Partnership for Johnson Valley

[Paul S]

Remi pretty much summed it up. I have just a few things to add.

There were a lot of unanswered questions in the meeting, or at the very least the answers given were awfully ambiguous, so a lot of what you will hear of the meeting might seem equally vague. Sorry.

Going into the meeting I was suspicious of Harry & Ed’s (PFJV) intentions. Rumors brought on by their secrecy over the past 6 weeks didn’t do them any favors. # 1 on the list was whether or not they were conspiring against us & offering the Hammers in trade for what they thought was more important real estate. After much questioning they put this to bed to my satisfaction. They said they absolutely never offered any kind of deal or trade & they would not do so.

As Richard noted, PFJV is not the same as FOJV. FOJV has been around for some time now (not sure exactly when it was formed). PFJV was formed on (I believe) May 4th.

FOJV will meet a week from Wed. at 7m in Colton. This will be a casual meeting at a pizza joint, all are invited. I don't expect PFJV to attend.

PFJV will meet with a few volunteers from today on July 2nd to strategize & hopefully figure out who is who & what is what.

The Marines have asked for a meeting on July 10th. It’s open, although somewhat limited due to space. I think everyone in today’s meeting confirmed they’d be there. We do not know what is on the Marines agenda.

As far as allocations of funds go, at this time it’s impossible to say.

Remi did an excellent job as spokesman. Thanks Remi…

Paul

 

[Kejtar]

FOJV will meet a week from Wed. at 7m in Colton. This will be a casual meeting at a pizza joint, all are invited. I don't expect PFJV to attend.

Damn, I can't go
edit.. week from Wednesday? Looks like I can go... I just have to figure out where the hell Colton is!

Remi did an excellent job as spokesman. Thanks Remi…

You're welcome and thanks

 

[karstic]

Personally, this is the organization to support as we know who they are and how they will act.

Is this posted up somewhere publicly? Do they have a mission statement, purpose, organization in place, website?

 

[Maz]

they seem to have no internal structure, no accountability and no clearly defined decison making process.

(FYI: the interest groups vary from recreational offroad trhoguh racing through motorcycles, geological groups, rocket launching organizations, geocachers, petroglyph/indian heritage/history researchers to campers as well as businesses dependent on activities that I just listed).

the organization seems to be suffering a bit from a reactionary mode as they were more concerned with reacting to what the Marine Corps did or requested rather then looking at now and future at the same time (future amongst other things is lobbying our political reps for this issue before it gets to the point of being presented in DC for approval).

they need buy in and support from other groups so that there is a concentrated and coordinated effort from all affected communities instead of multiple voices buzzing in the ear of the Marine Corps.

IMHO, it sounds like professional help in organizing, leadership, and lobbying is needed. Best intentions without the right skills, experience, and connections won't cut it.

 

[FordGuy]

I thought they we going to team up with CORVA?. If they do it will help a lot. CORVA did a great job in the fight at Glamis, if it was not for the Legal work there, the dunes would have become half of what they are today.

 

[jjmat3]

Where/how can those not able to attend these meetings voice their opinions, thoughts & ideas on the issues?

 

[FordGuy]

Where/how can those not able to attend these meetings voice their opinions, thoughts & ideas on the issues?

I have not had time to read though all of it but go to the Corva web site, there is a lot of info on Johnson Valley

http://www.corva.org/Latest_issues.html

 

[Goatman]

IMHO, it sounds like professional help in organizing, leadership, and lobbying is needed. Best intentions without the right skills, experience, and connections won't cut it.

Just so you know, the four guys that have started Patnership for Johnson Valley are well known, very experienced people in fighting and dealing with land use issues, and it is very likely that they will be properly organized as they proceed. Currently, they have loosely organized under another legal trail organization so that they can recieve tax deductible contributions. The concern of others is that these four guys will work openly and fairly with the other groups, and represent and negotiate based on our viewpoints. Time will tell, and us making sure they hear what we have to say.

Friends of Johnson Valley is a grass roots organization made up of trail users. Most likely FOJV will be a group representerd by PFJV, just like PFJV will represent all of the other groups that use JV, like Corva, District 37, the rocket guys, Friends of Giant Rock, etc, etc.

 

[Maz]

I have attended today a meeting that they held where they shared a powerpoint presentation that they have created for Marine Corps (per their request) that showed the economic and recreational impact of if JV was lost to the public.

Can this Powerpoint presentation be shared with us?



.

 

[Paul S]

Can this Powerpoint presentation be shared with us?



.

There were some strange things at the meeting, non-answers, etc... this was one of them. We asked for copies of the presentation several times & never got a clear answer. First we were told that it could not be released as the overlay maps showing the Marines potential COA were provided by the Marines & PFJV didn't have the right to release them. It was then pointed out that these exact overlay maps are already out there, D37 noted that they are available to all on their website. We then asked for copies of the presentation with the maps removed, but still couldn't get a clear answer. For whatever reason, PFJV didn't want to make it available. This made no sense, as it was an excellent presentation & would be a helpful tool for all parties.

