Somewhat of a predicament... (Up travel vs. Down travel)

crazyjim

crazyjim

NAXJA Forum User
Location
SoCal
Ok, so to start, I know what I SHOULD do in this situation but am having a hard time convincing myself.

It's time to order up some new shocks from Bilstein. I'm selling my 12" short body 7100's, which have a collapsed length of around 16". On an RE 5.5 spring, and a relocated lower shock mount, this gives me around 7.5" up travel and 4.5" down travel. It's just about perfect IMO. This is where the tough part comes in... Bilstein does not offer the 9100 in a short body, they are in fact much longer than the 7100 standard body, and as it is I'll be ordering a weld top instead of a screw top to shorten them up a couple inches. Now:

12" Weld Top 9100 - Col: 19.39" / Ext: [FONT=Arial,Helvetica][SIZE=-1]31.36"
10" Weld Top 9100 - Col: 16.65" / Ext: 26.26"

Now, if I decided to run a 12" short body, to gain JUUUUUUUUST that much more, I feel like I'd be sacrificing too much in the up travel department. It would leave me with barely more than 4" of up travel. While this may be fine for crawlers, I'm not hot to the idea of sitting 1.5" from my bump stop only to have 8" of down travel. On the other hand, if I went with a 10" I'd keep the same up travel numbers (approx) but lose around 2" of down travel. I'm not keen on this idea either. I'd hate to limit myself to 10" of travel, and kill 2" of droop in the process.

The smart side of me says just go with a 10" and call it a day, people run it, it does fine, live with it. But the greedy side of my says squeeze that 12" in there and figure out a way to deal with it or make it work. What say you?


(Joel - If you're reading this, can we make a short body 9100? Is it at all possible?)
[/SIZE][/FONT]
 
10" and call it done. The XJ should not be the one you squeeze every inch of travel, it should be the MJ now!
 
are your lower shock mounts on the side of your control arm mounts(I seem to remember seeing a pic once upon a time)? You could re-do those mounts and drop them at least an inch, if not more. Good luck!
 
Jim, screw Bilstein, go to King and build what you want, are they better, who knows but there service is 10x faster, I just had two shocks rebuilt, changed valving and put different rod ends on. Dropped off on a Monday, pick-up up wed, this would have taken a month with Shannon.
 
crazyjim said:
Ok, so to start, I know what I SHOULD do in this situation but am having a hard time convincing myself.

It's time to order up some new shocks from Bilstein. I'm selling my 12" short body 7100's, which have a collapsed length of around 16". On an RE 5.5 spring, and a relocated lower shock mount, this gives me around 7.5" up travel and 4.5" down travel. It's just about perfect IMO. This is where the tough part comes in... Bilstein does not offer the 9100 in a short body, they are in fact much longer than the 7100 standard body, and as it is I'll be ordering a weld top instead of a screw top to shorten them up a couple inches. Now:

12" Weld Top 9100 - Col: 19.39" / Ext: [FONT=Arial,Helvetica][SIZE=-1]31.36"
[SIZE=-1][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]10" Weld Top 9100 - Col: 16.65" / Ext: 26.26"[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Now, if I decided to run a 12" short body, to gain JUUUUUUUUST that much more, I feel like I'd be sacrificing too much in the up travel department. It would leave me with barely more than 4" of up travel. While this may be fine for crawlers, I'm not hot to the idea of sitting 1.5" from my bump stop only to have 8" of down travel. On the other hand, if I went with a 10" I'd keep the same up travel numbers (approx) but lose around 2" of down travel. I'm not keen on this idea either. I'd hate to limit myself to 10" of travel, and kill 2" of droop in the process. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]The smart side of me says just go with a 10" and call it a day, people run it, it does fine, live with it. But the greedy side of my says squeeze that 12" in there and figure out a way to deal with it or make it work. What say you?[/FONT][/SIZE]


[SIZE=-1][FONT=Arial,Helvetica](Joel - If you're reading this, can we make a short body 9100? Is it at all possible?)[/FONT][/SIZE]
[/SIZE][/FONT]
Click to expand...

9100 short body screw top applications are available but not in the catalog. A 12" short body (non coilover) is 19.75" col and 31.75" extended.

