Illegal Aliens are Obvious Identity Thieves

[woody]

Wonder how many illegals could have been rounded up at the protests.... oh well, hindsights 20/20..

x3

What a wasted opportunity.

 

[BSD]

I am now smarter for reading this. Thank you for the enlightening.

:kissyou:

Sarcasm and irony are very funny! I would actually have to exclude you from my coment. Of course, people did not like what they saw as ambiguity. For those of you concerned, the smiley was not a wacked out liberal pussy left kiss. It was a platonic smiley kiss.
BSD

 

[Fergie]

Well, we covered the ID theft, the far Rights view, the far Left's view, and even a student opinion. We even got the "I don't care and I'm going to post that I don't care so folks will see that I don't care" post.

I look at this like so many things we have allowed the electorate to get away with over the last, say, 35 years. When we went through the last oil crisis, we reformed and vowed never to be under control of those "Towel Heads" (period statement) again. We explored homebrew, hydrogen, and corn oil, then we went back to gas and built our cars big again. When the second oil crisis came about, we did the same thing again, and we mandated the arrival of hybrid vehicles as a majority sell by this year- then Bush torpedo'd it and resurected the flawed Hydrogen scheme so that again, we would not be able to stop our reliance on oil (where do you think we get Hydrogen from?) AND would need to rebuild our infustructure to accomidate it. Back in the 70's people were wading across the border and we called them "Wetbacks". We errected a wall, and someone else put loop holes in the law which allowed caught Mexican's to be set free to wait for a court date - like they were going to suddenly obey the law so they could get deported.

Now both of these are coming to a crisis again, and we have interfered in the internal workings of sovern governments in the name of "freedom". What was the object? To cause us to look somewhere else besides right here at home.

You want to see what the politicians don't want us to see? Look around you - it has always been all around you. The decay of a "Great Society" happens with the mortar, not the bricks.

We say "it is illegal" for Mexicans to come to this country, but we don't stop it. We say they are dragging down our social systems, but again, we do not enforce the existing laws against being here illegally. We say "It is illegal to them to get welfare", yet we freely give it. Illegal's move into our neighborhoods though "clearing houses" - generally relatives, we do not report it. When we do report it, we get "They have done nothing wrong". Illegal's take construction, cleaning, AG jobs, which they say we don't want, but infact, they are willing to take lower wages than the locals and this causes businesses to hire them despite the laws against it and which are largely un-enforced. There was a scandal in the 80's about Politicians and Stars who knowingly hired Illegals to work in their homes and yards. They all got a slapped wrist at most.

Same thing has happened with Gay "rights". When did a lifestyle choice that is still illegal in many States become something normal, even celebrated in the media as a legal choice and a role model for children? Gay "Marriage" legal? Not even legal in their home in their bed.

We say we are a nation of Laws. Those laws are our mortar. When we fail as a society to enforce those laws, when we allow the fringe few to cloud us into thinking that what we agreed is wrong, is now right; will will fail as a society because there will be nothing to hold us together.

[/rant]

And here is where you cross the line.

Illegal immigration is one thing, but has nothing to do with Gay marriages. Someone else's lifestyle choice, which does not affect you in any way shape or form, should not be mandated and legislated out of legality.

Cut off the flow of free benefits as folks have said. Make it difficult for employers to hire illegals, and go from there.

How long until deeohgee is mentioned?

 

[RichP]

Here is a start
http://www.ptd.net/webnews/wed/bp/Ayb91746901.Rks2_GMB.html

 

[WB9YZU]

And here is where you cross the line.

Illegal immigration is one thing, but has nothing to do with Gay marriages. Someone else's lifestyle choice, which does not affect you in any way shape or form, should not be mandated and legislated out of legality.

Cut off the flow of free benefits as folks have said. Make it difficult for employers to hire illegals, and go from there.

How long until deeohgee is mentioned?

Here we have a perfect example.
Cross the line? Not likely.

Illegals say "We are here. Even though we are here illegally, we want all the social and economic benifits you enjoy as law abiding citizens".

Gay's say "We are here, and even though our lifestyle is illegal in many States, we not only want it to be legal, but we want the same social and ecconomic benifits you enjoy as law abiding citizens."

