I missed the news.. True? Did he say this?

[SeansBlueXJ]

I can't believe people on this board are voting for barack obama... It just blows me away.

Why? Is it so hard to belive that a group of people brought together by a common intrest (xj's) can have diffrent views and come from diffrent backgrounds.

While I have noticed that this board tends to have the majority of the members being Republican, last I checked it wasnt a requirement to owning an xj, or wanting to belong to a community of XJ owners.

And before you flame me as an Oboma supporter, I havent decided how I will vote, and while I am not registered as such technically I think like a Libertarian more then anything else and they arent really closer to either party.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_Party_(United_States) atriot:

 

[DrMoab]

Three reasons I will not vote for him

1. I like guns.

2. I like open access to the back country.

3. I like keeping at least half my income.

 

[ZomBrady]

Three reasons I will not vote for him

1. I like guns.

2. I like open access to the back country.

3. I like keeping at least half my income.

Three very good reasons, and that's why I'm writing in Hillary.

 

[DrMoab]

Three very good reasons, and that's why I'm writing in Hillary.

Uh, Nevermind you can't be serious. I guess if you are OK with only keeping 49% of your income but still losing your guns and freedom to explore where you want.

 

[Darky]

So, what about us Christ believing but not wack job religious and not bottom hitting yet born again Christians?

Are we OK?




I always wonder why some are compelled to insult as soon as a religious topic comes up. And the insults can go both ways.

I strongly believe in the Christ of Christianity, and I strongly believe that this country was partially founded on moral principles that were derived from Chritianity, and I strongly believe that our country has always intended to protect anyone's religious freedom. While I would like to think that this is a Christian nation, it certainly is not. Because of the shear volume of church goers in the past, that argument could have been made, but as some have said we are really a free country, free to believe or not to believe in whatever we choose. Of course, I also strongly believe that taxes, attorneys, career politicians, and radical environmentalists are gradually removing our freedoms.

From my own personal perspective, I think Obama's comment is unfortunate, but it certainly is true and I would not take issue with it. Now, that doesn't go for some comments that I've heard his wife has made. They are certainly VERY liberal when it comes to positions on American pride and patriotism......from the impressions I've come to.

He's a smart man. I've often said the same, why is it that if religion is mentioned certain people immediately jump on the Christians are jerks mode while others jump on the damn atheists mode...
Also, much as I think it would be cool to have a Christian nation, I also recognize that this country was founded based on mostly Christian or Deist (belief in God however you want to call it) ideals but was also founded so that the government would have no business telling you what to believe.

 

[ZomBrady]

Uh, Nevermind you can't be serious. I guess if you are OK with only keeping 49% of your income but still losing your guns and freedom to explore where you want.

Yeah, it was a joke.

I bet dollar to donut if Hillary is his VP, he'll be dead with a year. . . .

 

[ZomBrady]

He's a smart man. I've often said the same, why is it that if religion is mentioned certain people immediately jump on the Christians are jerks mode while others jump on the damn atheists mode....

Aw, come on. I've been very well behaved.


All joking aside, this discussion is a generally positive one. It doesn't seem like anyone is trying to force anything down anyone's throat, if you know what I mean.

 

[xj-grin]

He's a smart man. I've often said the same, why is it that if religion is mentioned certain people immediately jump on the Christians are jerks mode while others jump on the damn atheists mode...
Also, much as I think it would be cool to have a Christian nation, I also recognize that this country was founded based on mostly Christian or Deist (belief in God however you want to call it) ideals but was also founded so that the government would have no business telling you what to believe.

my point exactly. All in all, this has to be one of the least hostile online religious discussions I have seen (with a couple exceptions including the OP). Rocks!atriot: :angel: :firedevil

 

[anodyne33]

I can't believe people on this board are voting for barack obama... It just blows me away.

I can't believe that 99% of the arguments I've heard against him are so utterly ludicrous.

He's black... his middle name is Hussein... his grandfather was Muslim...


C'mon people.

 

[GSequoia]

* How did we get here? Were we created, or are we a cosmic accident?

* Is this all that there is? Are we just here to reproduce and die, or is there a higher purpose?

* What happens when we die?

