Amend a by-law.......LET THE VOTING BEGIN.....

[JR]

Just curious to where this money goes?? It just sits in some piggy bank?? It goes straight to itself?

I'm not for having to pay money to go wheeling with a bunch of guys. That's not what a "club" is about to me.

Now if or the Sierra Chapter will provide food, spare parts, etc. then it is well worth the money for the run. I know it's only $30 but it does not make sense if the money does not go anywhere.

When I think of a "club" I think it as a group of guys who love wheeling and participate in the sport quite a lot. Does it make sense to pay for the runs themselves?

Is it costing Sierra Chapter anything to keep this board up and running. If it is I agree with a fee there, but actually going on runs I don't believe there should be a fee.

Anybody seeing what I am? :?:

 

[WesternXJ]

First off, if your not a member of , please keep your comments to yourself.

This motion was started to ammend the by-law WE ALL READY VOTED ON AND PASSED LAST YEAR. We agreed that ANY use of the forum to setup a run constituted an SC run.

THE ONLY THING WE'RE TRYING TO DO WITH THIS VOTE IS MAKE IT SO A PERSON ONLY HAS TO PAY FOR ONE RUN A MONTH (UP TO $30 PER YEAR).

Make sense now? :shock:

 

[ChuckD]

I thought Rob might have shot in here by now. Anyway, The vote is really simple,

[b:e62be37bdb]$30 per year period, whether or not you make it to a run or meeting. [/b:e62be37bdb]

[b:e62be37bdb]You still have the choice to pay in increments of $5.00. (whether is is per month or run is up to you). [/b:e62be37bdb]


The money goes into the chapter pot for such things:

T-shirts, stickers, hats (which will be reimbursed when sold)

Spare parts(for those with D35's), portable welder, emergency gear ect..

To help out a fellow SC member: death in the family, broken XJ(small loan), flowers

[b:e62be37bdb]The last thing is if you don't understand it or don't like it, then vote NAY so we can move on. And the next time we vote, probably should start another thread[/b:e62be37bdb]

 

[JP]

[quote:ed0fc44d5b]Just talking about going someplace with friends on the forum does not constitute a club run, one of the purposes of the forum is to allow friends to communicate and put trips together....they are not all club runs. A club run has to be announced as a club run, i.e. "the run this month is to Fordyce", etc. So, you cannot just say that every trip that is talked about on the forums is a club run, it just doesn't work that way.
[/quote:ed0fc44d5b]

This is what has always been confusing to me. I think the by-law was amended the way it was because we ASSUMED that since we were using bandwith it had to be a sponsered run.

Goatman has some good points about not turning away potential members. Sticking a $5 fee in someones face before getting to know people and seeing if is for them doesn't make sense if we want to increase membership. I voted for the $5 because it made sense to give a little back. But I was giving back because I had been around for a while and I had already gotten something out of and SC. If I was new coming into the group I would probably ? the $$ too. I am all for raising $$ to support the chapter and 4x4 issues, but maybe we are overcomplicating things a bit. Before we go amending the by-laws again we should consider some of Goat's suggestions.

A fundraising run once or twice a year with maybe a larger $$ amount per person or rig is a pretty good option. Use some of the $$ to host a big BBQ one nite, but still be able to turn a profit. Then people may feel like they are getting some immediate return on their $$ and still helping the chapter.

 

[ChuckD]

Rob, Keven and I understand that there are many ways to bring money into the chapter. This is just our take on it. We are asking the the chapter to vote on it. Like I said, if you don't agree or simply just don't understand what's up for vote, then vote NAY. If the vote does not pass, we then can try agian.

Goatman does have some good points, but he is not a member of SC anymore.

THE THING THE REALLY GETS ME IS THAT THE CURRENT SC BYLAWS ARE UP IN THE AIR OR SOMETHING. I REALLY DON"T KNOW WHAT WE ARE CHANGING. SO BEFORE WE GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS AGAIN, WE NEED OUR BYLAWS PUBLISHED.

Otherwise if it isn't published, whats the point in following it or abiding by it.

 

[JP]

Ok, Nay. I think we need to consider all the options available for fundraising and look at what has already passed as by-laws. Then we can have and educated proposal and vote that either amends the per run fee to include a cap $$ paid per year OR changed to a different style of raising $$.

Jeff

Goatman may not be a member of SC, but it seems he has some experience on organizing a club, which I do not. I was just agreeing with some of his suggestions.

 

[Maximus]

Ok I just back from Canada and read the thread. It seems we are all not sure of what we are even doing here. The main thing that we are trying to do is to raise some funds for SC. Yes having a big event to raise money for the club is great but where does the money come from to even organize the thing before we start collecting registration fees? The SC is like any business it needs money to operate and benefit each of its memebers. If we have an event and no money to organize it it then falls upon those who can afford it and want to do the event anyways and that is not fair.

As for new members coming to a club it is given knowledge that there will be some kind of dues or fees to pay. When was the last time joined something and didnt have to pay to use its resources? So I think that anyone looking at our club will cough up the dough.

For the record I vote AYE.

We need to look towrd the future of the cluband not just what today is. Like what Chuck said, If you done agree or dont understand then vote Nay. That is the beauty of the club we do what we want through a voting system.

 

[crazy4mopar]

[quote:04ae79931e="Riley Salida, CA"]
As for new members coming to a club it is given knowledge that there will be some kind of dues or fees to pay. When was the last time joined something and didnt have to pay to use its resources? So I think that anyone looking at our club will cough up the dough.[/quote:04ae79931e]

I've gotten WELL over 30.00 worth of knowledge from this forum, So I vote(if I'm allowed) Yea

 

[Kernel]

nay. I like the $5 a run when it's an offical SC run. but what's an offical SC run.

