Pros and Cons of a D44 spool

[Stick]

I have searched and just can't find a straight answer. Spools are cheaper, thats all I know about them. I do alot of mudding and have to DD my rig in the snow. Would a spool work for me ? :worship:

 

[BrettM]

pros: cheap, strong, simple no moving parts to break

cons: chirping tires on the street, faster tire wear, "pushes" on snowy roads, if in the front axle you can't turn as easily

 

[Phil]

A spool wil be "always on" so there will be no locking or unlocking as you get on or off the gas or turn. I haven't gotten into the snow with mine yet - it's only been in about a week - but so far it seems like I always know exactly what it's going to do.

 

[jabrevaya]

I have searched and just can't find a straight answer. Spools are cheaper, thats all I know about them. I do alot of mudding and have to DD my rig in the snow. Would a spool work for me ? :worship:

If you are using your rig as a daily in snowy conditions, get ready for some wild times. You are going to fishtail, a lot. Now, most guys willl tell you that they have learned to over come this, but why risk it. Also, you will see a big increase in tire wear. There are some great lockers available that would be a better option. But that's just one man's opinion.

 

[REDXJ4FUN]

Here we go again. Unless you have personaly driven a spool in the snow and ice you just don't know. I drove mine all over the place on very icy roads with a spool and it didn't both me one bit it was much more controled than an auto locker. I sold my axles to my best friend and the first time he drove it was in the snow with out 4x4 and his reaction was"it was boreing and uneventful" If you use any little part of you head you can drive it just fine. If it is a true daily driver that you have to drive everyday it might not be the best for you but remember with an auto locker if you are on the gas its a spool so keep that in mind.

 

[Jared]

I'd like to 2nd the idea that automatic lockers (the kind you don't control with a switch) STINK to drive with in most conditions. The sudden unintentional lane changes on the freeway, the bangs, clunks, tire chirps, etc all just stink. I will never again buy an automatic locker in a rear axle - spools are the way to go.

Yeah your tires will chirp in the corners, but they will sometimes with a locker too. Spools are stable, predictable. and as reliable as a chisel. If you ever break an axle shaft, you can still make it home with a spool. ALL HAIL THE SPOOL!!

Jared atriot:

 

[CRASH]

If you ever break an axle shaft, you can still make it home with a spool. ALL HAIL THE SPOOL!!

This statement needs some more thought.

It is true for a full floating axle, but not for any type of semi-floater.....

CRASH

 

[Stick]

I think I may spool the rear and go with something with a switch for the front. Sound like a plan ? ::

 

[Kingfish]

If it is a daily driver, I hope your brother-in-law owns a tire shop.
(This is not from personal experience, just the research I have done.)

 

[Weasel]

lockers and spools are not always the best in snow. We get lots of snow wheeling in MT and last winter my father with open diffs drove right past a XJ the was lcoked up cause the lockers cause him to dig and then he slid into the ditch and got stuck. All depends on the condition of the snow.

Soetimes lockers are great other times you don't want them for snow.

 

[xj_punk]

If it is a daily driver, I hope your brother-in-law owns a tire shop.
(This is not from personal experience, just the research I have done.)

shutup!
that is an idiotic thing to say. spools dominate! and most auto lockers chirp in turns too, unless you drive like a 70 year old... put some more air in the tires and they will be fine.

 

[Weasel]

no it's not a idiotic things to say. Tires can wear faster with a spool, an no one said automatics don't do the same thing.

 

[CRASH]

shutup!
that is an idiotic thing to say. spools dominate! and most auto lockers chirp in turns too, unless you drive like a 70 year old... put some more air in the tires and they will be fine.

Oh my, we have hit a new low.

Bury your head in the sand, quash debate, your way or the highway. Blah, blah, blah.

It's amazing what happens when I ask people why they went me to install a spool or a welded diff. 90% say it is due to economics. If they had a choice, almost all would have gone with a selectable locker. Why do you think that is?

Bottom line: Spools wear tires more quickly than an open diff, a limited slip, a selectable locker, or an auto locker. This statement comes from experience.

Spools are simpler than anything else out there, but the simplicity comes at a cost.

CRASH

 

[woody]

Wondering how many of y'all desktop wheelers actually have driven a vehicle with a spool-or welded rear- on the road? I see one and suspect maybe one more?

I've only put about 25,000 street miles on mine, in two different wheelbase vehicles (119" MJ and 102" XJ - same tires though: 33x12.5" BFG MT) and it isn't the big-bad wolf some fear:
*Yes the rear tires will wear out sooner, as Crash points out... BUT a full spool is approx 1.75 rear tires cheaper than the next expensive full case locker, and approx 3 tires cheaper than an ARB or Electrac. Assuming a $100 mini-spool or a few SMAW stix, and the more-tire-factor increases. If a bit more tire wear is a concern...I don't feel I can answer objectively. I put mine in because it was all I could afford and was regearing at the time. Tire wear was, and will never be a worry of mine in a rig with a 'serious' off-road purpose.

*Yes, a spool can either be a bonus or a hinderance depending on the terrain/road conditions. I've had very limited snow/ice use with my MJ 5 spd, but while out in it, I got onto a safe/deserted strech of paved road and purposely induced 'bad things' in 2WD and 4WD, IMHO it was no more weird than a open diff vehicle IMHO. Just don't be keen on punching the gas in limited-traction situations unless a predictable oversteer reaction is desired, on-road or off.