Paul

 

[Paul S]

I received a message from Rick ??? from on my recorder, couldn't pick-up the last name & you didn't leave a number. Give me a call back & I'll give you the lowdown on the meeting.

Paul

 

[Maz]

Just so you know, the four guys that have started Patnership for Johnson Valley are well known, very experienced people in fighting and dealing with land use issues, and it is very likely that they will be properly organized as they proceed. Currently, they have loosely organized under another legal trail organization so that they can recieve tax deductible contributions. The concern of others is that these four guys will work openly and fairly with the other groups, and represent and negotiate based on our viewpoints. Time will tell, and us making sure they hear what we have to say.

Friends of Johnson Valley is a grass roots organization made up of trail users. Most likely FOJV will be a group representerd by PFJV, just like PFJV will represent all of the other groups that use JV, like Corva, District 37, the rocket guys, Friends of Giant Rock, etc, etc.

Thanks for the clarrification. I don't know any of the four guys. My comment was more in general than targeted towards the particular group.

 

[Kejtar]

I received a message from Rick ??? from on my recorder, couldn't pick-up the last name & you didn't leave a number. Give me a call back & I'll give you the lowdown on the meeting.

Paul

PM Rick jumpthis. He's notorious for not leaving a number... heck when he called me one time he didn't even leave his name!

 

[cracker]

Thank you Remi for working on this.

 

[XJ_ranger]

The PfJV has a great goal which is worthy of support BUT as an organization they are not ready for support. Why? Because they seem to have no internal structure, no accountability and no clearly defined decison making process.

...

Multiple times during the meeting today there were quetsions asked that they left unanswered with an excuse "we're working on it".

...

Sounds a lot like an organization that I belong to... and am on the BOD for...

In talking with Cal on the issue, I think that moving forawrd with PfJV as the presentation group taking notes from a 'steering' comitte is the wise move...

I dont think PfJV's lack of any stucture should be that much of a concern - FOVJ has less of a structure, no non-profit status, no real members, and no means of comunication with the marines...

Im not saying that both 'groups' dont have a purpose - just that a lot of the negativity towards PfJV seems un-founded, and praise for FOJV seems equally un-founded... - then again - I wasnt there, and can only get my information from reading, calling, and e-mailing... :wave:

A big thank you to Cal, Remi, Paul, Rick, Gary, and everyone else who attended... I couldnt feasably make it, and it is an issue that does matter to me...

 

[Jump This]

It is my hope that we can organize ourselves in order to help those who will need us as we move forward on this issue.
I have been asked to be the 'go to' guy, representing the SoCal Chapter of on this subject.
As most of you know I live a bit out of the way for making most of these meetings, also you know I try not to work too much so I have more time to make sure things get done.
We have been offered a seat at these meetings, and I fully intend to make sure that seat is filled with one of us as all times.
I will be needing your help, Remi and Cal have offered to make the meetings closer to thier homes and I will be doing the longer haul meetings. There are meetings that will be held in Colton, Barstow, as well as other sites.
Don't hesitate to call me if you have questions, don't hesitate to post up concerns. I will be listening and responding as best as I can.

Rick

 

[FordGuy]

Come on Rick, it's not that far, you can stay in my guest house. 70deg by the beach!

 

[Jump This]

Come on Rick, it's not that far, you can stay in my guest house. 70deg by the beach!

So now you want me to freeze my ass huh?

 

[FordGuy]

So now you want me to freeze my ass huh?

Yea but great scenery!

 

[Jump This]

Something to think about...

As has been pointed out previously, Partnership for Johnson Valley appears to be the leaders in our fight for JV.
As much as we may not agree with everything they do, they have the experience needed to properly represent us. Friends for Johnson Valley, at this point, has no leadership. But that in itself should not prevent us from supporting them.
Here is how I see it:
There are many user groups that need to be represented. Ours is but one. What may best suit us is to have FOJV be our voice to PFJV.
We could very well do this ourselves and I intend to make sure we are there at these meetings as long as it is feasible. There will get to a point when having 40 people (representing the 4X4 community) in a room won't be practical or even possible.
When this happens do we fight to be there ourselves? Or do we designate someone else to be there?
As was evident during the last meeting, our interests can't be served well by spending too much time making sure our own voice is heard (above the din of snivelers and whiners.)

We need to support FOJV as our voice and PFJV for our fight.

After the next Friends of Johnson Valley get together we will know more about the direction they intend to take. If we can not get them to work closely with PFJV then we will need to decide where our support should be.
I talked yesturday with Paul and we have just about the exact same feelings on this matter and I hope that FOJV can find a way to organize and be our point men.
Anyway, I have some calls to make and people to talk to regarding this. I'll do my best to keep all of us informed.

Rick