock engine a tranny for 40s+ lot of it depends how heavy of a pig you're trying to make.

As for stiffeners hooligan off-road make some really nice ones. Other option is iron Rock.

Thanks for the info

It's a combo rig, it's going to be used for both. I realize that it will mean compromises must be made, but that's a price I'm willing to pay.

I'll look into the 5.13 gears some more. I was considering 4.88 or even 4.56 gears because of the highway driving while overlanding, but if 5.13 produces a well balanced machine, I'll definitely consider it.

37s seems to be the goldilocks zone for my build. I've heard that suggestion a lot, along with 35s and a few people suggested 33s, which isn't really a consideration of mine. I originally wanted 40s, but the nature of 40s on a 6cyl rig at highway speeds is questionable. Those will probably be after an LS swap. If I can find some 37s that don't weigh too much it would probably be ideal.

Speaking of weight, she's probably going to be a big girl. One tons, plating, bumpers, and sliders are going to add up. Maybe I'll look at upgrading the cooling system.

The 4-link rear is an option I may consider, but for now, can you elaborate on the bastard pack and relocation box???

I've seen the iron rock stiffeners, I'll check out the hooligans.

Thanks again.

 

[75SV1]

I have Hooligan and IRO's. I checked IRO's website recently. I also see the 10ga for the front and rear. I thought they had a choice. I wanted a 3/16 for the rear of my next build. I have Hooligans for the middle and the front. I'm going to try the Ares (3/16) rear. More to see what their quality is. I went Hooligan rear, IRO middle and Ruffstuff front on my last build. I do have a set of IRO rear 10ga I was going to use. My build level tilts to 3/16.

 

[SlowXj]

Maybe a hp44 and a 9inch for 37s? Should be considerably lighter than tons....

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[ruthlessone3k]

I'm not too familiar with the HP44, the guy I'm getting the tons from also has an HP44 and a D60 rear set he is selling. Is this strong enough? I've kinda been nicknamed "skinny peddle"

 

[SlowXj]

Depends... ppl make 37s work on a dana 30....
Ppl break 60s on 35s....

I feel like jk 44s and ford hp44/9 are a great choice for 37s as they are much lighter... the xj needs some structure help for tons and 40s imho...

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[smokeyyank]

I'm not too familiar with the HP44, the guy I'm getting the tons from also has an HP44 and a D60 rear set he is selling. Is this strong enough? I've kinda been nicknamed "skinny peddle"

HP44 is a great axle for up to 37's. It's what I'm putting on my WJ when I get to that point of my build. Ton's while tough AF are just heavy AF. If you can find the snowfighter axle those are the unicorns as they have thicker tubes and you can put D60 outers. Downside is they aren't cheaper to build and strength wise tons will always win, but weight savings is the big bonus. If you plan to go to 40's just build the tons.

4.56s would be way too shallow. You can use www.grimmjepper.com to help. 5.13's should get you back close to stock gearing.

For the bastard pack a google search will get you what you need. Basically using s10 leafs with some XJ ones to make a slightly lifted spring.

Here's the boxes
https://ironman4x4fab.com/collections/jeep-cherokee-84-01/products/xj-shackle-relocation-brackets

 

[smokeyyank]

since we can't edit.....

www.grimmjeeper.com

 

[ruthlessone3k]

HP44 is a great axle for up to 37's. It's what I'm putting on my WJ when I get to that point of my build. Ton's while tough AF are just heavy AF. If you can find the snowfighter axle those are the unicorns as they have thicker tubes and you can put D60 outers. Downside is they aren't cheaper to build and strength wise tons will always win, but weight savings is the big bonus. If you plan to go to 40's just build the tons.

4.56s would be way too shallow. You can use www.grimmjepper.com to help. 5.13's should get you back close to stock gearing.

Well, I went with the HP D44 and D60 combo. It already has a lunchbox in the back and welded in the front. 5.13 gears, and high steer knuckles. They need cleaning and gone over, probably a brake job, but I'm happy.

 

[SlowXj]

Not to be forward but what is a combo like that going for now?

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[XJlimitedx99]

Well, I went with the HP D44 and D60 combo. It already has a lunchbox in the back and welded in the front. 5.13 gears, and high steer knuckles. They need cleaning and gone over, probably a brake job, but I'm happy.

What Dana 44 is it? Already set up with brackets? Do you know about the whole deal with the OEM radius arm wedges?

 

[ruthlessone3k]

What Dana 44 is it? Already set up with brackets? Do you know about the whole deal with the OEM radius arm wedges?

I'm no expert on the topic, but it is a high pinion and from what I have been told It was out of a 78 or 79 F-250. I'm going to try to get them cleaned up today. I'll try to get more info

 

[DocTremp]

If the Dana 60 is matched to the front Dana 44, you might want to check the axle shaft spline count. Some of the older Dana 60s had 16-19 spline axle shafts, and now might be a good time to swap to a carrier with shafts that have a higher spline count.


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[ruthlessone3k]

Not to be forward but what is a combo like that going for now?

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I paid a grand for mine. I don't know if I got a deal or ripped off, but it's already got the gears I want, a locker, High steering knuckles, disc brake conversion, and the 44 came with a spare carrier and install kit, in case I want to get rid of the welded diff. So deal or not, it works for me and I'm pretty happy, because it's going to save me time and fighting supply chain issues.

 

[ruthlessone3k]

Do you know about the whole deal with the OEM radius arm wedges?

Never heard of them

 

[ruthlessone3k]

If the Dana 60 is matched to the front Dana 44, you might want to check the axle shaft spline count. Some of the older Dana 60s had 16-19 spline axle shafts, and now might be a good time to swap to a carrier with shafts that have a higher spline count.


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[ruthlessone3k]

If the Dana 60 is matched to the front Dana 44, you might want to check the axle shaft spline count. Some of the older Dana 60s had 16-19 spline axle shafts, and now might be a good time to swap to a carrier with shafts that have a higher spline count.


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Thanks, I'll be sure to check that out.

 

[smokeyyank]

Never heard of them

Some of the HP44 had cast wedges you can't remove without retubing the axle. So short of running a radius arm or retubing it can't really use them. 1k is a pretty solid deal.

 

[DocTremp]

$1k is a solid deal, especially if you got gears and hi steer with rear disc brake swapped. If you Dana 44 is from a 78-79 f250 you don’t have to worry about the cast vs welded wedges, because it came from a truck with leaf springs. The wedges Dana 44s with wedges were out of f150s from 78-79.


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