Which D44 High Pinion front axle?

Vince

Vince

NAXJA Forum User
Location
England
I seem to be going around in circles at the moment trying to find exactly what axle parts I need to put a high pinion D44 up front on 8" lift with 35" tyres within legal coverage of Bushwacker flares.

I have found a lot of information (some of it conflicting) about Ford F100, F150 and Bronco D44hp axles from 1965 to 1979. I had thought that a 1979 F150 axle would be the best candidate for narrowing on the long side using a stock SJ long inner axle shaft but I have since found that the axle tubes don't extend all the way to the inner knuckle. The coil spring seat and control arm mount are integrated into one casting. The tube wall is also very thin. Am I really looking at just using the diff housing from the F150 D44hp, the inner and outer knuckles from a Waggy and having custom tubes and shafts made? An old '93-'98 D30hp for an XJ with Warn shafts and 5x5.5 conversion is certainly looking an easier proposition.

If you have built your own high pinion D44 I could certainly use some guidance right now.

Perhaps we should really do a sticky for this subject?
 
 
Built my own,

Diff Houseing, Inner C's, Rotors+Hubs, Lock outs - 78 F150

Knucles, spindles, Brake Caliper and Mount, 72 Chevy

Custom Axle Tubes, 3.00od x 2.25id DOM

Moser Eng. 4130 Inner and Outer Shafts

Eaton E-Locker

Precision Gear 5.13's

Spicer "X" series joints

66" wheel mount width


initial cost is expensive, but its nice when its installed and you dont have to worry about breaking it.

If you have the fab skills and equipment, you should be able build this same axle for about 2k.

This is th eway to go IMO
 
Just get any HP-44 from '71 to '77. The '71-'75 will have drum brakes BUT you can easily swap it to dics with a set of disc brake knuckles from a '76+. Mine is from a '75 F-100 and this is what I am doing. (except mine is going to be left full width)
There are rare '78-'79 HP-44's without the cast mounts...I had one. But I've yet to see another.
 
Google search will get you more info than you can digest in a day--here's an example that every novice D44 builder should start with:http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/flatop_knucles.html The 78/79 Ford front axles do have cast radius arm mounts. But the inner "Cs" are welded to a short section of axle tube just like the early-er D44 axles. If you want to shorten this housing, you generally have to re tube it ,re using the center section and the inner Cs. That's what I did(or I should say, paid Currie Enterprises to do).
 
cyrus said:
initial cost is expensive, but its nice when its installed and you dont have to worry about breaking it.
Click to expand...

Oh, if only this were the case!
 
I use a 79 bronco axle, formed the brackets to the cast and had them welded directly to it, looks and works great.

DISCLAIMER: YOU HAVE TO KNOW HOW OR KNOW SOMEONE WHO CAN WELD CORRECTLY TO CAST.
 
We used a '79 F250 front end. Already flat top knuckles, no radius arm brackets, heavy duty tubes. Hard to beat that IMO. Only problem for you might be that its an 8-lug outer..and full width. Gives you a good excuse to upgrade to a Dana 60 in the rear, which can be had for a dime-a-dozen.
 
Thanks for all of the links, read them all.

I spoke to Currie Enterprises and they can certainly build me a front high pinion D44 at a price - I am still putting some thought to this option.

Another option is a low pinion D44 housing from a Wrangler Rubicon. It has the advantage of being the right width and uses my existing outer axles and knuckles or a Warn 5x5.5 hub conversion. The inner shafts are also readily available. I just don't know if the driveline angles for an XJ on 8" lift with a low pinion Rubicon axle would work without cutting and rotating the inner knuckles.
 
Vince said:
Another option is a low pinion D44 housing from a Wrangler Rubicon. It has the advantage of being the right width and uses my existing outer axles and knuckles or a Warn 5x5.5 hub conversion. The inner shafts are also readily available. I just don't know if the driveline angles for an XJ on 8" lift with a low pinion Rubicon axle would work without cutting and rotating the inner knuckles.
Click to expand...

This pretty much defeats the purpose........:lecture:
 
I know, it's not a nice compromise to consider, but when you have two Jeeps both with low pinion D30's and limited beans to rectify the problem, which low budget option would you choose if doing the fabrication yourself was not possible?

1. A used high pinion D30 from a pre-2000 XJ upgraded with Warn 5x5.5 hubs and shafts. 25% stronger but same weak housing and tubes.

2. A new low pinion Rubicon 44 with Warn 5x5.5 hubs and shafts. 25% weaker than a HP D44, probably equivalent ring gear strength to a HP D30, but stronger housing, potential driveline issues at 8" of lift.

