rock krawler long arm

[GirlScout1]

Man sorry I missed all this but I had a date night planned with the wife-e-poo (we went to see Fun With Dick And Jane...it was good) but my kit will be going on my XJ on the 7th. I will be doing a write up as well as taking pictures of the install. I wheel out here in the PNW and with guys that run Claytons, TnT, Rusty's and Full Traction. I have hemmed and hawed about which way to go for a long time and finally decided on this. Avanteone from here will be helping me with the install (same guy who did the write up for Phat on his Claytons). We have talked quite a bit and the bottomline is...i'm going to be the PNW guinnea pig for this. Sure the clearance isn't there the way TnT and Claytons are tucked but it will get the job done. When it comes to bashing those arms? I doubt it.

Bing Bing-The roads out there in MA are not much worse than the PNW. Trust me, i'm a native of MA and have lived all over the world. Those roads are like a runway compared to some in other countries...well except for the Big Dig project of course :gag:

 

[mack]

....

 

[RCP Phx]

as a comment on what I do understand and have experienced.

A radius arm setup actually puts the pinion angle in a more disireable angle through out the travel cycle. That is of course of you have a CV type front driveshaft...

Thats correct,there should be "little to No" change throughout the suspension cylce.With my set-up my CA's are the same length as the driveshaft and mounted parallel to the drive shaft(you can see it in the pic).I get Zero pinion rotation and the slip-yoke also doesnt move,either compression or extension.

 

[Eagle]

Sure 3 point= less binding and more flex thoughout where as radius binds alot more. Also TnT kits and Clayton have been notorious for clearance issues and hitting on the driveshaft.

I don't know anything about the TnT kit but a lot of the guys in the North Atlantic Chapter (as well as the local club I belong to) run the Clayton's kit, and I have heard nothing about either clearance issues or hitting the driveshaft. So I don't think it's exactly accurate to say they are "notorious" for those issues.

Care to elaborate? I know for a fact that Clayton's arms don't hit the driveshaft. If it's a case of something else hitting the driveshaft, or the driveshaft hitting the floor pan, that seems to me to be more a function of total lift height and total articulation, and fairly independent of whose long arm kit is used.

 

[Capt. Nemo]

Sure 3 point= less binding and more flex thoughout where as radius binds alot more. Also TnT kits and Clayton have been notorious for clearance issues and hitting on the driveshaft.

Well, after searching for two days here on Naxja and at least four other boards, and in addition to good old Yahoo! and Google - I can't find a single mention of any clearance problems with either Clayton's or TnT's front long arm kits. No pics, no tech articles, no posts, no references, no nothing.


The above quote, therefore, is a load of BS and misinformation.

 

[HoodRichXJ]

I don't know any thing about the other kits mentioned, but I have had the RK kit for a year now and my only real complaint is that it is loud on the road, and if it gets really rough, it'll feel like your teeth want to jump out of your jaw. I blew out one of the joints that came in my kit and reaplaced them all with their heavier duty threaded retainer style joint. I have yet to damage one of those. The arms flex fairly well almost too much but like other the suspension needs properly set up using limit straps etc. Just my two cents. -steve

 

[tompatjr]

as a comment on what I do understand and have experienced.

A radius arm setup actually puts the pinion angle in a more disireable angle through out the travel cycle. That is of course of you have a CV type front driveshaft...

But, caster is changed to a greater degree with a radius are setup. I'm not saying one is better than the other, they both compromise in cetrain areas.

 

[tealcherokee]

a 3 link is better if its set up correctly, you can get the perfect mix of pinion angle change and castor change, well obviously none would be perfect, but, by changing the mounting point of the upper, you can change how the axle rotates, my upper is mounted low and close to the lower, because i have a LP axle and im trying to minimize the angle on that u joint...... so if this is hard to read, long day

 

[Mrburns]

my search=......TnT Y-link!!!

:worship:

 

[Rock Yacht]

Well, after searching for two days here on Naxja and at least four other boards, and in addition to good old Yahoo! and Google - I can't find a single mention of any clearance problems with either Clayton's or TnT's front long arm kits. No pics, no tech articles, no posts, no references, no nothing.


The above quote, therefore, is a load of BS and misinformation.

Kind of what I was thinking. Matt6669 has a habbit of comparing apples (RK) to oranges (T&T). Both kits have their respective place and application. Compare all the features, choose your poison.

You will find mention of the UCA hitting the driveshaft and/or yoke at full stuff of the Dside tire here and there. This issue is due to improper install of the Ylink kit. Set the caster to factory spec as instructed and no problems.

 

[GirlScout1]

I knew it was at full stuff but could not recall the specifics. One thing I will say about the TnT products is they are top notch and don't want anything to hit the street or trail until THEY have done it first. I believe their theory is if anyone dies using it it should be us. Rather than just shoving a product out the door, it's good, solid R&D. I will be ordering a front bumper from them hopefully within the next two weeks.

