Rainwater. Illegal to collect

[NW-ZJ-SCOTT]

http://www.survival-spot.com/surviv...g-government-claims-ownership-over-our-water/

:doh:

 

[ChiXJeff]

There's a fair amount of FUD there. A lot of that isn't new, riparian laws in the western US are complex and not as well known as they should be. Just because you end up with water on your land doesn't mean that you can collect, store or divert it.

 

[jeepdreamer]

It may not be new but its still a load of crap! Your land you paid for...but you only get the dirt, sorry. What next... Charge for the air that flows through your property? Maybe fine you if you kill a bug on your own kitchen table. Oh... and since the dirt you bought contains trace minerals...well, sorry. Governments gotta take that too.
Socialist bunch of BS IMHO. We need less government, not more! Less hand outs and more willing to sweat to prosper.

 

[Darky]

It may not be new but its still a load of crap! Your land you paid for...but you only get the dirt, sorry. What next... Charge for the air that flows through your property? Maybe fine you if you kill a bug on your own kitchen table. Oh... and since the dirt you bought contains trace minerals...well, sorry. Governments gotta take that too.
Socialist bunch of BS IMHO. We need less government, not more! Less hand outs and more willing to sweat to prosper.

Water is a complex issue. If you could divert, store, whatever any and all water that hit your property, upstream farmers would bankrupt downstream farmers. Not everyone has groundwater to pump or if they do, it's not infinite. If you're interested in the water history of the west (which is surprisingly interesting, just might make you really hate the gov't...) read Cadillac Desert. Great book, and it really gives you an idea of how vital water is to our pork barrel.

 

[rockclimber]

It may not be new but its still a load of crap! Your land you paid for...but you only get the dirt, sorry. What next... Charge for the air that flows through your property? Maybe fine you if you kill a bug on your own kitchen table. Oh... and since the dirt you bought contains trace minerals...well, sorry. Governments gotta take that too.
Socialist bunch of BS IMHO. We need less government, not more! Less hand outs and more willing to sweat to prosper.

while I think that outlawing rainwater collection is a bit extreme and, since it can't be enforced, pointless.

you do not have the right to divert or collect the water running through your property.

clean fresh water is one of the most finite resources on this planet if everyone could manipulate the water on their property however they wished our society would die.

 

[vetteboy]

I think all the water stuff out there is pretty interesting...I've always been a sucker for dams/waterfalls/viaducts/etc. More from the mechanical & physical side than politcal though.

The Mulholland Dam story is pretty interesting as well.

 

[Boatwrench]

I think all the water stuff out there is pretty interesting...I've always been a sucker for dams/waterfalls/viaducts/etc. More from the mechanical & physical side than politcal though.

The Mulholland Dam story is pretty interesting as well.

You'll enjoy this book. I suggest getting it from the library. The 1st couple of chapters talk abouth the different water companies in San Francisco. Kind of ironic that as liberal as San Francisco is now, 100 years ago they had a valley that was suppose to be as beautiful as Yosemite Valley dammed up for a reservoir. I just finished the 1st chapter and it made sense as to why the different neighborhoods got their names.

Another book from the same area is 'They Fell the Redwoods" Great story and lots of photos of a miles long flume to move large Sequoia Rewoods from the mountains to the sawmill. There were some great trails for an expedition equipped XJ to go explore in search of flume remnants.

 

[Milford Cubicle II]

Water is a complex issue. If you could divert, store, whatever any and all water that hit your property, upstream farmers would bankrupt downstream farmers.

How do you figure? Do you even know how much water farming actually uses?

Farming uses a TINY fraction of the water in an area. There's no chance of "upstream farmers bankrupting downstream farmers."

 

[dsdtdemon]

This article is ridiculously over-sensationalized, (like anything political on either side of the fence).
It's written to get people up in arms that home rainwater collection (like that shown in the title picture). But that is not the spirit of law, and in some cases, not even the letter of the law.

In Colorado, two new laws were recently passed that exempt certain small-scale rainwater collection systems, like the kind people might install on their homes, from collection restrictions.

The intent is to prevent large companies from interfering the hydro cycle on a large scale.

And then there's the last section...

[edit: I can't proof-read to save my life]

 

[iwannadie]

while I think that outlawing rainwater collection is a bit extreme and, since it can't be enforced, pointless.

you do not have the right to divert or collect the water running through your property.

clean fresh water is one of the most finite resources on this planet if everyone could manipulate the water on their property however they wished our society would die.

A bit(well a lot) Doomsday but who is to say in 100 years from now water becomes very scarce in places(like here in arizona). The price of water would go up as would demand while people look for another source. Rain, collecting the rain provides free water in replace of high price water. The people missing out on selling high price water need a way to control it. Make rain collecting illegal and enforce it by flying over houses to find possible collectors. Yes that would be a crazy extreme but if their is something to be profited off of, people will try.

 

[JohnX]

I think the idea of not diverting or using flowing water across your land is pretty straight forward, however the idea of it being illegal to collect rain water before it even hits the grounds sounds like fair game to me. The law just needs some adjustment...like most laws.