I would really enjoy building my own axles. I am a qualified mechanical production engineer but I have no workshop equipment at my disposal and I have a fixed deadline to get two jeeps built before September 18th. I am still getting prices for having two axles built properly but for option (2) I am looking at around $5500 for the pair installed and for two professionally built axles about $9000 installed. Building two myself may be possible for $4000 but I just don't have the time or equipment to make that happen.
 
Vince said:
Another option is a low pinion D44 housing from a Wrangler Rubicon. It has the advantage of being the right width and uses my existing outer axles and knuckles or a Warn 5x5.5 hub conversion. The inner shafts are also readily available. I just don't know if the driveline angles for an XJ on 8" lift with a low pinion Rubicon axle would work without cutting and rotating the inner knuckles.
Click to expand...

IIRC the Rubi 44 isn't a "real" 44

isn't it a 30/44 hybrid with non standard R & P?


:dunno:
 
Vince

If you went with building an HP D30 with new shafts and a Warn kit then you would have the benefit of the Warn fuses as a 'weak-link' that should go before the R&P or shafts. This could be easily and cheaply changed off-road, it just depends how often you break them as to how annoying/expensive it gets.
 
Based on the experience of Wrangler owner's over here that are running 35" tires on low pinion D30's with the 5x5.5 fused hubs, I thought it was worth a try on a trussed high pinion D30. However, if the fuses are popping too frequently, which is what some guys in the US are telling me I should expect, a better solution is to keep the lockout hub at full strength and run CTM joints, full circle clips and chrome moly inners. Yes, this does put the weak point in the diff or the ring gear but if the overall strength is higher than what my style of driving needs I should be OK.

From what I can tell, the Rubicon front 44 is a hybrid axle using D30 knuckles and outer shafts with D44 center, diff and R&P. I guess that this also means that the housing has the smaller D30 tubes as well. Other than benefitting from the larger ring gear there really isn't much more going for this axle.

Crane High Clearance have come back with a good price for a bare axle using their new RS44 housing and flat top knuckles which is what I would really like to do. It's still too early for me to make a decision but it does appear that having an axle built from new components may work out cheaper than modifying an old axle if you have to pay for every hour of labor involved in the build.

Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if AMC standardised on D44 rear and high pinion D44 front axles when they first designed the XJ. The economy of scale of having two axles strong enough for their entire range of future vehicles and the reduced inventory required for just-in-time factory assembly may have made Jeep more price competitive than messing about with the variety they have created since then.
 
Vince said:
Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if AMC standardised on D44 rear and high pinion D44 front axles when they first designed the XJ. The economy of scale of having two axles strong enough for their entire range of future vehicles and the reduced inventory required for just-in-time factory assembly may have made Jeep more price competitive than messing about with the variety they have created since then.
Click to expand...


This would have required planning and fore-thought, which were not standard equipment at the old AMC.
 
CRASH said:
This would have required planning and fore-thought, which were not standard equipment at the old AMC.
Click to expand...
Or the new DC Jeep.
 
CRASH said:
This would have required planning and fore-thought, which were not standard equipment at the old AMC.
Click to expand...

Whelp, I think that given the time and placement in history of AMC they did ok for what they had and were capable of producing.

After all, at that time the type of wheeling that was done was pretty mild stuff and a low pinion Dana 30 probably would have been strong enough, let alone a high pinion Dana 30.

The Grand Wagoneer did pretty well getting Dana 44s front and rear. At that time SUV vehicles were more about towing and weight loading than anything else.

Their "mistake" was buying into the fuel economy hysterics and messing around with vacuum disconnects. Even the Grand Wagoneer Dana 44 got that for a few years around 1980 (IIRC). The YJ was a pretty reasonable configuration as well given the HP Dana 30.

Other than that, a HP 30 front and D44 rear was pretty robust for the size and weight of a four wheel drive station wagon. No comment on the Dana 35. :)

If they can be faulted it was for not going to EFI across the entire line earlier. YJs and FSJs should have gone RENIX the same time the XJ did; to he!! with what the EPA class rules let you get away with. If they did that then the whole vacuum disconnect thing might have been averted since the point was fuel economy - the 5% (yeah, right) they lose by running non-disconnect they get back in EFI efficiency.

The other big mistake was importing Renault type cars. Who the he!! that knows anything about cars intentionally buys a French car? LOL That's a joke - maybe.

Oh well. Don't matter now.
 
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