If you went 10" weld top it would be 16.87" col and 26.87" extended. For you I might be motivated to shorten the rod guide to give you perhaps 11" of travel as long as it isnt a bypass or coilover.
 
FatCity said:
Sqeeze the 12" out of it.
Can you bring the shock into the engine compartment and mount it to your engine cage?
Click to expand...

I haven't shared this with everybody yet, but the XJ isn't getting built the way it was before. It's going to be a medium build, more than it was but less than I was going to. I figured I'd get my newer a/c power optioned jeep back on the road. All the goodies are going to go on the MJ now, it's getting the full cage/engine cage and linked. So the XJ isn't getting an engine cage for now. I'm also keeping power steering, etc so all my stuff there in the engine bay is staying.

GrimmJeeper said:
Just keep an eye on your oilpan, i put the axle through mine in JV :D
Click to expand...

I'll keep that in mind when I bump it. Thanks!

Skullver said:
are your lower shock mounts on the side of your control arm mounts(I seem to remember seeing a pic once upon a time)? You could re-do those mounts and drop them at least an inch, if not more. Good luck!
Click to expand...

Yea, they are, the most I could move them down from what I can see would be maybe 1/2". They're already on the side of the LCA mount. Unless I cut out some funky ass tab that hangs lower off the side, but at that point I'm going to be dragging my shock through the dirt and rocks.

FordGuy said:
Jim, screw Bilstein, go to King and build what you want, are they better, who knows but there service is 10x faster, I just had two shocks rebuilt, changed valving and put different rod ends on. Dropped off on a Monday, pick-up up wed, this would have taken a month with Shannon.
Click to expand...

Hahaha, Bilstein has been AMAZING to me and Tony from what I can see. Joel has taught me more about shocks than I've ever thought I could learn, and they've performed amazing. Joel has some goodies up his sleeve that no other shock company has (yet). Look at Joel's comment below ;) I'm a bilstein fan boy for life!

RandomThoughtsRace said:
9100 short body screw top applications are available but not in the catalog. A 12" short body (non coilover) is 19.75" col and 31.75" extended.

If you went 10" weld top it would be 16.87" col and 26.87" extended. For you I might be motivated to shorten the rod guide to give you perhaps 11" of travel as long as it isnt a bypass or coilover.
Click to expand...

Awesome, what about a weld top short body? 19.75" is still too long, but since the weld top is just over 2" shorter than a screw top. That'd put me somewhere around 17.5" collapsed length which would give me exactly 6" up and 6" down. I could definitely work with that. Also, it'll be a smooth body, hoping for a piggyback with ACV and radiator :D

Also wanted to ask you, should I mount the resi off the bottom? Or is it worth keeping it up top to be able to run the ACV valve?
 
FordGuy said:
Jim, screw Bilstein, go to King and build what you want, are they better, who knows but there service is 10x faster, I just had two shocks rebuilt, changed valving and put different rod ends on. Dropped off on a Monday, pick-up up wed, this would have taken a month with Shannon.
Click to expand...

Bahhh, I took my shocks to Joel on a Saturday at 10 am, and picked them up at 11 am , same day! hahahaha

Its all about good contact people. Fortunately, Joel has done great for our 16 class race team, as well as our personal rides. I am sure King give you plentyof love with the good contact you musthave with them Rich.... its all good. I am a BILSH-TEEN lover myself!

By the way.... some snap shots of good new COOOL stuff:
Piggybacks1.jpg


Piggybacks2.jpg
 
I've been kicking around an idea to cut a hole(where the stock upper mount bushings sit) just big enough to clear the top shock eye, and weld tabs above the inner fender, so instead of loosing that inch to the T&J shock mount, you pick up a little. Unfortunately, without cutting a hole bigger then the shock body, I don't think, I'd pick up much length. Probably more trouble than it's worth.
 
Man... I gotta give it up for Bilstein once again!

After spending quite a bit of time on the phone with Joel from Bilstein, I've decided on what I'm going to run. What I've decided to run isn't nearly as important as the process we went through to decide. Joel called me the other day, and we talked a little bit about what I wanted to do, and the pros vs. cons of this vs. that. Once again he filled me with a wealth of information, and broke it down in an easy to understand lingo.