 

[westvirginia24976]

How do you figure? Do you even know how much water farming actually uses?

Farming uses a TINY fraction of the water in an area. There's no chance of "upstream farmers bankrupting downstream farmers."

Milford, you are just plain wrong on that.

 

[Milford Cubicle II]

Go ahead and post some numbers then.

 

[Customizer1000]

Well if the gov wants to fine people for collecting rain water, those people need to sue the gov for letting it fall on their land without permission!

 

[AwesomeXJ]

It rains so much here in the pacific northwest that everyone could catch and store RAIN WATER that fell on their property and it would do no harm.

It's summer and it rained a little today. I truly believe that the majority of you fail to realize just how much water we have up here.

So I pay for the water into my home. Then pay for the same water that leaves my home. Now you say I should pay for the water that falls on my home, if I try to catch it. Try this one out. In the city of Portland OR where NW_zj_scott lives there is a rain runoff tax on all home owners for the rain that falls on their roof, travels through their gutters and down into the cities storm drain system. Owning a house boat. (for those who don't know. A house boat is a floating house on our water ways.) Does not exempt you from paying the tax. Everyone has to pay the tax. Now is you disconnect your gutter from the storm drain or otherwise catch and store the rain runoff you may be fined or worse. Explain to me the reasoning for all this non northwesterners. Please explain.

 

[Customizer1000]

Wow, our country at its finest

 

[Darky]

How do you figure? Do you even know how much water farming actually uses?

Farming uses a TINY fraction of the water in an area. There's no chance of "upstream farmers bankrupting downstream farmers."

Where do you live? Back east, it's very different from the west. Much of the west is desert. I can tell you that a farmer in Idaho uses 10 acre-feet of water in a year. I can also tell you that the large majority of the water being doled out from the Colorado River to the various states party to the Colorado river compact use that water for farm irrigation. Most of the water being diverted from the Owens River Valley and the Feather River (the latter via gigantic aqueducts and monstrous pumps to push the water up and over the Tehachapi mountains) by LA goes to farm irrigation.

 

[dsdtdemon]

It rains so much here in the pacific northwest that everyone could catch and store RAIN WATER that fell on their property and it would do no harm.

It's summer and it rained a little today. I truly believe that the majority of you fail to realize just how much water we have up here.

So I pay for the water into my home. Then pay for the same water that leaves my home. Now you say I should pay for the water that falls on my home, if I try to catch it. Try this one out. In the city of Portland OR where NW_zj_scott lives there is a rain runoff tax on all home owners for the rain that falls on their roof, travels through their gutters and down into the cities storm drain system. Owning a house boat. (for those who don't know. A house boat is a floating house on our water ways.) Does not exempt you from paying the tax. Everyone has to pay the tax. Now is you disconnect your gutter from the storm drain or otherwise catch and store the rain runoff you may be fined or worse. Explain to me the reasoning for all this non northwesterners. Please explain.

This is completely incorrect.
From the state of Oregon's website http://cms.oregon.egov.com/owrd/pages/pubs/aquabook_laws.aspx:

Some uses of water are exempt from the requirement to obtain a permit. These are called “exempt uses.”

Exempt uses of surface water include:

...

7. Rainwater: collection and use of rainwater from an artificial impervious surface (like a parking lot or a building’s roof).

 

[Milford Cubicle II]

I can tell you that a farmer in Idaho uses 10 acre-feet of water in a year.

And I can tell you that even a small stream delivers 10 acre-feet of water every few days. A decent sized river delivers that every few hours.

Not to mention it totally depends on what you're farming, your particular setup, how big your farm is, and the climate/weather. To say "a farmer in Idaho uses 10 acre-feet of water in a year" means practically nothing.

 

[rockclimber]

A bit(well a lot) Doomsday but who is to say in 100 years from now water becomes very scarce in places(like here in arizona). The price of water would go up as would demand while people look for another source. Rain, collecting the rain provides free water in replace of high price water. The people missing out on selling high price water need a way to control it. Make rain collecting illegal and enforce it by flying over houses to find possible collectors. Yes that would be a crazy extreme but if their is something to be profited off of, people will try.

100 years? try 10. fresh water is more scarce than oil. the next wars will be fought over water, and they will be fought on our own soil.

another reason to not collect rainwater on a massive scale is that it is detrimental to the ecosystem. if we collect all of the water and it does not run off the ground into streams and rivers, those streams and rivers cannot support the life in them, they cannot transport the vital nutrients downstream to the flood plains, etc etc etc.

And I can tell you that even a small stream delivers 10 acre-feet of water every few days. A decent sized river delivers that every few hours.

and if a private company bought enough land, they could build a damn and hold all of that water hostage. that is the point.

obviously there is nothing wrong with small scale rainwater collecting. but that isn't, or shouldn't be, illegal. but there has to be a line somewhere.



I especially liked the part of this part of the article

a true indicator of what little freedom we actually have here in the U.S.

the writer of this article really needs some perspective. the amount of freedom we DO have in this country is so far beyond what any other human being in this world experiences...