 

[Ivan]

I would have to vote for the $5 per run idea myself. Even though I'm part of the SC; being in Eureka, I'm too far away to make it to many of the runs closer to the Sacto area where most are held. Wish I had the time and money to make some inland runs.

Speaking of runs... I'd be willing to coordinate another Usal Ridge trail run like I did last year. It's a realtively mild run, but very scenic along the coastal Usal range. Depending on weather, some good mud sections can be fun to deal with :twisted:

The run begins in Garberville, and ends up at Usal Beach (about 1/2 north of Fort Bragg. There's a nice camping / picnic area at Usal beach at the end of the run that was a lot of fun last year.

I wasn't quite sure how many folks would be interested in another run this year since it's one of those "been there, done that" kind of things. If there's enough interest, perhaps we can look into this further....

Ivan

 

[Maximus]

I think many are confused on the whole fees thing. A while ago the by laws were ammended to charge a $5 fee for each run. This vote is essentially to limit the amount an individual would have to pay per year to just $30. This being that if you attened 2 runs a month you wouldnt spend a bunch of money but hit a maximum of $30. This is out there to protect you not rip you off. Some feel the flat fee is the way to go because there is disagreement on what constitutes an official SC run. Those who are concerned with what the money will be for have already answered your own questions and we dont need to dig deeper into that. I have a feeling this wont ever get anywhere and some peoples feelings are getting hurt and I for one do not want that. Remember we are a club of friends and should help each other and not bring each other down for any reason. Thanks!!!

 

[ChuckD]

Is this vote over yet?

 

[Kejtar]

some comments/thoughts/wild ideas

OK, for starters... yeah I am not a member of SC but... I will shortly be a member of SoCal chapter. We are goign to through the same growing pains and even though we are still in the process of electing BOD some of us are already thinking (I hope more then just me )as to where we will get $$ for tshirts and goodies and such.....

Keep in mind that this is just my opinion so take it for what it's worth and please refrain from flaming me for posting suggestions as I have seen done to others.

Well, things are not as simple as a fee for runs. For starters if you take on the fee thing well....
1. THere will have to be an official trail master. That trail master will be responsible for safety inspections (unless a safety inspection person gets elected).
2. If any vehicle fails safety inspection, it will HAVE to be turned away. Here in SoCal we just had our annual Jamboree where 2 people (at least 2 on the second day) didn't meet the rules. But since it was the SoCalXJ run where we don't have safety inspections, just recomendations, it was decided that with care we can take someone that has no front towpoints for example (he ended up being dragged ass first up a hill, but that's a different story).
3. You are talking about voting in people for the benefit of being a SC member while not being a member. Well, last time I checked, the chapters are there to benefit the overall club. I am not saying that the chapter should not generate an income, but the chapter should have the overall well being in mind first. The servers and the software that they are running on are not free. Neither is the hosting. So the way you're doing it, people who use and benefit from will end up paying SC for the general benefit. that's kind of...... selfish.
4. Also I think that the by-laws ammendment will have to be voted in by the national BOD as they have to approve the chapter by-laws (but I am not 100% sure on that...)

Anyways, also look at it this way: a chapter is there to raise people's interest in the as a whole. So why turn them away and make them go behind and backchannel to organize the runs just to avoid the fees and so on? Also as it was brought up: how are you going to take care of hte logistics of who's current, who's not?

I don't want to sound harsh or rude or anything like that but things are becoming here complicated. This is the same thing that the SoCal people are afraid of happening so we decided (in SoCal) that the only annual recurring fee that there will be is the national fee. The runs where peopel get together will be free, and we are thinking (again some of us already are) about organizing an annual event that would be generating $$ for the chapter: look at NAC. I think that they are the most active chapter when it comes to making official runs/events.

Btw, at the events ussually there is something for something WHen a fee is being paid the participants get raffle tickets, or a free meal or something.

Kejtar
P.S. As I said... consider this for what it is... a view from an outsider (in a way) that understands the problems as he's been faced and will be faced with a similar situation.

 

[ChuckD]

Thank you for the input

We have addressed other avenues for fund raising (thansk to Goatman and others sugestions). They are in other threads. This one however started as a discssion then turned into an official vote, then back to a discussion.

We didn't want to discourage membership but simplify the debate over an official Chapter run or not. Maybe a flat fee will work, but not $30, maybe 10 or 15.

Lastly I agree with this:

3. You are talking about voting in people for the benefit of being a SC member while not being a member. Well, last time I checked, the chapters are there to benefit the overall club. I am not saying that the chapter should not generate an income, but the chapter should have the overall well being in mind first. The servers and the software that they are running on are not free. Neither is the hosting. So the way you're doing it, people who use and benefit from will end up paying SC for the general benefit. that's kind of...... selfish.

Kejtar

 

[Kejtar]

Thanks

I just went through the other threads (waiting on something at work so I got couple minutes to kill and normal forums have no activity today ) and I like what I'm seeing (not that you guys need my approval LOL ).

Anyways, thanks for taking looking at my post objectively . I still think that for that $$ that will be charged there has to be something else given except just a right to ride the trails, but that's just my opinion (maybe a hot dog fund or something like that? ).

One of these days when we get SoCal chapter up and running we will have to do an official combined event.....

Kejtar

 

[WesternXJ]

Amendment failed.

THE VOTE FOR THE $5 PER RUN (UP TO $30 PER YEAR) PASSED LAST YEAR AND ONLY APPLIES TO /SC MEMBERS.

IT WAS DECIDED THAT ANY RUN POSTED ON THE SC FORUM WAS CONSIDERED AN OFFICIAL SC RUN.

THE VOTING IS FINAL, UNLESS SOMEONE ELSE WOULD LIKE TO START ANOTHER TREAD AND MAKE A MOTION.