I Saved The Life Of Another AW4 Today

I started reading NAXJA posts early 2001. The descision of most is that anything else but ATF2 will kill the AW4 faster that you can sneeze from black peper. My XJ has 235,000 miles on it. I change the oil in the AW4 to Amsoil at 140,000 miles. It still work as perfect as the first day I bought it. If you have doubt stick with the old tried and tested.
 
I know this is a SUPER old post...but I thought it was funny to find it in google.

I just recently contacted TWO DC dealerships here in town and they both told me that it was OK to use ATF+4 instead of Dex in my AW4 tranny. You can go that way but don't go the other way. And the guy that told me this at one of the dealerships does all of their tranny work.

i'm confused.
 
OK whats confusing. We all say don't use ATF+4, Dealer say's use ATF+4, Dealer wants $$$, We want to keep XJ's and MJ's on the road and help each other out.
Enuf said?
 
1985xjlaredo said:
OK whats confusing. We all say don't use ATF+4, Dealer say's use ATF+4, Dealer wants $$$, We want to keep XJ's and MJ's on the road and help each other out.
Enuf said?
Click to expand...

Well i'm not exactly sure your conspiracy type thinking is accurate....but it is somewhat convincing.
What's confusing is why a dealership would be so wrong on this.....and not have tons of lawsuits for wrecked transmissions.
oh well...
 
its pretty simple really... DC trannies use ATF+3/ATF+4, AFAIK no other trannies use this fluid, the dealer thinks the jeep has a DC trans since they sell them and all, but the AW4 is not a DC trans so it does not use +3/+4, just look in your manual or on the drain plug, manual says dex III, drainplug says dex II (dex is backward compatible but not forward compatible)

if you don't believe me just ask my dumbass highschool autoshop teacher, who in my 4 years there managed to fry a C4 by running dex III in it, then fried a chrysler trans by trying to run dex III in that too... probably the only reason he didn't manage to fry an AW4 as well is his XJ had a 5 speed. he found out the hard way that there is a reason manufacturers recommend a specific fluid for each trans

after all that, if you still don't believe us, go ahead and run +4 in your AW4 and see how long it lasts
 
FoMoCo said:
its pretty simple really... DC trannies use ATF+3/ATF+4, AFAIK no other trannies use this fluid, the dealer thinks the jeep has a DC trans since they sell them and all, but the AW4 is not a DC trans so it does not use +3/+4, just look in your manual or on the drain plug, manual says dex III, drainplug says dex II (dex is backward compatible but not forward compatible)

if you don't believe me just ask my dumbass highschool autoshop teacher, who in my 4 years there managed to fry a C4 by running dex III in it, then fried a chrysler trans by trying to run dex III in that too... probably the only reason he didn't manage to fry an AW4 as well is his XJ had a 5 speed. he found out the hard way that there is a reason manufacturers recommend a specific fluid for each trans

after all that, if you still don't believe us, go ahead and run +4 in your AW4 and see how long it lasts
Click to expand...

At this point it's not a matter of believing you as much is it's a matter of not believing that the dealerships themselvs are that stupid!
 
Well, it looks like you don't have much of a choice, does it? If you believe us, you have to accept that the dealerships are wrong, or vice versa. Look at the examples given in this thread. Parts stores and dealers use centrally based computer systems that are no doubt shared by all. So if it's off at one store, there's a damn good chance it is off at another, and there's bound to be some mistakes. This just happens to be a costly one.

I had to replace a seatbelt buckle and the dealer ordered a European model replacement that was nothing like what I needed, the clip was even the wrong size! After painfully explaining/showing the broken one of mine as an example, I finally managed to get the right one. But the point (and the guy working there showed the screen to me to prove it) is that the parts computer the guy used to look up the buckle clearly showed a diagram of the wrong one for my jeep (with VIN number and all).
 
skenzer said:
At this point it's not a matter of believing you as much is it's a matter of not believing that the dealerships themselvs are that stupid!
Click to expand...
true dat
personally I hate dealerships and have had absolutly no trust of their advice ever since ford wanted to charge my mom $200 in parts/labor to fix the thermostat housing on her bronco that THEY had cracked when they did the 90k service on it, so I ended up doing it for her and found out they didn't even pull the upper rad hose, let alone replace it, because when I pulled it off it disentigrated in my hands, so I replaced the upper and lower rad hoses too. After that I started looking over their work and found out they replaced the spark plugs but didn't touch the cap/rotor which were toast, they didn't flush the rad, didn't change the air filter....so basically their 90k service was sparkplugs, an oil change, a t-stat (that they effed up), fluid checks, and a tire rotation (which I couldn't prove or disprove they did or not) for $400! that was a reputable dealership too! and thats only one of many dealership horror stories I have

anyway, sorry for all the hate, just my BP must go up 40pts every time I hear about a dealership screwing someone :wierd:
 
FoMoCo said:
anyway, sorry for all the hate, just my BP must go up 40pts every time I hear about a dealership screwing someone :wierd:
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more, I feel the same way. A friend of mine with a Kia just got in the mail a postcard reminding her to get a 100K mile power steering flush done, to the tune of "only $299". Had I eaten my sodium infested Ramen before hearing that, I may not have been here today.
 
skenzer said:
...And the guy that told me this at one of the dealerships does all of their tranny work.
Click to expand...

