VANCO Big Brakes and U Turn steering

[Skruffy]

For all of us with big tires and heavy XJs we know that the brakes are not good enough. About a year ago Skruffy got some black magic brake pads that made a significant difference but with all the extra weight and the LS3 that is going in soon stopping power could no loner be ignored. After a great deal of research I concluded that the only two options were WJ conversion or VANCO. Because my Teraflex high steer was really really bad and also in need of replacement I went with VANCO.
Today I picked up a VANCO kit from Black Magic and will be installing it along with a U turn steering from off road only. I hope to get all this installed in the next couple weekends.

Here is the kit, notice the shiny new knuckles that will fit the new dual piston calipers.

Below is what I have now. TJ rubicon 44s and a tera flex knuckle.

 

[Skruffy]

Made some progress today. Removed the old knuckles and replaced ball joints. Huge pain to remove those ball joints!
New machines unit bearings go on and new rotors and calipers go on as well.

Here is where I started, minus the drag link that is already removed.

Below is the tera flex knuckle in the passenger side.

And now the new knuckle with new ball joints.

Below is the new unit bearings installed

And now the new calipers installed. The old one is held up for comparison.

Hoping to get the other side done tomorrow as well as the steering.

 

[ridesdirt]

nice! pricey, but nice!

 

[Skruffy]

Yeah definitely not cheap. I just couldn’t have crappy brakes and sloppy steering anymore. Hoping this makes a big enough difference to be worth all that money! I also replaced all of the front control arm bushings and flex joints. That alone made a big difference since the LCA bushings on the passenger side were completely shot.

 

[chasdb]

Air bags look interesting. You running fixed pressure or running with 2 ride height valves?

 

[RCP Phx]

What was your reasoning for not doing WJ brakes?

 

[TRCM]

What was your reasoning for not doing WJ brakes?

.......or U-turn steering over the teraflex or WJ conversion ??

Your original pic shows a track bar and draglink not in parallel.................

All the u-turn will do for you is get you closer to parallel, which you probably could have done more cheaply with a different track bar upper mount, or by raising the lower mount.


.

 

[Skruffy]

Air bags look interesting. You running fixed pressure or running with 2 ride height valves?

Chasdb:
The airbags are filled/emptied either manually or automatically by a homemade Arduino control system that I built. It is very similar to the Airock setup.

 

[Skruffy]

.......or U-turn steering over the teraflex or WJ conversion ??

Your original pic shows a track bar and draglink not in parallel.................

All the u-turn will do for you is get you closer to parallel, which you probably could have done more cheaply with a different track bar upper mount, or by raising the lower mount.


.

I didn’t do the WJ conversion mainly because I wanted the UTurn steering in addition to better brakes. Getting better braking power was most important and the teraflex wasn’t compatible with the VANCO knuckles. When I had the teraflex stuff installed I really didn’t understand how the geometry was supposed to be and sort of got had by a shop who was selling teraflex high steer setups.
I was prepared to raise the lower trackbar mount if needed but wanted to put it all together and see

 

[Skruffy]

I got everything put back together, a reasonable driveway alignment and bled the brakes
Below are the knuckle adapters

Here it is sitting pretty straight and ready for tires

After the installation I took it for a spin and did the brake in procedure for the black magic brakes.
What an incredible difference the brakes made. For the first time in 15 years I can actually stop this thing. A dramatic improvement is an understatement. If you have 35s on your Cherokee and can’t stop, put this VANCO kit on there and you will be stopping on a dime. Seriously, I can easily lock up the front tires. Stops in way less than half the distance. Feels like a normal car when braking heavily.
And for the steering:
Also a dramatic improvement. Bump steer is completely gone. Because my ride height/suspension is adjustable at the touch of a button (from about 2” of lift all the way up to 12”) the high steer wouldn’t track right at any height. The Uturn setup is amazing. No more dead spot, no more sloppy feeling and no more steering wheel going upside down when the suspension is raised or lowered.

Super happy with how it turned out.

 

[TRCM]

It's better, but your track bar & drag link still look to be out of parallel about 1/2 as much.

Better brakes are awesome....on my car, I can stop on a dime (15" rotors & 6 piston calipers)....want to get the cherokee do be able to do similar too.....right now, with 32's, if I let the rear brakes get out of adjustment, then braking power drops dramatically.

 

[Skruffy]

It's better, but your track bar & drag link still look to be out of parallel about 1/2 as much.

Better brakes are awesome....on my car, I can stop on a dime (15" rotors & 6 piston calipers)....want to get the cherokee do be able to do similar too.....right now, with 32's, if I let the rear brakes get out of adjustment, then braking power drops dramatically.

Yeah
The track bar drops much further than the draglink but as of now there is no symptoms of that. Everything is nice and tight and straight and there is no bump steer at all. The wheel stays straight from no lift all the way up to 10” of lift so until I have a reason to raise the axle side mount of the track bar I am going to keep it.

 

[JMOliver]

I’m jealous, I currently have the black magic pads and centric rotors on front and zj rear disc swap on back! It’s a must with 35s and bumpers,skid plates,armor!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[raneil]

I suspect you'll love the VANCO kit for years to come, Skruffy. I installed it on our '98 XJ in 2013, and still love it as much today as I did then. It makes a huge difference in braking with 35" tires, and has been flawlessly reliable. It's an investment to be sure, but it's been one of the best investments we've made on our XJ.

 

[Vince]

I did my VANCO big brake upgrade in 2008. I also have a WARN 5 on 5.5" hub conversion. For a while I was concerned that I had invested way too much in my high pinion D30, the VANCO kit being my last major purchase for it. Every time I use the brake pedal, I feel satisfied that it was a sound investment.

 

[camojeep88]

for the price of that kit why not just do wilwoods and get 4 piston calipers?

 

[Skruffy]

for the price of that kit why not just do wilwoods and get 4 piston calipers?

I had never heard of wilwoods. I am now hesitant to even look cause I don’t want to find out that could have been a better cheaper option for me!

 

[RCP Phx]

Wilwoods been around forever and are best known for their race brakes.
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/BrakeKitsProdFront?itemno=140-12576-DR&year=2000&make=Jeep&model=Cherokee&option=Req.+conversion+to+87-89+YJ+front+spindles

 

[Skruffy]

Those wilwoods are similar in price to the VANCO kit and in my case would have required me to buy bigger 16” rims. I just put new tires in my 15” rims so that would have been a tough pill to swallow. They seem like they would be a good option for some folks.

 

[TRCM]

Wilwoods been around forever and are best known for their race brakes.
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/BrakeKitsProdFront?itemno=140-12576-DR&year=2000&make=Jeep&model=Cherokee&option=Req.+conversion+to+87-89+YJ+front+spindles

Look promising except for the spindle swap.....