Those two statements are not incongruent. Both are made by a noisy illegal minority in society. Both want society to bear the ecconomic and social costs of their "lifestyle".

What do you mean "cut off" free benifits? They aren't entitled to them now under the law now. What do you mean "make it difficult for employers to hire them", that is also law.

I repeat "We say we are a nation of Laws. Those laws are our mortar. When we fail as a society to enforce those laws, when we allow the fringe few to cloud us into thinking that what we agreed is wrong, is now right; will will fail as a society because there will be nothing to hold us together."

 

[8Mud]

This kind of makes me wonder what it is that the politicains DO NOT want us to pay attention to. If you notice, every time that they are getting ready to pull something, they try to get EVERYBODY to look in the OTHER direction.

X 2

If you listen very closely at what is not being said, you are often closer to the important subjects. I pay attention to the deleted and avoided subjects.

Funny somebody mentioned the boards as being a waste of time. But if you actually follow them much. You can see that many of the boards are ahead of the curve. What is mentioned here today, often shows up as a statement or a policy change a few weeks (or months later) later.
An example of democracy in action. To slaughter a quote. The first hundred names in any telelphone book, will undoubtably give you the proper solution to most any problem. When the oppinon is averaged out.

 

[Fergie]

Illegals say "We are here. Even though we are here illegally, we want all the social and economic benifits you enjoy as law abiding citizens".

Correct. What they are doing is burden to our society, this is my point of disagreement.

Gay's say "We are here, and even though our lifestyle is illegal in many States, we not only want it to be legal, but we want the same social and ecconomic benifits you enjoy as law abiding citizens."

How can a lifestyle be illegal when it does not infringe upon anyone? Doesnt make sense to me. They arent affecting you are me by marrying each other, so why not? And there are several laws that are not followed from one state to another. Say, concealed carry of a firearm. Mine is good in AZ, why not CA? Same kind of reasoning you are using, at least to me.

Those two statements are not incongruent. Both are made by a noisy illegal minority in society. Both want society to bear the ecconomic and social costs of their "lifestyle".

I see where you are trying to make the correlation, but your comparison is slightly off.

What do you mean "cut off" free benifits? They aren't entitled to them now under the law now. What do you mean "make it difficult for employers to hire them", that is also law.

I was merely echoing the sentiments of Sean with that set of statements.

I repeat "We say we are a nation of Laws. Those laws are our mortar. When we fail as a society to enforce those laws, when we allow the fringe few to cloud us into thinking that what we agreed is wrong, is now right; will will fail as a society because there will be nothing to hold us together."

Exactly. We arent a Nation of Justice, just laws, open to interpretation by corrupt judges and lawmakers. Your quote frightens me. Colonialists were considered the fringe, Suffragettes(sp?) were considered the fringe, and Civil Rights supporters were considered the fringe. Your mentality is what will lead to failure and close mindedness.

 

[WB9YZU]

Fergie,
By your reasoning, any law you do not personally agree with is fair game to break. There are tons of laws against "victimless crimes" on the books. You would say "oh well, it doesn't affect me" and let them off.

You say this is a nation of Laws, but not Justice. My reponse is that there can be no Justice without Law.

The costs of the Gay lifestyle have been a real burden on the American Social and Healthcare frame work. It is still illegal (Sodemy) in many states, but rairly enforced. When caught, we look away. We choose which laws to enforce, and which ones not to. The cost of the AIDs epedemic was and still is a lasting legacy of this "at risk" group
These folks are not without rights- they choose to break the law.

Yet, we slide down the slippery slope.
They "come out" they rally, they protest, they start asking for social and healthcare benifits we give couples who live under the law.
We then give "couples" equal health care benifits. Not because it's "fair", but rather to shut up that very vocal minority and try to avoid the Gay marriage debate. Now they have set their sights on Gay "marriage".

We have done the same thing for illegals.
They have broken the law to get here, protest that they have "rights" and have shouted down any attempt to disslodge them.
They now have their sights set on citizenship.

The parallel is uncanny to the person who stands back and looks around.

Yet your only issue is with the illegals. Why? Because they have reached further into your personal pocket than Gays?

The illegals atleast have the better ulturistic motive. They want a better life for themselves and a future for their families. Still, that is no exuse for us either not enforcing the laws as they are written, or deciding which laws suit us and only obeying those laws.

