Just having a little fun....ouch!

[langer1]

There is a MIG setup that will offer both strength and penetration
called Inner-shield it uses wire with a flux core and gas shielding.





This wire comes with the same AWS numbers as their stick counter part. This setup also can be reverse or straight polarity, which standard MIG can’t.



The last way and perhaps best would be TIG.



Looking at the failed weld, make sure that when you re-weld you leave a 1/6 gap and the end of the tube where it seats in the knuckle to allow for expansion.

I have seen good welds fail just like your picture because the tube was seated to deep. Also more wield is not necessarily a better wield.

 

[JeepFreak21]

You guys sure we want this forum open to everybody? :gag:
Billy

 

[Goatman]

Well, I guess I should answer this. I've written a couple of responses and then deleted them.

I guess he thinks I'm in kindergarten...........but it sounds like he is.

If it's a cast knuckle you will never get a good weld, and stick has much better penetration than a mig.

There is a MIG setup that will offer both strength and penetration called Inner-shield it uses wire with a flux core and gas shielding. This wire comes with the same AWS numbers as their stick counter part. This setup also can be reverse or straight polarity, which standard MIG can’t.

The last way and perhaps best would be TIG.

Ok, so make up your mind. You say I should use a stick....oh, but flux core wire in a MIG is just as good........but wait, TIG would be even better.

I guess for some reason I thought gas shielding with actual gas was usually better than welding with flux core, if the wind wasn't blowing too much. I didn't realize that you could weld reverse polarity with flux core, unlike my standard Miller 185 MIG with gas.........oh wait, I can weld reverse polarity with my Miller, even if I don't use flux core wire (I have no idea why I would want to weld with flux core, when I can weld with real gas). Hmmm........

Looking at the failed weld, make sure that when you re-weld you leave a 1/6 gap and the end of the tube where it seats in the knuckle to allow for expansion. I have seen good welds fail just like your picture because the tube was seated to deep.

Now, I have never heard this before. I would be tempted to listen to this advice, except for two reasons, actually three. First reason is that the previous advice is questionable at best, and innacurate at worst. Second reason is that I have no idea what expertise you have to make such comments, and some of your comments would suggest that you have no experince whatsoever. Third, I have trouble believing that an inner knuckle will expand 1/6" in it's cross section when preheated, with a very tight fit on 1/2" tube, yet you say you've seen them........maybe you could clue us in on your experince.

I don't mind learning, it's one of the reasons that many of us participate here, but you're going to have to make a lot more sense than you have so far if you want to teach us anything.

 

[JnJ]

Most of that looked "cut and paste"..........

 

[langer1]

As you can see It's been many years since I was a certified pressure pipe welder, I'm sure I have some of my term's mixed up.

As I was writing about the inter-shield system that was used in our shop, I also remembered our Aero-motive division that used TIG for all tube to socket welds.



Some weld shop can get spacer rings to set the expansion gap at the end of the tube

These are handy where close alignment is needed any supply house that sells pressure pipe and weld fittings will have them for sure.



I will see if I can find something on the inter-shield setup, you can’t actually do it with a MIG power supply.
I don’t think it is even call MIG but it uses CO2 and a wire with a flux core. Our wire came in 300# 55 gal drums. I don’t even remember the brand because they bought what ever was the best price.

But one thing for sure we were never allowed to use a MIG for that weld it's right in the AWS specifications for tube to socket welds.



If you pre-heated your weld and knuckle first I think it would be ok, I would worry though about the ball-joint bore becoming to large. Just something to think about.

Darn it I knew I would get it screewed up it.s outer shield here's a link to just one wire type.
http://www.mylincolnelectric.com/Catalog/consumabledatasheet.asp?p=5717
It's AWS (FCAW_GC) not MIG

 

[langer1]

Most of that looked "cut and paste"..........

Thanks I didn't know I was that good.:laugh3:

 

[Lincoln]

Richard don't be so quick to pick on dough head here. He does have a little validity.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/products/ultracore/

You can feed it though a normal MIG as long as it will feed .045 wire. I've always heard it called "double shield". It's a special flux core wire with a gas shield and it was used for a higher penetration.

Since I'm lucky to get two pieces of metal together I'll regurgitate some info from some of the so called "professionals" I harass.

1. Mixed gas gives the prettiest bead and lowest penetration.
2. Straight CO2 is higher penetration with more weld splatter.
3. Flux gives a higher penetration but has the most splatter and the flux needs to be chipped off.
4. Double shield is the highest penetration and the outter shield of gas keeps the splatter down.

Isn't Kid a professional. Where the hell is he?

That being said here is some more info:
1. You have beat on that poor axle for around 4 years now.
2. Your original welds were probably not the best.
3. You have beet on that poor axle for around 4 years now.