We attempt to answer the un-answerable.

[Deep Voice]And you can find the answers in Dianetics.[/Deep Voice]

 

[GSequoia]

I bet dollar to donut if Hillary is his VP, he'll be dead with a year. . . .

You really think Hillary Duff would do that?

 

[Ray H]

I can't believe that 99% of the arguments I've heard against him are so utterly ludicrous.

He's black... his middle name is Hussein... his grandfather was Muslim...


C'mon people.

I dont think youve heard those arguements on here, at least not 99% of the time.
I think most people here have valid reasons they dont like him and they have stated them.
I dont personally like him because I dont agree with many of his views but also because I dont trust him. That has nothing to do with his color, name or ancestory. I simply dont trust him when he speaks. If I knew nothing else about him he would still sound like a very polished and well dressed used car salesman to me.

On the other hand, as much as I would love to have full confidence in McCain, Im just not sure about that anymore either. Every day he seems to be getting worn out and less sure of himself. Im sure the campaign trail is wearing on him but so will the presidency. While I respect what he has been through and what he has done for this country, Im doubting he has what it takes to lead it right now, but, at least I feel I can trust him so thats a big plus in my book.
I just hope whichever one of them ends up in the whitehouse, they have a really good VP.

 

[SeansBlueXJ]

I can't believe that 99% of the arguments I've heard against him are so utterly ludicrous.

He's black... his middle name is Hussein... his grandfather was Muslim...


C'mon people.

x2, but that's the same set that write the email in the OP (now that we know the OP is was a quote and not the poster's views necessairly)

of course I agree with some of the things Obama says, particualrly on his forigen policy and economy, but then many things he holds scare me too, as per Dr Moab's 3 points. Guns (he wants a ban that would at least double the Clinton era ban and include all semi-automatic weapons), open country, and income taxing.

 

[Darky]

This is something I have yet to get a good answer from anyone who believes in a god. Ok, so god made the earth and everything else, but who made god????? Did he just appear from nothing, because thats impossible.

The answer to your question from a Christian standpoint is that God always was. There was no beginning for Him. I believe its one of the Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) that starts with the verse, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." I know its meaningless to those who don't believe in the Bible, but that's basically the explanation from a Biblical standpoint.

 

[Darky]

Aw, come on. I've been very well behaved.


All joking aside, this discussion is a generally positive one. It doesn't seem like anyone is trying to force anything down anyone's throat, if you know what I mean.

Exactly, nothing directed at you, I was just thinking of past debates where its devolved into name-calling...

 

[Beej]

 

[Ray H]

The answer to your question from a Christian standpoint is that God always was. There was no beginning for Him. I believe its one of the Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) that starts with the verse, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." I know its meaningless to those who don't believe in the Bible, but that's basically the explanation from a Biblical standpoint.

I know that passage but it doesnt make sense to me. "in the beginning" would suggest that there is a beginning, yet to say he "always was" would suggest there is no beginning.
The wall that I have to overcome is my belief that everything has a beginning and an end. Theology or science hasnt answered this for me. Its really the only question I need answered and the rest of my beliefs will fall in line.

 

[red91]

Pass the BONG please...

 

[Darky]

 

[Otter]

agreed Mr. xj-grin, not often you see people debate this topic peacefully and coherently.

seeing our forum here as a cross section of society, i think this discussion shows most people on either side of the "god debate" aren't interested in forcing their views on anyone...we mostly, simply just want to live and let live while trying to squelch the extremists on both sides that try to impenge on everyone's freedom to choose/express in this area.

i'd like to hear opinions on what i see as an exploitation of a "gray area" where the constitution does not have a clear say...the exploitation being Bush's Faith Based Initiative. i take offense that my tax dollars are now being diverted, in a deliberately skewed manner, to favor religious community organizations. in addition, the likely end result of this inculdes the eventual extinction of some secular community charities as they can no longer equally compete for these tax dollars. it smells like a hostile take-over, but more importantly looks like government interferrence in our society's freedom to choose as congress, speaking for the general population at large, refused to pass this initiative.

maybe i'm just an angry agnostic, idk. this is not a Bush bash, i respect the man. what say you all?