So obviously I extended one of them to put the springs on... should I compress it before I get it filled? Or leave it alone? Will this one have problems since I already extended it without any nitrogen in it?
Front Coilover Mounting
- Thread starter BADaXJ
- Start date
So obviously I extended one of them to put the springs on... should I compress it before I get it filled? Or leave it alone? Will this one have problems since I already extended it without any nitrogen in it?
PahlMc
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Scripps Ranch (San Diego)
No extension the shaft once probably did nothing. Just done bolt it on and start to cycle your suspension 40 times until you get 40 psi or so in there. If you have a bike pump that works fine.
Ok sounds good. I'll probably do that. The moisture introduced won't be an issue as long as I let the air out and refill with nitrogen when I'm ready? Seems like it might still get trapped in there? I'll stop thinking and go back to playing with steel brackets. I'm too anal for expensive "fragile" things like this :confused1
A tire place that's a bit of a drive from here said they could probably fill them, and they charge $6 a tire so it would probably be pretty cheap. I still need to confirm they can regulate the pressure high enough. The local ATV shop said they do shocks for $25 each, probably charge me even more for these. Any reason not to go with the tire place? I'm assuming nitrogen is nitrogen? Sorry for the dumb questions, but I'm a C/O noob...
Oh and just out of curiosity, how does cycling them and moving the piston eventually lead to blowing the end of the reservoir when you fill them?
Thanks for the help
A tire place that's a bit of a drive from here said they could probably fill them, and they charge $6 a tire so it would probably be pretty cheap. I still need to confirm they can regulate the pressure high enough. The local ATV shop said they do shocks for $25 each, probably charge me even more for these. Any reason not to go with the tire place? I'm assuming nitrogen is nitrogen? Sorry for the dumb questions, but I'm a C/O noob...
Oh and just out of curiosity, how does cycling them and moving the piston eventually lead to blowing the end of the reservoir when you fill them?
Thanks for the help
PahlMc
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Scripps Ranch (San Diego)
There is an IFP (Internal Floating Piston) in the reservoir. The depth from the end that has the air valve varies by company, but it’s always around 3/4 of the way to toward the side with the hose.
That piston moves back to the valve end side when you compress the shock since fluid is now flowing into the reservoir (the shaft is displacing fluid so the fluid has to go somewhere right?). So at this point, the IFP is closer to the valve side of the reservoir than when it started right? Now if there is air or nitrogen in the shock, that force will push the IFP back toward the hose side as you extend the shock. All is well!
Now, if you compress the shock, and the fluid moves that IFP near the valve side, and you don’t have air or nitrogen pushing back on the piston when you extend it, the IFP might not move back to where it started. Usually it does due to suction as long as you cycle the shock slowly, but it might not! You are creating a vacuum when you extend the shock so it should move back. However if it doesn’t, and you then mount your shock and go hit a fun jump or big bump, the IFP is now too close to the valve end of the resi. The force you create hitting that bump can push the valve end off the reservoir. It’s quite fun to watch….I’ve seen the end fly 30 feet in the air! You can also just blow up the resi if the end cap doesn’t come off.
FYI FOA had a lot of their early shocks do this from the factory. Most of my friends that decided to go that route took them apart and re-set the IFP Depth. It takes like 10 minutes. More than you wanted to know? Sorry for the long post.
Oh and DGAF about the moisture that gets into the shock. The first time you open up a shock moisture gets in there….it won’t hurt anything. It isn’t delicate and it isn’t a space ship. It’s a piece of steel holding fluid and gas.
That piston moves back to the valve end side when you compress the shock since fluid is now flowing into the reservoir (the shaft is displacing fluid so the fluid has to go somewhere right?). So at this point, the IFP is closer to the valve side of the reservoir than when it started right? Now if there is air or nitrogen in the shock, that force will push the IFP back toward the hose side as you extend the shock. All is well!
Now, if you compress the shock, and the fluid moves that IFP near the valve side, and you don’t have air or nitrogen pushing back on the piston when you extend it, the IFP might not move back to where it started. Usually it does due to suction as long as you cycle the shock slowly, but it might not! You are creating a vacuum when you extend the shock so it should move back. However if it doesn’t, and you then mount your shock and go hit a fun jump or big bump, the IFP is now too close to the valve end of the resi. The force you create hitting that bump can push the valve end off the reservoir. It’s quite fun to watch….I’ve seen the end fly 30 feet in the air! You can also just blow up the resi if the end cap doesn’t come off.
FYI FOA had a lot of their early shocks do this from the factory. Most of my friends that decided to go that route took them apart and re-set the IFP Depth. It takes like 10 minutes. More than you wanted to know? Sorry for the long post.
Oh and DGAF about the moisture that gets into the shock. The first time you open up a shock moisture gets in there….it won’t hurt anything. It isn’t delicate and it isn’t a space ship. It’s a piece of steel holding fluid and gas.
Vanimal
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- escondido, ca
i drove mine to the store empty to have them filled, both front and rear. didnt do a damn thing to them. not saying pahlmc is incorrect, but i dont think i'd worry about doing it just for setup. i definitely wouldnt go wheeling or anything without them filled.
PahlMc
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Scripps Ranch (San Diego)
If you can't get them filled before you cycle them, just take off the end cap and make sure the IFP doesn't get stuck too close to the wrong side. With new seals it shouldn't happen. However FOA sent shocks to customers that way in the beginning.