The weld is basically there to keep the assembly from rotating. That is why the knuckle is pressed on to the tube and not a loose fit. If it was a slip joint the weld would become more critical and I bet there would be a lot more broken ones out there. The full penetration of the weld with all the pre and post heating would be required. I bet the weld broke because of the constant beating you've provided and the inner C was flexing combined with a lower quality weld (weighted much more towards the flexing C)

If it does it again I would think about some Crane inners just because there is a little more material to reduce some of the flex. I'm surprised you haven't bent and inner C, knuckle, or something else. You may have and that is what caused you to trash your ball joints in 4 months. When you put in the new ball joints did the adjuster look like it was recessed much different than before?

 

[Goatman]

langer, the background info helps, plus the clarification of terms. We get so many ill-informed comments around here that sometimes we have to seperate the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

I was worried about the ball joints when pre- and post-heating things, but I didn't think it was worth it to completely disassemble everything, so I took my chances. It is possible that I damaged the ball joints enough to ruin them, as the first time I drove it after re-welding the knuckles they were bad. Of course, it was also the first time I drove it since I broke it, so nothing conclusive there. I figured if it didn't get hot enough to melt the grease out of the ball joint then it wouldn't have damaged them, but no way to know for sure.

After a good inspection of Paul, Dave, and Cracker's Currie built front ends this last weekend, I could easily see that the width of my original weld beads were not as wide as the Currie's were, plus the fairly large gussets at the bottom that I didn't have. Since mine started cracking on the bottom, evidenced by the 1.5" crack on the side that didn't break, I really do think that if I had the gussets I still would have been alright, even with the probability of my substandard welding.

I have talked to a number of off road racing guys, and most of them are running the 37" tires, and they also have trouble with ball joints and front end parts. I have used Moog ball joints, and I have four new Spicer ball joints that I'm going to install and see how they hold up. Plus, the off road guys don't have a massive front bumper and a winch.........

Hybrid.....hybrid.....hybrid.......or quit jumping it.

 

[FarmerMatt]

Hybrid.....hybrid.....hybrid.......or quit jumping it.

Either that or you "friends" are going to hold an intervention & knock you down a couple tire sizes. Speaking of "friends", I couldn't believe that Paul, Andy, Jes, & Dave would TP your truck like that...

 

[Jes]

Speaking of "friends", I couldn't believe that Paul, Andy, Jes, & Dave would TP your truck like that...

I had nothing to do with that.

 

[CRASH]

I had nothing to do with that.

Ditto.

If I had TPed his truck, there would have been a bigger "surprise" waiting under the TP.

CRASH

 

[FarmerMatt]

Ditto.

If I had TPed his truck, there would have been a bigger "surprise" waiting under the TP.

CRASH

Wrong Andy dipwad. If you would actually come on a run than you'd know that. I am referring to, Andy, the honerable & respected Mr. Puppy.

Matt

 

[Lawn Cher']

Wrong Andy, dipwad. If you would actually come on a run than you'd know that.

Hey, some of us prefer to web wheel. What would be without the webwheeling community?

 

[David Taylor]

I couldn't believe that Paul, Andy, Jes, & Dave would TP your truck like that...

As far as I know, it was none of the above.

 

[Captain Ron]

Richard don't be so quick to pick on dough head here. He does have a little validity.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/products/ultracore/

You can feed it though a normal MIG as long as it will feed .045 wire. I've always heard it called "double shield". It's a special flux core wire with a gas shield and it was used for a higher penetration.

....

Most of those products were developed in the shipbuilding industry. Pretty extreme set of parameters involved. Got Amps?

TIG and Silicone Bronze, or go home

--ron

 

[Porch Puppy]

Matt did you do it... :nono:

 

[Goatman]

Speaking of "friends", I couldn't believe that Paul, Andy, Jes, & Dave would TP your truck like that...

I figure Sharkboy had something to do with it..........

Not that I didn't have it coming, but I've never heard a more lame excuse for not wanting to run a scary little obstacle.




BTW, we should move this discussion over to the Swamp thread.

 

[Lincoln]

Most of those products were developed in the shipbuilding industry. Pretty extreme set of parameters involved. Got Amps?

TIG and Silicone Bronze, or go home

--ron

I've seen it ran on a 250 amp machine, but I finally got to see a real welder last week.

1800 amps pushing .25" wire. Welds 200' a day.

 

[Lincoln]

Richard, I bet you still have wear issues with king pins but probably not as much. Speed kills unless it is snorted. I was told the gusset was more for keeping the C from bending rather than supporting the joint. :dunno:

If those get loose quick I would definately check for a bent C. That would probably cause enough missalignment to cause problems with the hubs also.

I wonder if any of your recent problems are agrivated by that or the toasted housing? I looked at a set of Toy hubs the other day that had some nice wear in the hubs from a bent housing. You could see where the stub was trying to hog the splines out in the hub.

 

[Captain Ron]

I've seen it ran on a 250 amp machine, but I finally got to see a real welder last week.

1800 amps pushing .25" wire. Welds 200' a day.

Quite impressive.

Somehow, 250 amps and .045 or .052 wire reminds me of shorting out a "D" cell

--ron