No charges against Alaska man who shot attackers in self defense

[Matthew Currie]

I would imagine to get a 'conceal/carry' permit the man had to complete some sort of training, correct? (I don't know much about these laws...) If in this training, the man was taught to shoot D.C.M. and keep going until the threat is gone, he acted with considerable restraint. Three kids slamming your head in a car door, coming after you... I honestly don't know what I'd do.

I wish the best for both victims; the shooter, and the kid's family.

Liberals and conservatives alike benefit from a bracing dose of theory versus results.

Google "Vermont carry" for the gun law that works.

 

[Powerman]

I know what you’re saying; I wouldn’t say that to the cops, or investigators.

I am sick of the home owner or law abider having to explain his actions. Somehow just going about your day isn’t good enough it is now my duty to detain, restrain, and go out of my way to protect and not harm violent criminals in the mind of trial lawyers. It’s not my job. Cops don’t have any responsibility to protect me from crime. NONE. They only have to investigate it. No guarantee anything will come from it either. I’m not even 30 yet and I long for the "good ole days" I have only heard about. I don’t believe it’s a coincidence that they pursue home owners with such vigor and the streets are over run with criminals. Fighting back when you have no other recourse at the moment has somehow become criminal, where-as being a life long violent criminal is really not a life changing as it is to the law abider who fights back. It’s gotten to be a very perverse situation.

Who do I sue when I get car jacked? Or I get mugged? Where’s my millions?
I live in a very very nice neighborhood and I cant get local cops to even enforce hit and run laws, or vandalism of my vehicle (both of which I witnessed). I can only imagine what would happen if I was mugged and beaten in with in the city limits Detroit. Nothing would happen to the mugger. But damn me to hell if I try to fight back.

I don’t know what a lawyer would get, if I give away all my crap or declare bankruptcy. Ill give my business to a family member, and have no income just like the common street thug. Sure sue me i dont give a fawk. I will go on state aid just like you .. ya degenerate. I will still be walking, hopefully they will be dead or paralyzed (hope dead but I don’t want the state to pay for his care if he is crippled so I am wishing death, no $250,000 surgeries on the tax payers bill).

I only care about walking away and being healthy, and my family, friends safety. I can be happy on very very little, and have friends and family that would support me anyways. Not to mention giving them my business and setting up a trust for my self, or having a safety deposit box full of cash or something to live on for years. They can sue me, ill declare bankruptsy. Never pay the "victims family" a dime, and a few years latter my life will be back to knormal. Thats a very easy decision for me versus being wheel chair boud or worse.

You might want to consider switching to decaf. The police and DA said he commited no crime. A defense attorney can ATTEMPT to seek damages, but it still has to go to a jury. Do you really think the family will ever see a dime? Not hardly. And yes, I agree that this society of ours is too happy to seek damages for anything bad, but it isn't like filling out a form, and cashing in.

His family is simply upset that their son is dead. Agrivated assault is not a capital crime, so it is shocking to his parents. I personally see absolutely nothing wrong with the home owner's actions and I'm glad I'm not him.

 

[XJPhoenix]

The problem is that even if the family never sees a dime, the legal cost of defending himself will most likely hurt Mr. Schneider quite a bit. These things can go on for years, and run up quite a tab.

 

[Powerman]

True, and I have always been all for "looser pays"

 

[Crash_AF]

Well, as I posted originally, AK has a law in place to discourage/prevent lawsuits for self defense so I'm pretty sure he's safe from that. While I agree that you have every right to defend yourself and shoot until the threat is over, be very careful about what you say on an open forum on the internet. If (god forbid) you are ever put in Mr Schneider's situation and the victim's family sees that you advocating shoot to kill, not to stop the threat you are opening yourself up to a civil suit. If you declare bankruptcy and they see evidence that you planned to do that to prevent collection of court ordered reparations, you will go to jail for contempt.

This was posted on the gun forum by Mr Schneider about the aftermath of a shooting.

I hope this information can help someone one day although I hope none of you are ever in a situation like mine. If you are I hope this helps.
After I fired the second shot all three of them started running away. The one I hit in the shoulder and the one I didn't shoot ran one way and the one I shot in the chest stumbled into the street and fell down in front of my neighbors house. I immediately set my gun down on the trunk of my car and dialed 911 on my cell phone. I gave the operator all the information they requested. My neighbors cared for the kid who was down which allowed me to totally focus on getting an ambulance and the police on their way. I distanced myself from my gun. I waited until both the police officers and 911 told me to hang up my cell phone. I kept my arms up and let an officer put my cell phone in my pocket. They put me in handcuffs (standard procedure) and led me away from the scene. I then gave them as much information about the other two guys as I could recall. I remained as calm as I could. Medics came and started cleaning up my face, but there was another call and I told them to go take care of that call. I then was taken to the police station where the handcuffs were removed. I spent the rest of the night explaining to the cops what happened. I never was under arrest, but I've been told I probabally should have had a lawyer. It was there at the station that I learned that the kid had died. I had been praying like crazy that he would live.
Once They finished with me they took me by my house to get a change of clothes and then gave me a ride to where I usually meet some friends for breakfast on thursdays. The police were still processing the scene and weren't able to release my car to me yet. My friends showed up after a while and I told them what happened. We prayed and then they started firuring out how to help me. They called a couple leaders at our church and my church provided me help in various ways. I learned just how good of friends I had. I encourage all of you to make sure you have a few really good friends in your life that you can lean on in a crisis. I hope this helps someone.

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26547&page=7

It's easy to talk about defending yourself with deadly force, but this quote should be a soboring dose of reality for those who think it is easy.

