GM 5.3/4L60E/Klune/Stak 300

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Ok, it took way too much time, but I finally got a set of lower control arms built and installed. I welded 1.5" OD x .188 wall DOM tube to Rubicon Express joints then slipped the 1.5" tube into 2"x 0.25 wall DOM. i had to shave a touch off the 1.5" first though as it wouldn't fit inside the 2". In the end it fit, but needed to be pressed in. I ended up at 40.25" for the arms. They might change later, but that seems to be a good start.

One thing to note is how much the tranny pan is offset to the passengers side (even without the actual offset of the tranny/engine placement.) This caused the control arm to come close to the pan at full stuff. I had to locate the mount accordingly. I had to keep the drivers side mount in as far as possible to clear the driveshaft at full droop too. I think where I have them will work. I hope to mount a belly pan between the mounts that extends forward beyond the oil pan bottom end.

Another thing to note is that the driveshaft will not clear the tunnel at full compression and hit the pinion of the axle. It hits the drivers side tunnel by where ones right foot would sit. I think the upper control arm will hit there as well. Figuring out the upper arm is going to be a trick as is fitting a track bar in, building mounts on either end and fitting in the coil over shocks.

Here's the drivers side axle end

Here's the passengers side axle end

Here's the crossmember end

Jeff

 

[whitneyj]

you didn't build any adjustability into your arms?

 

[cracker]

you didn't build any adjustability into your arms?

Adjustability is generally NOT needed when done correctly.

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

The upper arm is adjustable with 1.25" threaded stuff from Ballistic Fab. I didn't want to spend the coin to make the lowers adjustable. They can be adjusted some by sliding the 1.5 into or out of the 2.0 until the two are burned together though. I've got them tacked at 40.25" until I get the upper in and cycle the suspension AND finish the steering etc. Jeff

 

[whitneyj]

Adjustability is generally NOT needed when done correctly.

I understand it's generally not needed, but it's always nice to have the option, especially when making the effort to build yourself.

 

[whitneyj]

The upper arm is adjustable with 1.25" threaded stuff from Ballistic Fab. I didn't want to spend the coin to make the lowers adjustable. They can be adjusted some by sliding the 1.5 into or out of the 2.0 until the two are burned together though. I've got them tacked at 40.25" until I get the upper in and cycle the suspension AND finish the steering etc. Jeff

That makes sense, I assume you're keeping the uppers adjustable for the pinion angle? If you don't mind me asking, why are you building your arms so heavy? I'm absolutely amazed at your build.

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

2.0 x 0.25 DOM lower arms are considered by many to be marginal in strength when it comes to dragging them over big rocks. They can bend. Also, I didn't like the way the 2" fit up to the Rubicon Express joints for welding, but 1.5" fit well. So, I figured I would kill two birds with one stone. Weld the 1.5 to the RE ends and then slip the 1.5 into the 2. It also makes slight length adjustments pretty easy (before welding.) Jeff

 

[cracker]

2.0 x 0.25 DOM lower arms are considered by many to be marginal in strength when it comes to dragging them over big rocks. They can bend. Also, I didn't like the way the 2" fit up to the Rubicon Express joints for welding, but 1.5" fit well. So, I figured I would kill two birds with one stone. Weld the 1.5 to the RE ends and then slip the 1.5 into the 2. It also makes slight length adjustments pretty easy (before welding.) Jeff

Jeff,

Why did you not consider the Heat Treated Chromo stuff like we run? Price is overall not too bad (especially in the long run).

-Avery

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

DOM is easier to source and I just didn't really look into the fancy heat treated chromoly stuff. Maybe I should have? I figure these links will be just fine. What size heat treated stuff do "we" run? Where do you get it? Polyperformance? Jeff

 

[FarmerMatt]

A lot of the "guys" are running Poly's heat treated stuff. It's 1.75" X 188 wall. It seems to hold up well although Goatman's are showing some signs of bending. Dave Taylor is using this stuff as well. I bent my lowers that were just 1.75 X 250 DOM. I bent them back straight & back braced them with channel. They haven't budged since, but they're heavy just like yours will be. That's the only down side, they're heavy... Poly's arms probably weigh a 1/4 of what mine do.

 

[cracker]

X2 on what Matt says. I ran the heat treated stuff on my front for a while with great luck. I have yet to experience the rear on the trail (yet) though.

DOM is easier to source and I just didn't really look into the fancy heat treated chromoly stuff. Maybe I should have? I figure these links will be just fine. What size heat treated stuff do "we" run? Where do you get it? Polyperformance? Jeff

Yeah...Poly Performance.