Also to note, I've never driven a rear locker vehicle on the road, so I don't know Skipper from MaryAnne there. Some claim no foul, others report ill-handling moments. I think if I were in the market for an auto locker, I'd be expecting a bit of 'learning curve' in it's peculiarities, to go along with it's known traction advantages over an open diff.

No argument from me that a selectable is the best of both worlds if it works! If it isn't working, then it's the best (and most expensive) version for of one of the two worlds

Clear as mud yet?

 

[Neil]

I vote NO on the spool. I had a welded rear, so in effect it was a spool. Chuck has an auto locker (lunch box). Chuck bought his tires a few months before me. We drive relatively the same amount. My tires are wasted and his have at least 2/3 of their tread left. Now it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that a spool that is locked all the time will wear tires faster than an automatic locker that is locked “some times”. I hated all of the tire chirping.
On the other hand I loved the traction off road. It was very predictable, on and off road. I never had to guess what it was going to do. After I got used to it I could predict how it would behave in any situation. If my truck was a trail only rig I would go with a spool in the rear and a selectable locker in the front. But sense my rig is a DD I run an open diff now (the welded spiders exploded, (see Big bang theory thread)). This time I will be using an automatic locker or a selectable locker. The money that I wasted on tires (35’s) could have paid for an auto locker.

Neil

 

[BUCKYXJ]

Woody I agree with your statements most of the people that are replying are "well my brothers cousins sisters dad had a spooled rear in 1982 and it broke an axle shaft.

I have been welded rear for about a year now and would never go back. The tire wear is an ok trade off for predictibility.

I love my welded rear.
If you don't know anything about a spool except that it is cheaper then you need to do more research.
Also you will need to get the gears set up after you get a spool. unless you go mini spool.
Search under welded rear the mod section there will be lots of stuff I have about three in there.
DIG IT!

 

[bbaker80]

I went with a spool in mine because I run less than 1000 miles a year on pavement with my Jeep. Now that I have a truck and trailer, that will probably decrease to the distance between Paragon and the campground a few times a year. The spool seems to work great on the trail. Mud, rocks, snow, it seems to be ideal for the wheeling I like. As for driving it on the highway, I can't really give any opinion, as I've only driven it while my car was at the dealer for some body work after my bro ran into it. It wasn't fun, but when you're used to a car on the street I would think that even a Jeep with open diffs wouldn't be that great. My next rig will be spooled in the rear with a selectable locker up front.

 

[Jared]

This statement needs some more thought.

It is true for a full floating axle, but not for any type of semi-floater.....

CRASH

Wouldn't a semi floater like a Ford 9" still make it home? It is my understanding that the pressed on wheel bearing is what holds the axle in. So, even if the axle broke somewhere within, it would still be attached. Does a broken axleshaft let the hub wobble and work loose or something?

Obviously, you are correct about c-clip axles though. My bad.

Jared

 

[woody]

Wouldn't a semi floater like a Ford 9" still make it home? It is my understanding that the pressed on wheel bearing is what holds the axle in. So, even if the axle broke somewhere within, it would still be attached. Does a broken axleshaft let the hub wobble and work loose or something?

Obviously, you are correct about c-clip axles though. My bad.

Jared

I am pretty sure on semifloat axles that the corner's weight is carried by both bearings...if the semifloat shaft breaks, all the load goes to the outer bearing & it's retention system... bad things start happening when it sees much more use.

Neil, dont take my views the wrong way... I didn't say "I'll never buy an auto-locker and no one else should either..." I have nothing against an auto locker, and there is little doubt that I'll use one in the rear of a DP rig one day. My DD XJ has a limited slip and would probably wheel better than my beater trail-rig did during it's lone "open diff" season.

Like most other modifications, this one boils down to priorities, expectations, and budget.

 

[Ed A. Stevens]

Does a broken axleshaft let the hub wobble and work loose or something?

Jared

Yes, unless it is a full floater axle design with the hub attached to the housing independent of the axle shaft.

In my most extensive truck experience with a spool it eliminated the one bad habit of an auto locker, the tail wag from axle steer when it unlocks as the throttle is modulated on and off. It also presented a new bad habit in that it failed to release stress when getting off the throttle in rocks, the good habit of an auto locker when it releases and bangs (lots of noise, but no breakage).

The spool was great in sand washes and mud, better than the locker. It was less effective than a locker in the rocks, with more resulting carnage. The tire wear was poor (35x12.5 AT's in 10,000 miles). The spool was hard to learn safe throttle and brake control in off camber situations (it slid around a lot). In snow it was more fun with chains than without. The spool eventually took out an axle in an easy rock climb (too much prior abuse).

This spool experience was in a F150 truck set up as a 2WD Prerunner, and 35 spline semi-float axles. Other experience in various drag cars was less of a problem (although the wear on 14x31 drag slicks driven on the street was expensive, and 28 spline 9" axles are risky).

If the rocks are slick (the muddy and wet trails of eastern USA) the spool can be an inexpensive alternative, but in the western dry desert it is not as good as an automatic (un)locker (IMO).