A few years back when I installed a D44 and converted it to discs and ABS, I used the ZJ tone rings and the ZJ rear brake parts. They fit great. This is what they look like. http://members.cox.net/nraok/rhabs.jpg
Sweet, thanks for sharing the pic! So just to get the story straight for anyone wishing to follow your lead... XJ D44, XJ axle shafts machined to accept tone rings, ZJ tone rings machined to fit the XJ shafts, and ZJ sensors installed as part of the ZJ disk conversion?
If not, please correct me. Thanks!
Sweet, thanks for sharing the pic! So just to get the story straight for anyone wishing to follow your lead... XJ D44, XJ axle shafts machined to accept tone rings, ZJ tone rings machined to fit the XJ shafts, and ZJ sensors installed as part of the ZJ disk conversion?
If not, please correct me. Thanks!
You are correct on all counts. The shaft area was basically cleaned up on the lathe, measured and the tone ring diameter was opened up to match with .001" interference fit, I used a PVC pipe to install the rings on the shafts.
One thing I regret in this operation is that I tried to keep the Dana 44 axle factory and modify the small parts to fit it. I consider that a mistake because the axle flange is steel while the ZJ brackets are steel castings that become impossible to drill when welded because welding steel castings turns them diamond hard. If I had to do it again I would have welded the axle flange and drilled it to match the brackets. Assuming that I am right that the axle flanges are regular steel, I have not tested this.
Another point, the D44 pinion sticks out farther forward than the D35. That means that the rear propeller shaft is forced farther in to the transfer case. To avoid that I used a propeller shaft from 97-01 XJ with 8.25" rear for a perfect fit.
Off topic for a moment, the front axle knuckles get wear spots from the front disc brake pads. If that wear gets filled with weld, because they are cast steel, they will be so hard that will resist further wear.
Another point, the D44 pinion sticks out farther forward than the D35. That means that the rear propeller shaft is forced farther in to the transfer case. To avoid that I used a propeller shaft from 96-01 XJ with 8.25" rear for a perfect fit.
Minor correction... transfer case output shaft design change was in 96. I learned through experience also that a 95-down style rear shaft and a 96-up style rear shaft differ in length by a significant amount, several inches, with all other drivetrain specs (axle, transfer case, transmission, engine) constant.
Off topic for a moment, the front axle knuckles get wear spots from the front disc brake pads. If that wear gets filled with weld, because they are cast steel, they will be so hard that will resist further wear.
Thanks for sharing the pics tomcat! Do the ZJ sensors or mounts have to be modified to work, or do they just bolt right up to the ZJ brake bracket once you notch the flange? Also, I know the diameter is different, but are your tone rings located in the same position on the axle shaft as the tone rings in my drum brake set up? Just wondering how involved it would be should I decide to switch to discs in the future.
So far as the ABS portion of the project goes, this looks to be a heck of a lot simpler than trying to rework the sensor mounting brackets like I did for my drum brakes. No worrying about the sensor meeting the tone ring at the proper angle, if I'm understanding what you did correctly...
Thanks for sharing the pics tomcat! Do the ZJ sensors or mounts have to be modified to work, or do they just bolt right up to the ZJ brake bracket once you notch the flange? Also, I know the diameter is different, but are your tone rings located in the same position on the axle shaft as the tone rings in my drum brake set up? Just wondering how involved it would be should I decide to switch to discs in the future.
So far as the ABS portion of the project goes, this looks to be a heck of a lot simpler than trying to rework the sensor mounting brackets like I did for my drum brakes. No worrying about the sensor meeting the tone ring at the proper angle, if I'm understanding what you did correctly...
i used zj D35 tone rings, and they were the same as the XJ tone rings. i had two pair side-by side. had the tone ring milled out, and then ground down the axleshaft. heated up the tone ring and sent it home.
sensor mounts do not have to be modified at all, they bolt right up after you notch the flange. i don't have the measurement on the spacing on the rings at the moment, that was done a long time ago. since the zj sensors mount from the outside of the backing plate, if you don't get the tone rings far enough down, you can just space the sensor back with a washer if you need. you just need to clear the bearing retainer and bolts.
i used zj D35 tone rings, and they were the same as the XJ tone rings. i had two pair side-by side. had the tone ring milled out, and then ground down the axleshaft. heated up the tone ring and sent it home.
I don't recall exactly which thread I got these pictures from, but they are supposed to be of XJ and ZJ tone rings. It shows both of them mounted up on the same set of shafts. They are where I got the idea that the diameters were different between the two.
XJ tone rings mounted:
ZJ tone tings mounted:
While the center bore appears to be the same, the size and shape of the tone rings look to be completely different. Judging by the bigger gaps between the teeth on the bigger rings, I'm guessing the tooth count is the same on both of them. I'm 99% sure the smaller ones are XJ tone rings, are the larger ones not ZJ tone rings?
