TOTM: Fuel delivery

xcm

xcm

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Southern Oregon
Hope you guys dont mind, but it is the 1st, and im in the baby stages of doing a fuel system. Combined with the utter lack of totm's as of late, lets do fuel!

So, as a primer, billavista on pirate has a nice show and tell demo, found here: http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Fuel_Cell/

SO, what pumps are you guys running? What lines? new regulator/stock regulator?
Anyone done a custom fuel rail with AN fittings? I can see the stock brazed hardline on the rail, and quick disconnects causing tons of problems with race use.

What about roll over valves, obviously the average jeepspeed doesnt spend as much time on it's side as many crawlers, but we still need the protection do we need the full on hose maze billavista talks about?

Anyone running a sending unit similar to the jaz tube styles? im having trouble finding one long enough for a 32gal tank, am i destined to a hokey, 'better than nothing' gauge that shows 1/3rd of a tank as E?

Thanks in advance.
 
also if you dont mind me adding one thing to the list... are fuel cells street legal? it seems ive heard "yes" "no" and "depends" anyone wanna shed some light? thanks
 
xcm said:
Anyone running a sending unit similar to the jaz tube styles? im having trouble finding one long enough for a 32gal tank, am i destined to a hokey, 'better than nothing' gauge that shows 1/3rd of a tank as E?

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

you can use an aftermarket gauge and sending unit, you just need to use an arm on the sender that is long enough to hit the bottom of the tank and have room for it to swing. Although if you're running one of the foam inserts that would not work at all :confused1

I like the look of the tube on the side that shows the level of the tank, but I can see that getting ripped off pretty easily when i throw camping gear in the back.

I'm interested to see where this thread goes. I'll add it to the list in the sticky up top. :cheers:
 
'Looking for a sending unit for my truck now(haven't started looking hard, it's kind of far down the list right now) Probably not going to help you much, XCM. How deep is your tank? My cell is only 26gal. but almost 14" deep.

The hose maze for the vent hose is a requirement for racing. Weather or not you use it,... well, is your fuel tank inside your passenger compartment? Obviously, if you have to meet emissions requirements,... see below.

As far as street legal, well, it depends,...(Aaaaaaaagh!,...)
It's state by state. Some states won't let you mounted in the passenger compartment. Mine's in a truck, so not an issue.
Some states/counties require a closed vent system for emissions.

I'm currently attempting to make my truck road legal, but Maricopa county has emissions checks. Needless to say, the 7/8" open vent tube snaked under the truck isn't going to pass the visual. They seem to want a charcoal canister/purge valve/etc installed somewhere. Losers,...
 
yeah I thought i heard that if you have a cell in CA even if its in a truck in the bed area its still illegal.. wouldnt be surprised since CA is lame
 
Legality of fuel cells - it is more smog related than safety related. Let's not confuse "street legal" and "smog legal". There are no CARB approved cells, so you guys in Kali really are kinda screwed. That being said, I've seen a cell installed that used the stock filler neck and cap and had all the vapor and vent lines connected and it passed inspection. As for being street legal, I have yet to see a DOT approved cell, so whatever side of the debate you are on as to whether or not non-DOT approved products are allowed on the street... I do know for a fact (from discussions with ADOT) that non-DOT approved wheels (bead-locks) are NOT legal for use on Arizona highways, so a non-DOT approved cell would probably fall under those same guidelines.
 
TOTM -

We run 2 external pumps. The application is mid-80's Ford truck. Pumps are in parallel so if one fails we flip a switch and the other comes on. Lines are all -6 braided with AN fittings. We have an aftermarket regulator because we run an injector that likes 50psi. We have a JAZ cell mounted inside and it is equipped with rollover valves. We might not be on our side as much as a crawler, but you go end-over-end and barrel roll at 60mph and you will be glad you had them.

Up at the front we have a basically stock rail that uses stock fittings. The -6 line gets adapted to a short section of the stock line just before it attaches to the rail. In 5 seasons we have had zero problems with it.

Sender? No place to put a fuel gauge so no sender.
 
Well I'm sure my cell wouldn't meet racing requirements (I'm not a Jeepspeed guy), but maybe this information will help someone.

Out of 70-micron Walbro pickups/filters from the cell --> Earl's Shut-Off Valve --> Mallory 4060FI pump --> Mallory 4305M return reg --> EITHER back through another Shut-Off Valve and into the tank OR onto a 10-micron filter --> pressure gauge then finally into the fuel rail. To attach to the rail I used a RUS-640860. All the lines are -6AN stainless sleeved with Firesleeve with a mix of Summit/Aeroquip/Earl's fittings.

For the vent I used a SUM-G3114 rollover valve, ran a loop of hose and then outside to a cheap crankcase filter.

FuelSystemComplete.jpg
 
Last edited:
Fuel cells in CA won't pass emissions because none have CARB numbers, or now Executive Orders. Nothing aftermarket in CA will pass smog without a CARB or EO number.

Love the DOT debate. What about lift kit parts and shocks? What about an aftermarket axle? How about aftermarket brake upgrades? But, that's another subject. Surprised that AZ actually has something on the books as liberal as they are about vehicle requirements.
 
Another thing to keep in mind is where you run your fuel lines... I know of at least one buggy that was burned to the ground when a driveshaft got loose and tooled up a fuel line, the fuel sprayed on the exhaust and it was all over.

Ideas? I'm pretty sure the DOT doesn't want them in the cab, ideally they'd be inside the frame rails I guess but that doesn't make them easy to get at for replacement.
 
RCman said:
Well I'm sure my cell wouldn't meet racing requirements (I'm not a Jeepspeed guy), but maybe this information will help someone.

Out of 70-micron Walbro pickups/filters from the cell --> Earl's Shut-Off Valve --> Mallory 4060FI pump --> Mallory 4305M return reg --> EITHER back through another Shut-Off Valve and into the tank OR onto a 10-micron filter --> pressure gauge then finally into the fuel rail. To attach to the rail I used a RUS-640860. All the lines are -6AN stainless sleeved with Firesleeve with a mix of Summit/Aeroquip/Earl's fittings.

For the vent I used a SUM-G3114 rollover valve, ran a loop of hose and then outside to a cheap crankcase filter.
Click to expand...

Do you have any pictures of the fuel rail connections. Curious to see what you did with the Russell Fuel rail fitting.

I was thinking of making a new fuel rail using extruded aluminum and have it machined for the injectors. My point is to remove the stock fuel rail fitting to make it easier to remove the manifolds. I know the stock rail is sufficient but who doesn't like custom parts?
 
RadioShackSpecial said:
Do you have any pictures of the fuel rail connections. Curious to see what you did with the Russell Fuel rail fitting.
Click to expand...

did you click the link? the fitting connects to the stock nipple on the rail and adapts it to a AN flare fitting, you can run whatever you please after that.
 
If you have a Jaz cell, Make sure you get rid of the POS pick up hose inside. It will swell up and fall off, or swell closed. We use a teflon lined steel braided hose and a filter sock on the weighted end.
 
Fuelrail.jpg
 
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