 

[stupidfast]

deffanatly sounds like the 3 link would be easyer to make. deffanatly not going to buy any kit.. lol im broke. but i would rather make a two radius longarms and lose some flex than have to worry about all of this. its proven that dual radius arms work just fine.

 

[ROCKREADYXJ]

FALSE, Clayton now has there own Springs and other parts, i've seen claytons kits on Tj's and Xj's in action and they work very well and get insane flex.

False they buy all that stuff from RockKrawler ask mr walters or adam they will bash RK and sell there stuff but claim its good

 

[matt6669]

Kind of what I was thinking. Matt6669 has a habbit of comparing apples (RK) to oranges (T&T). Both kits have their respective place and application. Compare all the features, choose your poison.

I really wouldn't say its comparing apples to oranges at all. They both have their pro's and con's. Both perform its just a matter of deciding. But if you don't put a side by side comparsion how is anyone going to know the difference between the two..........?
Comparing a toyota tacoma to say a jeep wrangler is like comparing apples to oranges, by no means is comparing a 3-link to a radius arm setup like that.

I feel bad for RK because they are the only one with the guts to go out and be ballsy and try something different. IIRC they are the only company making a 3-link setup (correct me if im wrong) Their the only one's willing enough to put their own R&D into a product to advance the sport. Pretty much any company can take something like a radius arm setup and make a few changes to it and call it their own. I feel bad because a lot of people give the rk setup crap b/c it is a 3 link and its not the normal. Sometimes people need to think OUTSIDE the box and no always inside the box. but to each their own. ill run what i want to run, and everyone else will run what they want to run.

Matt

 

[ROCKREADYXJ]

Well, after searching for two days here on Naxja and at least four other boards, and in addition to good old Yahoo! and Google - I can't find a single mention of any clearance problems with either Clayton's or TnT's front long arm kits. No pics, no tech articles, no posts, no references, no nothing.


The above quote, therefore, is a load of BS and misinformation.

We have installed quite a range of different kits and I would agree with you on that I have never heard of any ones kit hitting a drive shaft in a Claytons kit.

I could see it to be a problem if someone home brewed thier axle and the mounts were in the wrong spot but I have never heard of such a complaint.

However I am partial to the RK kits Out of all the kits I have installed and sold they get the least amount of complaints.

 

[scorpion]

Feelin' kinda froggy tonight...

I really wouldn't say its comparing apples to oranges at all. They both have their pro's and con's. Both perform its just a matter of deciding. But if you don't put a side by side comparsion how is anyone going to know the difference between the two..........?
Comparing a toyota tacoma to say a jeep wrangler is like comparing apples to oranges, by no means is comparing a 3-link to a radius arm setup like that.

So when are you actually going to put them side by side? YOu've posted so many freakin' times about this great kit and never once offered up anything other than how cheap you can get someone a kit for...which makes you an employee of the company or someone doing it for profit (middle man) so you must have some facts no?

I feel bad for RK because they are the only one with the guts to go out and be ballsy and try something different.

Different? They took a 3-link which, unless I'm wrong, has been around for longer than they have existed as a business, and made some simple little brackets to mount the arms to an XJ unibody. That's "different"? That's "ballsy"?

IIRC they are the only company making a 3-link setup (correct me if im wrong)

You're not wrong. More than likely others have not decided to build them because they're extremely risky when it comes to liabilty. You have a single upper control arm. Lose one and you've got none. Anyone having done real R&D would have figured out that redundancy is the only way to go. Every other industry swears by it.

Their the only one's willing enough to put their own R&D into a product to advance the sport.

Again...brackets aren't advancing the sport. Novel ideas do. You're not saying that making some brackets are more novel than making high-clearance arms and an extreme duty belly pan with integrated tranny mount are you?

Pretty much any company can take something like a radius arm setup and make a few changes to it and call it their own.

Again a 3-link is old technology not invented by RK. A radius arm setup, though you may not know this, wasn't originally designed by Rubicon Express. It was used by Ford long before Rubicon Express even existed and likely used by another company prior to Ford. See there are truely only a few novel ideas in this world and the rest are just new twists on old ideas.
Is Net-Flix really that different than Blockbuster video? They're both video rental stores only ones e-based and the other has physical locations. See the twist? Many people consider the twist as innovative since most original concepts happend so long ago that they've become common-place.

I feel bad because a lot of people give the rk setup crap b/c it is a 3 link and its not the normal. Sometimes people need to think OUTSIDE the box and no always inside the box. but to each their own. ill run what i want to run, and everyone else will run what they want to run.

Matt

Obviously I'm biased as to which is better but you seem to be a little coy about your stake in the deal. For some reason you're posting in many forums as some type of middle man (maybe even an employee) so I don't think your opinion about thinking outside the box really counts as you're obviously backing a company for your own profit instead of to share real facts. I'm skeptical if you really feel badly for them. It's more likely that you're using every attempt to speak fondly of them to aid in your drumming up of sales. Cool though, to each his own.

Matt6669, every company has customers that will swear by them up and down almost blindly. If you want to defend this product then I urge you do so by using facts instead of pointless jibberish...