Imagine that - the dealership that generates revenue on transmission work told you it was OK to use ATF+4? Weird. Go ahead and put the ATF+4 in it - it will still run, for how long? Who knows. My parents let a local oil/lube station put in ATF+4 with a "friction additive". About 18 months later the tranny now shifts horribly. Coincidence? I doubt it. Put the ATF+4 in and report back in a year or two and let us all know how it worked out for ya ;)
 
GGGRRRRRRR........:doh: .....teach me to be lazy just had my jeep flushed bout a month ago by a shop before a couple hour trip with a trailer in tow and ever since the driving quaility has gotten shittier and im willing to bet the morons used ATF instead of dexIII.....gahhhhhhh oh well droppin the heep at another tranny shop(a good one) havin them giver a look seein as i dont do trannys
 
one thing i didn't see in this thread that surprises me is the fact that so many people think that just because they talked to a dealership, those people must know what they're doing.

I've worked at a couple dealerships for some time, and i'm sure several of the techs here will agree with me on this.
most service writers don't know their head from their ass. then again they don't have to. all they have to do is enter the VIN, miles, color, and what the customer is complaining about.
most of the service managers aren't much better. they tell the mechanics to hurry up, fix this car, fix that car, bla bla bla. but they don't know shit about cars.
and most parts guys at dealerships aren't much better than the chain store parts people. they don't know anything and can't look anything up. one of the jeep dealerships in town has a parts guy that absolutely refuses to look up any parts for me if i don't have a VIN number. i try to explain to him that the vin from my XJ won't do him any good because i'm looking up rubicon parts to install on my XJ. so then he tells me it can't be done. i pretty much call him a dumbass and tell him to put the other guy on the phone.


so anyways........what i'm getting at is............just because they sell a certain brand of cars, and work on their brand of cars, doesn't mean shit. they're still just a bunch of dumbasses. you need to learn to do your own research and quit beliving what every joe blow tells you.
 
Yaaabuttt, the Local kragen store has ASE certified parts pros. last time I was in the store for some oil the subject of biodiesel came up, not a one working there had ever heard the term before. I shoulda asked for some muffler bearings to see what response that got me.
 
I'm not gonna rant....I'm not gonna rant... I'm not..... OK maybe just a little:

I fully agree that many of the parts people out there are nothing more than burger flippers with cleaner shirts (maybe), but it takes a little responsability on the part of a vehicle owner to know what they drive and how to go about fixing it. If your last chance at getting the correct parts and fluids is to trust the guy/gal that has never seen or owned your vehicle, than you have set yourself up for failure.

Yes, I work in the automotive aftermarket, yes, I'm ASE certified, yes, there are stronger and weaker parts people out there, and yes I know an MJ from an XJ from a YJ.... , but remember that there are literally hundreds of other vehicles on the roads the have equally insane (in a good way) owners that think everybody should know everything about their Kawasaki KZ650SR-D2's (mind you not the KZ650-c!!-- mine's got rear disk brake) and their MG-TD (mind you not MG-TL!!!- mine's got fenders).......

It's your vehicle! Do the research and determine what you need for it. Sites like this provide a wealth of information for the XJ owners that choose to take the responsibility of vehicle ownership seriously, but for those that don't want to spend the time to learn, remember-- it's your choice to trust a complete stranger.

sorry, I had to get it off my chest! I understand the frustration of dealing with retards too, that's why of the six employees I pay, five of them are ASE certified and the sixth should be (better be) this fall.

that is all... Shorty
 
I agree with you Shorty for the most part, as what you're talking about deals with parts stores that sell everything for every vehicle. But I still think that leaves ZERO excuse for Chrysler/JEEP dealerships to screw up. There are clearly morons that work at dealerships, as we've all experienced them. But anyone with 1/4 of a brain can still (eventually) type in what you tell them into a computer and bring up a list for your vehicle. And that's what disgusts me the most, a JEEP dealership computer system being inaccurate. I'm not really faulting the people working, because some do their best to help customers out, but if that computer is wrong, it's over. And I believe there is no excuse for that Jeep database to be wrong. I would think that the aftermarket stores get at least some of their database information from the dealers systems, so if it starts off wrong, that's it.

I fully agree more than anything that people should have a clue about their vehicles before starting something, because everything isn't perfect. But I think the following scenario more than anything demonstrates why I get mad at this.

Say someone picks up an old XJ, having never owned one before. Doesn't use the internet, but knows a decent amount about autos. P.O of the XJ doesn't have the owners manual, says all the fluids need changed, so the guy takes his XJ to a Jeep dealership for a tranny fluid exchange. Is it not reasonable to expect that the dealership would put in Dexron?
 
agreed, but with the number of times "Jeep" has changed hands, I don't think there is a true dealership for the older XJ's anymore. I would be willing to bet (if I had any $$- I own a Jeep remember) that the information in the DC computers has been transferred several times from system to system. Keep in mind that the data entering is done primarily by college interns that are just trying to get enough credits to graduate and you can see where the errors arise. It is up to us as a collective to take the extra couple minutes to find out with whom we need to speak to correct the error, or we're just allowing the next person to risk the same misinformation that we knew was wrong. It's a big cycle that began before we bought our vehicle and will continue until we all help to fix it.

that said, I too find it hard to excuse the DC dealer using the incorrect fluids

--Shorty
 
So I got a recall letter in the mail. You've all heard of it. The E22 Reprogramming. I searched around here to see if it was ok and wouldn't cause any effects we would consider set-backs.

Went to the dealer, decided to let 'em do a transmission fluid and filter change. I have read then re-read just about every forum in this site. So to beat the system I had em leave a note in the service slip. "Dexron III fluid only - Not ATF +4". Come back the next day and what happens... The service guy left me a special note on the service slip saying he put ATF +4 into "Stacey Kiebler" and that he left me the TSP on the front seat to prove he was correct. He will be getting a call from me tomarrow. I left the ol' girl there. I will not drive it off the lot until it is corrected.

So I need some help guys. I need some proof, evidence, that I am correct. I have no OM.
 
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