There is an old saying Fergie. "The cost of Freedom is constant vigilance"
We have not been vigilant, we have become complacent and those who would take what they would from us and destroy our society know it.

 

[GSequoia]

Now really Ron this whole argument you are persuing is down right ignorant. Name me one real way that homosexuality has negatively affected you. Even though (as you probably know from the other post) I do not agree with the thought that illegal aliens are the cause of all the worlds problems I can see where harm is done. I, for one, have experianced zero negativity caused by homosexual friends. Yes, I said it, GASP. I have homosexual friends! Does that make me less of a person?

The only argument against homosexuality is a religious one. It should not be a crime, that is no reason for it to be. Last I checked the United States of America was not a religiously controlled nation.

Sequoia
Sick and tired of homophobia.

 

[WB9YZU]

Now really Ron this whole argument you are persuing is down right ignorant. Name me one real way that homosexuality has negatively affected you. Even though (as you probably know from the other post) I do not agree with the thought that illegal aliens are the cause of all the worlds problems I can see where harm is done. I, for one, have experianced zero negativity caused by homosexual friends. Yes, I said it, GASP. I have homosexual friends! Does that make me less of a person?

The only argument against homosexuality is a religious one. It should not be a crime, that is no reason for it to be. Last I checked the United States of America was not a religiously controlled nation.

Sequoia
Sick and tired of homophobia.

Ah, I knew someone would call me a homophobe because I pointed out that there are flaws in what we do.

This is another example of exactly how we do things. Stick a non-PC label on someone to make your position seem more correct. Quick! Look over there at the label!

I will turn your argument around. Name one way an illegal alien has negatively affected you personally. You can't do it because it is a victimless crime.

I don't have a personal problem with either group as long as I don't have to pay for their choice and they are reasonable neighbors. So far, the later has proven true in both incidences.
Though...I may just have to learn spanish soon (no joke).

Last I checked the United States of America was not a religiously controlled nation.

You and every other civil libritarian are sticking your collective heads in the sand. This Country was formed by a bunch of political zelots and continues to be run by the same.

 

[GSequoia]

AStick a non-PC label

I'm not sticking labels on you - if I were I'd have directly called you a homophobe. You're talking to the wrong person here; I'm not a very PC person and refuse to toss labels around in attempts to distract my opponent.

I will turn your argument around. Name one way an illegal alien has negatively affected you personally. You can't do it because it is a victimless crime.

Umm.. I've already given you that. I guess the low wages I made back in high school when I was the exact same as an illegal alien - working under the table paying not a dollar into health care, etc.

I don't have a personal problem with either group as long as I don't have to pay for their choice and they are reasonable neighbors. So far, that has proven true in both incidences.

You aren't paying for homosexuals though! Think of it this way - what if they were straight; they'd be on health care so it's a moot point! Medical insurance is so expensive mainly becuase of the rick of frivelous malpractice suits; that is who you are paying for; Larry H. Parker.

 

[Fergie]

Fergie,
By your reasoning, any law you do not personally agree with is fair game to break. There are tons of laws against "victimless crimes" on the books. You would say "oh well, it doesn't affect me" and let them off.

Don't know where you drew that conclusion from, so I am at a loss for words.

You say this is a nation of Laws, but not Justice. My reponse is that there can be no Justice without Law.

You're one of those people that see something that you don't like, and says "There ought to be a law against that." Ever think that people know that stealing and murder is wrong, even before it was written in the books that it was against the law? Overlegislation. Only the stupid and the sheep need protection from themselves.

The costs of the Gay lifestyle have been a real burden on the American Social and Healthcare frame work. It is still illegal (Sodemy) in many states, but rairly enforced. When caught, we look away. We choose which laws to enforce, and which ones not to. The cost of the AIDs epedemic was and still is a lasting legacy of this "at risk" group

I love fascist, Hitler/Mussolini-esque propaganda. And yes, Gays have been a huge burden. Almost as big as a burden to society as closeminded conservatives. Look at all the kids they have, and ignorance they bring into the world. Mind you, this is not directed at all conservatives, just the closeminded ones that feel their way is the only, and best way, and everyone else should live accordingly.