 

[mack]

well said!...:worship: :worship: :worship: .
OWNED!

 

[Mike L]

well said!...:worship: :worship: :worship: .
OWNED!

X2

 

[matt6669]

So when are you actually going to put them side by side? YOu've posted so many freakin' times about this great kit and never once offered up anything other than how cheap you can get someone a kit for...which makes you an employee of the company or someone doing it for profit (middle man) so you must have some facts no?

When will i put them side to side and compare them. NEVER, because you'll never find me paying 900 dollars for something that i can get for 400 and do the same exact thing but better. And how have i never offered anything about how well the kit has performed. I've gave real world experience both off road and on road about how well the kit has performed. I've even seen this kit perform in nuroc and saw it do extremely well and have stated this. What more would you like me to put up here showing and telling how well this kit does..............?

Also i love people like you that automatically assume stuff and just make yourself look stupid. I'm in no way a middle man and i am NOT MAKING A PROFIT off of anything that i sell on here. I have no reason to make a profit off of referring people to the company that they are buying from. So before you start shooting crap out onto the internet maybe you should find out the facts before posting them. The only reason i refer people to my buddy is becuase i believe in the rk kit that much. It's not becuase im making a profit so therefore my opinion is definietly not jaded. I can sell any kit that any retailer can get there hands on. Do you see me pushing re stuff, NO because i personally think there stuff is garbage as i have used it. So don't go on here saying ohh the only reason i say such good stuff about rk is because im making a profit off of it becuase thats total bull. Like i said next time learn the facts before you go shooting stuff all over the internet.

Different? They took a 3-link which, unless I'm wrong, has been around for longer than they have existed as a business, and made some simple little brackets to mount the arms to an XJ unibody. That's "different"? That's "ballsy"?
You're not wrong. More than likely others have not decided to build them because they're extremely risky when it comes to liabilty. You have a single upper control arm. Lose one and you've got none. Anyone having done real R&D would have figured out that redundancy is the only way to go. Every other industry swears by it.

If built right the single upper arm is the same exact as a dual upper just that you don't get the binding and all the other problems associated with a radius arm setup. If your using strong enough components for the upper arm there is no reason that you should be left broken down. All i do is carry an extra joint just incase.

Again...brackets aren't advancing the sport. Novel ideas do. You're not saying that making some brackets are more novel than making high-clearance arms and an extreme duty belly pan with integrated tranny mount are you?

Ohhh yes i just love the idea of their integrated belly pan. Brilliant idea, now when you want to do the transfer case fluid what do you have to do, drop entire pan. That sounds like a ball of fun to me. Also whats the point of bent arms. I would rather have really strong straight arms then bent arms. The reason being, i would rather have my entire truck sit on my lca's than have my truck with bent arms and now if im on a rock, instead of resting on my lca's im resting on my front driveshaft. Hmmmm lets see, lets rest on solid steel arms and have my front ds be fine, or lets use the ohh so pretty "high clearence" arms and now im resting on my thin front ds. Yup i find that innovative your right.

Obviously I'm biased as to which is better but you seem to be a little coy about your stake in the deal. For some reason you're posting in many forums as some type of middle man (maybe even an employee) so I don't think your opinion about thinking outside the box really counts as you're obviously backing a company for your own profit instead of to share real facts. I'm skeptical if you really feel badly for them. It's more likely that you're using every attempt to speak fondly of them to aid in your drumming up of sales. Cool though, to each his own.

Like i said above posting again before actually knowing what your talking about. Also like i said above i make no profit off of anything that i sell anywhere so there is no drumming up or coying or any other way you want to phrase it. So when it boils down to it, what im saying is infact my opinion and theres no jadeness to it at all since im gaining NOTHING. And i use every attempt to tell the TRUE facts about the rk kits. Not the bull that everyone posts about the gen 1 stuff. The problem is theres too many web wheelers around that hear stuff and go and post it. So i try and keep the facts straight where i can. Not drumming up anything, telling it exactly how it is. If you find one post of mine where i havn't told the truth about rk's product i will be more than happy to admit that i was wrong and ill even edit the post.

Matt6669, every company has customers that will swear by them up and down almost blindly. If you want to defend this product then I urge you do so by using facts instead of pointless jibberish...

Once again where is the pointless jibberish. How have i not used facts to defend rk's product. I've given first hand the benefits and disadvantages of rk's kit on almost all of my posts soooooo how havn't i used facts. I must be posting in a different language that you can not read then hmmmmmmmmm

Matt

 

[Capt. Nemo]

I'd really like to see some pics of the RK kit in action. Not just flex shots, but real trail runs where the kit is being put through its paces. I've been wheeling for quite a few years, met many people, and seen numerous different types of rigs - I've NEVER come across this kit on the trail. I've seen it on two ZJ's at a local meet and greet, but never on the trail.

BTW, I believe the revised edition of the TnT kit has access ports to allow the draining of the t-case fluid without dropping the entire x-member.