souske
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- The land of competition
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Team NAXJA/Petty Cash Racing stock class KOH XJ build
- Thread starter Goatman
- Start date
- Location
- Torrance, CA
Shoulda told us a while ago. 2 of the 3 have been born already. party1:
- Location
- San Diego
as long as you can get them to be vibration free and work properly throughout the whole range of travel.
YJs had standard yokes at both ends of the front driveshaft from the factory. not a lot of travel though.
are the double Cardans a problem?
- Location
- In a strange land
They aren't a problem, they're just expensive.
Its the difference in $180 in driveshafts for KOH or $750 in driveshafts for KOH.
Ronbo
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- San Marcos, CA
I'm not sure what's in that $750 driveshaft, but I'd call these guys.
http://www.adamsdriveshaftoffroad.c...-rear-1310-cv-driveshaft-extreme-duty-series/
http://www.adamsdriveshaftoffroad.c...-rear-1310-cv-driveshaft-extreme-duty-series/
We only use the best in the business, for good reason. That thing you just posted has a .083 wall tube. The shaft we run are more expensive because they require a lot of special machining because they have a .375 wall thickness. Also cal (posting from my computer) was talking about more than one shaft.
- Location
- Hammertown, USA
Yeah sorry, thats a pair of high end shafts and shipping.
Although there are $750 driveshafts out there, too rich for my blood
Although there are $750 driveshafts out there, too rich for my blood
- Location
- Virginia City, NV
Who do you guys use for driveshafts?
I have adams driveshafts now. I only have two runs on them though. They are deffinately an upgrade from stock. But i tend to be hard on stuff.
I have adams driveshafts now. I only have two runs on them though. They are deffinately an upgrade from stock. But i tend to be hard on stuff.
They may be an upgrade from stock, but for the kind of stuff we do a .083 thick tube just won't hold up.
I'm not sure who built the original shafts for 4643, but the next ones will be coming from JEReel. I've been working with them since I started with the RedBull team in 2004 and have never had a driveline failure. Not one, including on the RedBull competition crawlers. I was actually joking with Cal yesterday about how when we're out on the trail everyone is always nervous about hitting their shafts on a rock. Since from the very beginning I've always run super high end shafts this simply has never been a concern of mine. I flat out have never given a single thought to my driveshafts, even with a low pinion rear and doing most of my wheeling at the hammers. When your driveshaft is as thick as your axle tubes it just isn't a thing you worry about.
I'm not sure who built the original shafts for 4643, but the next ones will be coming from JEReel. I've been working with them since I started with the RedBull team in 2004 and have never had a driveline failure. Not one, including on the RedBull competition crawlers. I was actually joking with Cal yesterday about how when we're out on the trail everyone is always nervous about hitting their shafts on a rock. Since from the very beginning I've always run super high end shafts this simply has never been a concern of mine. I flat out have never given a single thought to my driveshafts, even with a low pinion rear and doing most of my wheeling at the hammers. When your driveshaft is as thick as your axle tubes it just isn't a thing you worry about.
VAhasnoWAVES
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Lake City, Mi
i know of one person running a drive shaft that doesnt have a double cardan joint. maybe its not an issue on an offroad rig or in his application... but i would wonder if you can properly phase the U joints to eliminate the hopping/lurching as they rotate and still keep them happy through (operating angle) the range of motion?
VAhasnoWAVES
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Lake City, Mi
my terminology is off... but this is what i am refering to.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmV4qwLfOMY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmV4qwLfOMY
Coming to the XJ world via years of buggies and other stuff I have always been a little confused by the double cardan rear shafts. They have their place, but it's usually on things with really short rear driveshafts. XJ's don't have a particularly short rear shaft, and most other vehicles of similar dimensions don't run CV's. I've built dozens of vehicles, and had probably a hundred driveshafts made. I have a very solid understanding of the dynamics and design. Very few of those had CV's.
It kinda strikes me as one of those things that someone did way back when, and it worked, so all his friends did the same, and now years later it's just what you do, just because it's what you do. My only theory is that it's because someone discovered that you can swap the rear yoke and use a stock front shaft in back, and then it just ran from there. I'm trying to figure out if there is any reason to do that if you're building everything from scratch though.
It kinda strikes me as one of those things that someone did way back when, and it worked, so all his friends did the same, and now years later it's just what you do, just because it's what you do. My only theory is that it's because someone discovered that you can swap the rear yoke and use a stock front shaft in back, and then it just ran from there. I'm trying to figure out if there is any reason to do that if you're building everything from scratch though.
- Location
- Williams AZ
The only advantage I see from running a double cardan in the rear is that your pinion angle is rotated slightly higher, maybe less than an inch...but that's one inch farther from hitting a rock.
- Location
- San Diego
I could see vibrations being an issue with the standard joint driveshafts.
jeep started using the double cardan in the front of jeeps to help with driveline vibration.
they even moved to rzeppa joints for the JKs to help even more.
people started swapping DCs in when the SYE became a thing to give the driveshaft increased working angle, which is especially helpful with Wronglers.
it also makes it much easier to build a rig since the only angle you have to worry about is pinion angle at the axle, which is much easier adjusted, by the inexperienced first time builder, than at the transfer case.
I think this is more a byproduct of the fact that all the SYE's were primarily developed for wranglers where the short driveline length necessitated a CV. XJ guys bought the SYE because they both have the same transfer case, and since the SYE comes with a CV yoke, they just put on a CV shaft.
Lots and lots of vehicles out there with similar length shafts run single joints without vibrations. As long as you're within the working range of the joints setting it up to not vibrate is not difficult. You just match the angle of the t-case output with the angle of your pinion.
Oh, and just for curiosity sake I just grabbed a stock driveshaft that was sitting in the shop and cut it in half to see how thick they are. It was a rear shaft off a 2000 XJ. Measured .065 wall, so that Adams driveshaft is most definitely an upgrade from stock, just not an incredibly huge one.
The other thing I found interesting was the thick cardboard tube inside the shaft. Not really sure the reason for it, but I have some theories.
The other thing I found interesting was the thick cardboard tube inside the shaft. Not really sure the reason for it, but I have some theories.
- Location
- San Diego
I have no doubt you can set it up to work properly if you set your mind to it.
the average bolt-on builder can't easily adjust the t-case angle to make a single ujoint setup work vibration free up to 80-90mph without compromising clearance and performance. a DC makes it a lot easier.