While the center bore appears to be the same, the size and shape of the tone rings look to be completely different. Judging by the bigger gaps between the teeth on the bigger rings, I'm guessing the tooth count is the same on both of them. I'm 99% sure the smaller ones are XJ tone rings, are the larger ones not ZJ tone rings?
The larger ones are the ZJ Disc brake tone rings. The tooth count is the same which is what is important when making them work on the XJ ABS. The ZJ and XJ drum tone rings are the same size, but the discs ones are not. It is true that the ID is the same.
Thanks for the clarification. I guess it makes sense that the important variable is not which model you have (XJ vs. ZJ) but rather the type of brakes you have. Good to know also that the ID's and the tooth count are the same. Appreciate the info...
does anyone have measurements of the xj dana 44 retainer plate? I am trying to make a new one to include the "spacer" everyone uses but as one piece. I could i guess take them off but right now I have been crazy busy wth getting our house ready (the wife and i and expecting) and well the only "down time" i seem to get is at work LOL!!
with that said i am a Machinist with access to a HAAS CNC Mill and Lathe as well as a fully equiped welding shop so fabrication is the easy part. i was hoping someone had the numbers already as i dont know when i will be able to pull the shafts from the d44.
oh I guess the back story would help, i have a D44 out of a 87xj (got it at the local junkyard for $100!) and i have the brackets, etc off a 95 ZJ with discs. i have bored the brackets and splash guards out. the next step is the retainer plate. Then when i get taxes back geting the Super 44/30 kits from Superior, machine down the shaft for ABS tone rings. looking to end goal of super 30/44 with 4.10 or 4.56 gears ARB lockers going into a 4.5 lift from Rough Country, Advanced Adapter SYE and tom Woods Driveshaft... that is the plan in a nut shell with custom bumpers and trail armor along the way.
i can just use the old one too, but either way you need a spacer to make up the gap between the disc and drum setup, i know people have done the TJ unlimited/rubicon retainer they do have a dana 44 with disc with abs. but those i believe need to be drilled a differeant hole pattern. but for 8 bucks a pop can you beat it?
Not sure if it works into your timeline, but the Super 44 kit you're looking to buy comes with both disc and drum retaining plates. They were both (unfortunately for me) drilled out to fit the TJ axle even though the kit I ordered was supposed to be for my XJ.
That is great to know, as I will be redrilling the axle ends to match the d35/tj44 for the disc brakets. And I am in no rush I guess I mean the axle I have under it is in good shape, I just got a steal on the 44 so why not do it right?
1. What is the ID, OD, thickness, and tooth count for the ZJ ring.
2. What is the ID, OD, thickness, and tooth count for the XJ ring.
I'm trying to add ABS to a Dana 44 front axle (GM outers), and I'm looking for some rings that might be the right size. I plan to turn the hubs on a lathe, so I can press the tone rings on the very inboard edge of them. I can mill the ID of the ring to whatever I need...I just need some rings with enough material to do what I'm planning. Looking for around 55 teeth...to be pressed on a 3.60" hub. Any info would be appreciated.
I have the zj rings at my shop I can measure them tomorrow, but if you are usuing the xj abs system I would figure a way to use zj/xj rings or the exact number of teeth. And if you have the ability to modify the ring do you have the ability to manufacture new ones? Make the blank on the lathe put it on an arbor set in on an indexing head and use the mill to make a gear. I would have it pasivated, you may have to send it off but it does matter to protect the metal. Sorry I may have over "machinisted" it.
Bringing this thread back for some more win. I'm in the middle of this project and have a few questions pop up.
First things first. To anyone thinking about taking on this project, it's really not as complex as it might look throughout this thread. A quick browse might lead you to believe that your rig will be down for days/weeks/months while you mate the rings to the shaft and put together the 44. Not so. I had the axles out of my 35, both rings pressed off, and the axles re-installed in about 2 hours total. I had access to a torch and a press, which made things a breeze. But this could easily be done at home with a little ingenuity and backyard engineering. Heating the rings with the torch caused a loud "POP", and then they slid right off. The press really wasn't even necessary. Obviously, I now have an ABS light on until I get the 44 finished, but I'll live with that.
OP, you said you had the shafts machined to 1.895" for the tone ring seat. Any reason why you took it down so close to the seal surface diameter? That only leaves .010" on each side of the shaft. The step from the seal surface to the original cast surface looks pretty big. I would think you'd want to get it machined true, while leaving as much thickness there as possible. I threw some calipers on it, and it looked like 2.10"+/-. Taking down to 2.000 looks like it would be enough. I'll know next week when I take it in to the lathe.
My seal surface also has a groove in one of the shafts so I'll be throwing a Speedi-Sleeve on it to cover the groove. I'll post up some pics when I get the shafts machined.
