Heat wrap on header for stroker?

[Gil BullyKatz]

good idead/bad idea?

Finally going to try to finish the stroker this year...

Just ordered the APN header and was wondering if I should heat wrap the headers like I used to do for my dragbikes...

I'm pretty sure the 4.7 will run hotter than stock...

Just wondering if it's worth it.

 

[CMNCHE]

good idead/bad idea?

Finally going to try to finish the stroker this year...

Just ordered the APN header and was wondering if I should heat wrap the headers like I used to do for my dragbikes...

I'm pretty sure the 4.7 will run hotter than stock...

Just wondering if it's worth it.

Good article on this in the new issue of Four Wheeler Mag. They say if it will see trail time with mud and such...NO because the wrap will hold water and such and rust out the header, they say good on race applications because they only run for a short time and the wrap doesn't get any water or debris in it. Thats just there $.02, but it sounds logical to me.

 

[scoobyxj]

Bad idea on any moter that will be subjected to running in the rain. The wrap will hold in moisture to the header causing it to rust out. It will also create hot spots on the header that could cause burn through. Most of the problems come from just daily driving it (long running times). Most users of wrap will only have there engine running for short peroids, and don't have there street rods, or such in the rain. If you want to try something to help lower under hood temps go with a ceramic coated header.

EDIT:

Good article on this in the new issue of Four Wheeler Mag.

Thats where I got my opinion.

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

makes sense...

Guess I'll try to find the best "high-temp paint"

since a ceramic coating isn't offered for it...

unless....

I can find a place locally that does that sort of thing...

hmmm...

 

[goodburbon]

You really think rusting out stainless headers because of the wrap will be an issue?

 

[2drezq]

If my header ever rusts out, I'll let you know. I wrapped it when I installed my 4.6 Stroker. It seems to me that, as hot as the header gets, the wrap couldn't stay wet for long... I guess I'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Beej]

Gil, these guys do ceramic coatings and they are located in Oak Lawn...

http://www.lo-ko.com/services.html

 

[CMNCHE]

You really think rusting out stainless headers because of the wrap will be an issue?

I am only going by the article, but they said stainless will only prolong this effect.

 

[lilredwagn]

You really think rusting out stainless headers because of the wrap will be an issue?

Might be an issue of temperature weakening the steel in addition to rust. Had read over in JU (I think) about a guy who had an old camaro with wrap. One day while wrenching, dropped a wrench on the header and the header shattered. Course that's third hand info and I'm no metallurgist - but I didn't wrap my $600 Leach header. If it was the APN for a hundred and some change, I probably would have.

 

[Michaelarchangelo]

High temp paint won't work, as it will burn right off.

As far as wrap, Ive heard many diffrent stories. It seems if you go to a ceramic coating site, they say they will promote rust on headers, but if you go to a header wrap site, they say they don't. I believe it has a lot to do with the type of metal used in the makeup. Mild steels will rust quickly with or without a wrap, whereas stainless should be fine with a wrap. Our exhaust manifolds are high enough not to get wet when it rains (unless you run through water) so moisture really isn't an issue.

 

[Beej]

HOur exhaust manifolds are high enough not to get wet when it rains (unless you run through water) so moisture really isn't an issue.

This certainly sounds intuitively correct. I would be surprised if something that hot could retain moisture for longer than a few minutes...

 

[Michaelarchangelo]

If you are really worried that much about a wrap, this seems that this might be a better idea.

 

[POSXJGuy]

when i was racing motorcycles we thought of wrapping the exhaust but it lead to many pipes cracking and not heat cycling like they were made for. i saw quite a few wrapped pipes have catastrophic failure. i dont know how that compares but the temps were abouot the same as our xj's. assuming its a stock motor.

i dont think it has a lot of benefits with the apn headers. i have them as well. anything made in china im gonna try not to tamper too much with. to get it warrantied would be hard : O)

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

If you are really worried that much about a wrap, this seems that this might be a better idea.

Not really too worried about a $125 header only lasting 2-3 years...

My thoughts were if the heat wrap would help keep the underhood/intake manifold temps down a bit...

I remember the heat wrap for my bikes not being cheap...

I'd hate to spend money on a mod that didn't make any difference...

I think I like the idea of that heat shielding more tho..

Jegs huh?

 

[Dr. Dyno]

when i was racing motorcycles we thought of wrapping the exhaust but it lead to many pipes cracking and not heat cycling like they were made for. i saw quite a few wrapped pipes have catastrophic failure.

..and that's why it's a bad idea to wrap the header unless it's only for racing where the durability of a header isn't a real issue.
If you want to reduce underhood heat and reduce the temp. of the intake manifold, just insulate the intake manifold as I did. It really does make a difference:

http://www.angelfire.com/my/fan/manifold.html

 

[tealcherokee]

wrap will kill the header, and its freaking expensive. a buddy of mine bought 2 rolls, at $55 each from advance. it took 1.5 rolls to wrap the I6 header. thats about $80 worth. jet hot is $90 for v6 manifolds down the street from me, so an I6 would prolly be the same or a bit less.

but either way, the wrap WILL kill the metal, stainless or mild

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

Gil, these guys do ceramic coatings and they are located in Oak Lawn...

http://www.lo-ko.com/services.html

Update:

I recceived the APN header yesterday...

called this company today...

$155-170 with a 3yr chip/peel/bleed warranty

turnaround is approx 1 week and according to him..

MAJOR underhood temp reduction...

I never believe what any salesman tells me but he said he's had local hot rod guys claim 70* reductions...

we'll see...

 

[goodburbon]

I'm sorry, i have to weigh in again. If the issue with heatwrap is that it kills the metal by holding the heat in and making the metal brittle, how is a ceramic coating that costs twice as much and does the same thing any better?

I know that there will be increased oxidation with the wrap versus the coating.
Oxidation related failure with a stainless header, even accelerated by extreme heats, would be several years in the future.

That leaves the issue of making the metal brittle. Coating the metal with something, wether it a ceramic or a wrap they both achieve the same aims, keeping the heat inside. If coating doesn't cause the metal to fatigue at an accelerated pace then why would wrap?

As an aside:
All of the rigs that I have worked for offshore wrap the manifolds and even turbos of their generator packs, these are exposed on the deck, covered with salt, and made of cast iron. They still last a few years.

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

I remember the heat wrap on my bike headers still getting pretty hot...

sucked when I crossed a puddle or got caught in the rain...

big friggin cloud of steam!

With my rig being a DD in salt loaded Chicago winters...

I can imagine some of that nasty salt mix seeping into the wrap...

But the reason I'm loking into the ceramics is more about heat dissipation...

Isn't that why hi performance engines sometimes use ceramic lined cylinders?

I'll be happy if I get 3-4 years of use out of it...

but I'll be really happy if it helps scavenge the gases...

this company coats outside AND inside the headers.

 

[MGrobe]

I sent my Banks header to Jet-Hot for the same reason. Can't remember how much I paid, but it seems to be holding up well. I doubt the temperature change was as dramatic as what the salesperson told you. Either way let us know how it turns out as I may have some other items that need coating and having a local place to go to for them would be ideal.