Still no progress on the mounting, but I did get a chance to throw together a spanner wrench. The pre load adjusters are pretty hard to turn, so I may need to pry them apart a little bit at the pinch bolt slot so they aren't so tight on the body, allowing them to turn a little easier. I couldn't turn them by hand.
The wrench is the definition of cheap, dirty, ugly, overbuilt, and a few other undesirable things, but I'm fine with that since I just used a bunch of already bent scraps and burned them together. Plus, it works great.
The wrench is the definition of cheap, dirty, ugly, overbuilt, and a few other undesirable things, but I'm fine with that since I just used a bunch of already bent scraps and burned them together. Plus, it works great.
Vanimal
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- escondido, ca
i looked at the pictures first and thought those are the mounts you made haha
bluejeepkid
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Bullhead City
I been watchin this threads and I have a related question. What are you go fast guys doin as far as engine cages to tie the shock hoops together? I need ideas for my build
Thanks
Thanks
desertjr
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Low Desert
I still have questions as far as coilsovers on a mild style jeep. More of a camping jeep than anything to be honest.
I'm plating front to rear very soon..what all would I need to do to run coil overs? Just shock hoops & brace them to the plated frame? Or should I do hoops & a small simple engine cage? I have some 10" fox 2.0 coilovers off a toyota I picked up cheap & always wanted to use them on my Xj. Only around 4-4.5" so what all is needed..no jeepspeed style stuff here.
I'm plating front to rear very soon..what all would I need to do to run coil overs? Just shock hoops & brace them to the plated frame? Or should I do hoops & a small simple engine cage? I have some 10" fox 2.0 coilovers off a toyota I picked up cheap & always wanted to use them on my Xj. Only around 4-4.5" so what all is needed..no jeepspeed style stuff here.
- Location
- San Diego
run the lower mounts as low as you can on the axle without being in danger of getting torn off in order to get as much room for the coilover as possible.
getting some hoops mounted in the front of an XJ is not going to be easy, but it can be done. plating the unibody is a must. tying some tubework together is a good idea.
you said no jeepspeed stuff, but you should look through the jeepspeed builds to get ideas.
Vanimal
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- escondido, ca
i dont think i would waste my time fabbing for 10" coilovers, just run shocks and springs.
desertjr
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Low Desert
More or less I was thinking of doing something like this here..
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/jeep-cherokee/1100597-my-mild-xj-build.html
Simple hoop/engine cage. I will be plating with 1/8" stiffeners from HD offroad but can plate/gusset where ever needed. Basically I'm about to get to do a long arm setup off a custom 2x4 Xmember & I'd really love to do coilovers up front..even if its just to be different.
What size coilovers would be best 12s? Remember I'm at 3" and 31's currently or 33x10.5 which are my wheeling tires, 31's for daily use. So I'll be at 3" and 33's & stock axles which have been upgraded quite a bit.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/jeep-cherokee/1100597-my-mild-xj-build.html
Simple hoop/engine cage. I will be plating with 1/8" stiffeners from HD offroad but can plate/gusset where ever needed. Basically I'm about to get to do a long arm setup off a custom 2x4 Xmember & I'd really love to do coilovers up front..even if its just to be different.
What size coilovers would be best 12s? Remember I'm at 3" and 31's currently or 33x10.5 which are my wheeling tires, 31's for daily use. So I'll be at 3" and 33's & stock axles which have been upgraded quite a bit.
- Location
- San Diego
Honestly, I would link and coilover the rear before I did the front.. But if you are set on the front, a set of 2.5" 12" C/Os would do you well
souske
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- The land of competition
I dont know if i would even bother with all the work of coilovers for 12's
- Location
- San Diego
Why? Lots and lots of very successful rigs run 12" shocks
Adding coilovers isn't about gaining travel. It's about packaging and tuneability.
souske
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- The land of competition
Why? Because I am lazy. If I was doing all that work, I would stuff as long of a shock as possible in there
desertjr
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Low Desert
So I think I'm gonna try and tackle this since I'm doing my stiffeners soon!
I like how the guy just cut the holes for the hoops in the inner fender vs hacking the hole thing out. It also leaves an extra area to weld the hoops to which I believe he did as well. Possible strength gain?
I only have 10" 2.5's but I think that would be sufficient. Obviously 12's or 14's would be better but I can still make 10's work I'm sure. Just mount them a wee bit higher on the axle or a bit lower at the upper. I think overall the jeep would ride & preform better as a expo rig with them & it'd be something different than anyone else.
Now what all will I need to check when doing this. Obviously I'll need to make hoops & a simple engine cage thats removeable like the other fella(linked posted) . Is there anything else I should tie into to make it stronger overall?
I saw concerns of clearing the frame rail & such so that'll have to be taken into account. Anything else though?
I like how the guy just cut the holes for the hoops in the inner fender vs hacking the hole thing out. It also leaves an extra area to weld the hoops to which I believe he did as well. Possible strength gain?
I only have 10" 2.5's but I think that would be sufficient. Obviously 12's or 14's would be better but I can still make 10's work I'm sure. Just mount them a wee bit higher on the axle or a bit lower at the upper. I think overall the jeep would ride & preform better as a expo rig with them & it'd be something different than anyone else.
Now what all will I need to check when doing this. Obviously I'll need to make hoops & a simple engine cage thats removeable like the other fella(linked posted) . Is there anything else I should tie into to make it stronger overall?
I saw concerns of clearing the frame rail & such so that'll have to be taken into account. Anything else though?
Super D
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Colorado Springs, C.O.
Has anybody used the RuffStuff shock towers, or is everyone just making their own hoops?