We talked about possible shock mounting positions, and doing something different than the norm, and how we could get away with certain things. He talked to me about the screw top vs. weld top, and that they no longer offer a weld top. He also talked to me about building some custom shocks. On one hand, I could have a badass set of magic shocks, that were as long as 10" shocks, but pulled 12" of travel. The downside of this, is that everything would be custom machined and one off built, which Joel had no problem doing, however if I ever break something, it won't be as easy as finding his trailer to get another part! I'd be done for the weekend, or carry spares. We got off the phone, and I had some thinking to do, I slept on it and decided I needed to go cycle my suspension to see what I had to work with.

So today rolls along, and I wake up to a voicemail. This man CALLED T&J's himself, and talked through some things with them out of his own curiousity. He talked to the guys there about the geometry and different mounting etc, bouncing ideas off some more people. It's awesome to me that Joel went out of his way to do this, he's a busy as hell guy! And then called me with this info, to help make a decision. Mind you it was around 3:30 that we finally decided what shocks to run. Joel had to leave at 4:00... he was going to build my shocks, right then and there in a half hour! How's that for a wait! I doubt KING would have my shocks done that quick ;) Hahaha jfwy Rich. I told him not to worry about it, I'm not in a hurry, and we'll figure it out tomorrow. I just wanted to fill you all in on WHY I do, and always will from this point on run Bilstein's on anything I own. Their customer service is TOP NOTCH, for me, a guy who DOES NOT race, and who Joel owes nothing to.
 
Interesting info. I'm going to be looking for shocks soon myself. Something in the 2.5 inch, 10" travel variety and as short as I an find. Just a quick perusal of the various on-line catalogs turned up the 9100 weld-top significantly shorter then everyone else. Really not happy to hear they're discontinuing the weld-top option. I could really use that extra 2 inches.
 
crazyjim said:
Man... I gotta give it up for Bilstein once again!

After spending quite a bit of time on the phone with Joel from Bilstein, I've decided on what I'm going to run. What I've decided to run isn't nearly as important as the process we went through to decide. Joel called me the other day, and we talked a little bit about what I wanted to do, and the pros vs. cons of this vs. that. Once again he filled me with a wealth of information, and broke it down in an easy to understand lingo.

We talked about possible shock mounting positions, and doing something different than the norm, and how we could get away with certain things. He talked to me about the screw top vs. weld top, and that they no longer offer a weld top. He also talked to me about building some custom shocks. On one hand, I could have a badass set of magic shocks, that were as long as 10" shocks, but pulled 12" of travel. The downside of this, is that everything would be custom machined and one off built, which Joel had no problem doing, however if I ever break something, it won't be as easy as finding his trailer to get another part! I'd be done for the weekend, or carry spares. We got off the phone, and I had some thinking to do, I slept on it and decided I needed to go cycle my suspension to see what I had to work with.

So today rolls along, and I wake up to a voicemail. This man CALLED T&J's himself, and talked through some things with them out of his own curiousity. He talked to the guys there about the geometry and different mounting etc, bouncing ideas off some more people. It's awesome to me that Joel went out of his way to do this, he's a busy as hell guy! And then called me with this info, to help make a decision. Mind you it was around 3:30 that we finally decided what shocks to run. Joel had to leave at 4:00... he was going to build my shocks, right then and there in a half hour! How's that for a wait! I doubt KING would have my shocks done that quick ;) Hahaha jfwy Rich. I told him not to worry about it, I'm not in a hurry, and we'll figure it out tomorrow. I just wanted to fill you all in on WHY I do, and always will from this point on run Bilstein's on anything I own. Their customer service is TOP NOTCH, for me, a guy who DOES NOT race, and who Joel owes nothing to.
Click to expand...



BOOOM!!! That's stellar service!
 
FatCity said:
I've always heard good things about Bilstein. Makes me wonder why I'm on week 6 and still waiting for my coil-overs and bypasses from King....:sure:
Click to expand...

Switch over Eric!! I am sure you could sell your Kings, pick up Bilsteins for that costs, and get some tuning put in ;)
 
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