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

I bought a few bolts to mount the suspension in place. There's a quick $60 gone! Grade 8 fine thread bolts, nuts, and washers from Fastenal. Jeff

 

[cracker]

I bought a few bolts to mount the suspension in place. There's a quick $60 gone! Grade 8 fine thread bolts, nuts, and washers from Fastenal. Jeff

Yup..Bolts suck to buy these days.

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

I've been eyeing up coil over shock placement and have found that I think I'm going to have to offset the axle mounts to the rear of the vehicle a bit to clear engine components! Have a look and see if you agree.

Overall front axle placement

Drivers side coilover placement. I figure it needs to go between the master cylinder and the back of the alternator with enough room to remove the master cylinder without removing the shock. I set of piece of bar steel over the top of the motor in line with the top of the drivers side shock to help locate the top of the shock on the other side. I think a piece of 1.5" tube will fit across the engine here.

Here's a shot comparing the side of the frame to the location of the alternator. The shock will sit further out on top than in this picture.

Here's the passengers side shock sitting in position.

Notice how close the shock body is to the York? Too close. The only way to fix that is to move the axle end mount back. That would also provide increased room for the axle end of the track bar.

Here is a shot or two of how the York sits in comparison to the side of the frame.

Finally, here is the beginning of the frame side track bar mount.

Jeff

 

[RCman]

Looks great, but man those coil overs are gonna be tight when you get coils on them!
If you don't have the coils yet I'd strongly suggest doing what I did and make some mock ones. It took me all of 20mins and I'm sure glad I did before spending all that time fabricating mounts!

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Looks great, but man those coil overs are gonna be tight when you get coils on them!

That's why I posted this post and asked what you all thought of moving the axle end of the coil overs to the rear to make more room for the coil spring.

If you don't have the coils yet I'd strongly suggest doing what I did and make some mock ones. It took me all of 20mins and I'm sure glad I did before spending all that time fabricating mounts!

What did you use to make mock coils? I'm interested! Jeff

 

[RCman]

That's why I posted this post and asked what you all thought of moving the axle end of the coil overs to the rear to make more room for the coil spring.

Maybe it is just me and it is kinda hard to tell from the pictures, but how would you mount them on the axle end? IMO, you really can't move them to far off of the tube without running into issue with stress on the bracket.

What did you use to make mock coils? I'm interested! Jeff

Nothing fancy. A 4" and 2.5" whole saw, some plywood and poster board. 20-30min for the whole setup. It is a little over sized, but that is probably better.
http://naxja.org/forum/showpost.php?p=244156265&postcount=97

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Maybe it is just me and it is kinda hard to tell from the pictures, but how would you mount them on the axle end? IMO, you really can't move them to far off of the tube without running into issue with stress on the bracket.

Nothing fancy. A 4" and 2.5" whole saw, some plywood and poster board. 20-30min for the whole setup. It is a little over sized, but that is probably better.
http://naxja.org/forum/showpost.php?p=244156265&postcount=97

Good idea! I was looking at your thread after posting to mine and couldn't figure out what you had going on there. As for axle end mounts I'm thinking of mounting two plates parallel to the wheel (perpendicular to the axle) with one welded to the inner C and the other welded to the axle tube extending back a bit then two more plates welded to the first two extending up for the shock mount. It would be easy to offset the shock body by an inch or two and still be strong enough. I could use 1/4" or even 3/8" steel if I really needed. Jeff

 

[RCman]

Good idea! I was looking at your thread after posting to mine and couldn't figure out what you had going on there.

Thanks! Did you figure everything out? Was I not clear on something? Sometimes it is hard to get across what I'm thinking as I assume stuff is known that really only I'd know about my particular setup without thinking about it.

As for axle end mounts I'm thinking of mounting two plates parallel to the wheel (perpendicular to the axle) with one welded to the inner C and the other welded to the axle tube extending back a bit then two more plates welded to the first two extending up for the shock mount. It would be easy to offset the shock body by an inch or two and still be strong enough. I could use 1/4" or even 3/8" steel if I really needed. Jeff

That sounds like a good plan to me. I was worrying that you where going to be more than that inch or two to get the clearance you need.

 

[xjbubba]

Jeff, with regard to the placement of the cross-brace for the coil-overs, you mentioned needing room to remove your MC.
Do you have a dual diaphragm booster on there now? I can't tell by the picture. If not, and your brakes suck, the logical upgrade is the dual diaphragm booster, which is significantly longer than the single diaphragm booster.