Disclaimer - These statements are directed at noone in particular, just the overall theme I have noticed from several different discussions concerning this subject.

Later,
Joe

 

[Rob Mayercik]

Aggravated assault is not a capital crime

It isn't? Why not? Doesn't the "aggravated" part mean that there is definite malicious intent? I'm not a laywer or LEO - can you elucidate?

That aside, I'd be more inclined to call that those kids did attempted manslaughter or attempted murder - do you really think they'd have cared if they had killed him? After all, it doesn't take much to die from complications relating to a concussion, and I'd be surprised if this guy didn't have one from them slamming the car door on his noggin...

Nice to see that this guy isn't getting railroaded for defending himself.

Rob

 

[kubtastic]

True, and I have always been all for "looser pays"

who's looser?

 

[Powerman]

It isn't? Why not? Doesn't the "aggravated" part mean that there is definite malicious intent? I'm not a laywer or LEO - can you elucidate?

That aside, I'd be more inclined to call that those kids did attempted manslaughter or attempted murder - do you really think they'd have cared if they had killed him? After all, it doesn't take much to die from complications relating to a concussion, and I'd be surprised if this guy didn't have one from them slamming the car door on his noggin...

Nice to see that this guy isn't getting railroaded for defending himself.

Rob

Assault is a beating. Aggravated is with a weapon which the door could be considered one.

I have been jumped by strangers before. Got my ass whooped. I don't think they need the chair for it. No body seeks the death penalty for assault, and I don't think it warrants it.

I carried for a while cause I got into an altercation with some maniac. However, there is a lot of responsibility that comes with that decision. After a while, I figured the chance of me getting my ass whooped was not worth the legal and financial ramifications of possibly a bad shooting. It is a personal decision, and others are free to make their own.

I'm not defending these kids. Slamming his head was a definite escalation. Attacking him at his home was another. I would have feared for my life at that point. It does not "seem" like they had any intent on killing him. As I said, I have absolutely no problems with his actions and I would have done the same. But "IF" all they were doing was assaulting him, or robbing him, those are not capital crimes. I can understand why the kids family is upset. Even the shooter understands they are grieving, and we have no idea what kind of folks they are.

The bottom line is that the shooter had no moral, or legal obligation to wait and find out what their intentions were. I have no problem with what he did. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

 

[Powerman]

who's looser?

You know what I mean. If you bring a law suit and loose, you pay "all" legal fees. The exact opposite of what we have now and what the Lawyers Asso. has fought against for decades. People would only bring suits if they had a reasonable chance of winning. No lawyer would touch this case for the family if it were looser pays. But that is a whole other topic.....

 

[motorcityxj]

Assault is a beating. Aggravated is with a weapon which the door could be considered one.

I have been jumped by strangers before. Got my ass whooped. I don't think they need the chair for it. No body seeks the death penalty for assault, and I don't think it warrants it.

I carried for a while cause I got into an altercation with some maniac. However, there is a lot of responsibility that comes with that decision. After a while, I figured the chance of me getting my ass whooped was not worth the legal and financial ramifications of possibly a bad shooting. It is a personal decision, and others are free to make their own.

I'm not defending these kids. Slamming his head was a definite escalation. Attacking him at his home was another. I would have feared for my life at that point. It does not "seem" like they had any intent on killing him. As I said, I have absolutely no problems with his actions and I would have done the same. But "IF" all they were doing was assaulting him, or robbing him, those are not capital crimes. I can understand why the kids family is upset. Even the shooter understands they are grieving, and we have no idea what kind of folks they are.

The bottom line is that the shooter had no moral, or legal obligation to wait and find out what their intentions were. I have no problem with what he did. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

any time another person is starting physicall stuff with me i have to assume they are out to kill me, or its a distinct possiblitity it will end that way with me being gang stomped and left for dead in my own piss and blood. Simple assault is easy to levey as a charge after the fact. When a dude with a scowl on his face, crazy in his eyes, and a wrench in his hands is charging at me i have to assume he wants to beat me dead. Not gracefully knock me out and take my wallet.

In detroit people shoot you AFTER they have car jacked you. Its not good enough to have the victims loot, car etc, and an easy get away. This isnt the old west there is no honor, and these guys arent robin hoods , robbin' to feed the family. Its for drugs.

Nevermind the folks that will start crap for bumping them, scuffing their shoe, wearing the wrong color hat in the wrong 'hood, making a gesture that from a distance looks like a gang sign, the ghetto is increasingly "going to work" in the suburbs then zipping back home to the realative safety and ananimity of the wild wild west that is detroit.

 

[Powerman]

I understand what you are saying. Trust me, I don't live with Dick and Jane. A friend of mine had a guy run up on him when he was getting gas with a shotgun, shot him in the leg, THEN told him to give him his keys. Very hard to defend against. He lost 4 inches of bone above the knee and spent the next year and a half in a hospital. I know the kind of world we live in. I just choose not to live in fear for everyone that comes near.

 

[kubtastic]

You know what I mean. If you bring a law suit and loose, you pay "all" legal fees. The exact opposite of what we have now and what the Lawyers Asso. has fought against for decades. People would only bring suits if they had a reasonable chance of winning. No lawyer would touch this case for the family if it were looser pays. But that is a whole other topic.....

Just making sure it wasn't a typo.
Loser pays can suck just as much. If you bring a legit case up and someone throws down the best legal team known to man, you lose and double the damages. "reasonable" isn't a legal consideration I would make. The rich can play odds, but the poor have to play worst-case. Now, if everyone had a job to do and were busy, frivolous cases wouldn't appear. Idle hands sow problems or some crap like that.