Yet, we slide down the slippery slope.
They "come out" they rally, they protest, they start asking for social and healthcare benifits we give couples who live under the law.

We then give "couples" equal health care benifits. Not because it's "fair", but rather to shut up that very vocal minority and try to avoid the Gay marriage debate. Now they have set their sights on Gay "marriage".

What social healthcare benefits? You have nothing to back this up. And with the AIDS thing, if it hadn't been gays, it would have been another group. Blame doesnt fall solely on them, so look elsewhere.

They have broken the law to get here, protest that they have "rights" and have shouted down any attempt to disslodge them.
They now have their sights set on citizenship.

Correct me if I am wrong, but ERs are filled to the brim with butt plugging homos that never pay thier bills and carry no insurance.

Yet your only issue is with the illegals. Why? Because they have reached further into your personal pocket than Gays?

The illegals atleast have the better ulturistic motive. They want a better life for themselves and a future for their families. Still, that is no exuse for us either not enforcing the laws as they are written, or deciding which laws suit us and only obeying those laws.

So, should every law on every set of books be enforced, no matter how innane and archaic?

There is an old saying Fergie. "The cost of Freedom is constant vigilance"

How about this one:

"Your constant "vigilance", will end up costing me my Freedom."

We have not been vigilant, we have become complacent and those who would take what they would from us and destroy our society know it.

Okay.

 

[GSequoia]

You know Fergie you did make a good point...

Hey Ron.. What do you think about Fender Flare and Mudflap laws?

 

[WB9YZU]

You aren't paying for homosexuals though! Think of it this way - what if they were straight; they'd be on health care so it's a moot point! Medical insurance is so expensive mainly becuase of the rick of frivelous malpractice suits; that is who you are paying for; Larry H. Parker.

Actually have done a bit of research on this. Our State Government will not supply couples benifits because it has done a cost study and found that if they offer Couples benifits for Gays, they must also provide them to anybody who says "Couple"- and though would shoot the budget as The Sate of Wisconsin offers mostly free health care for it's employees. If they did, our taxes would go up at the County and State levels.

The argument you quoted is pure sucatash. Health benifits for a single are much higher per person, than for a couple, so if you give couples benifits, you increase costs without increasing income. The cost of the whole plan increases to offset the cost of healthcare.

The cost of Aids in this country per capita?
Per the world bank "In a typical country, the cost of treating a single person for AIDS for one year is about 2.7 times the gross national product per capita." Though I believe it is slightly less in the US.

 

[GSequoia]

You can't argue AIDS - The only reason that AIDS turned into an epidemic with the gay culture was because nobody knew it existed. Think of it; hetrosexuals screw just as much as homosexuals but have used condoms and the like for years so they don't have to answer to Daddy; homosexuals didn't need to worry about that and back in the day before the epidemic hit there was no reason to sport some rubber.

 

[WB9YZU]

Hey Ron.. What do you think about Fender Flare and Mudflap laws?

With the mud you guys have been slinging?
No comment.

My point was, you simply can't have it both ways.
You can't say "I'm a Liberal" and then say "It's costing me too much, crack down on the Illegals - but not on my SIG".
That's like saying "I want the law enforced, but only for them"

You side step it, you slide around it, you guys have even tried the Homophobe and Nazi/Facist card. That dog won't hunt.

 

[Gil BullyKatz]

Damn...

Now would not be the right time to admit to being a illegal gay muslim immigrant would it?

or would that be a gay muslim illegal immigrant...

or illegal immigrant gay muslim...

or muslim gay illegal immigrant...

 

[WB9YZU]

Damn...

Now would not be the right time to admit to being a illegal gay muslim immigrant would it?

Gill, if you were Gay, and Muslim, and alive, that would be an accomplishment.

It sems to me that Illegal or in a coffin would be the only ways to get out of a Arab Muslim country.
If they want to kill a person for changing your religion, how angry would they get about homosexuality?

 

[RyanM]

Illegal Muslim Gay immagrant.

 

[brianb2247]

I come to this site to ignore all the bs like this, but the mexican population here in tacoma washington is nutz they cannot even speak english.and they hang in their group, they are completely unsocial and it pisses me off (so what if we hurt thier feelings) one solution is to make a citizen border patrol with shoot to kill orders.