Disappearing Coolant?

I would not trust a helicoil on a head bolt for 110 lbs of torque, I would scrap the block, or ask a local engine machine shop if an over sized bolt can be used, but even then I suspect it asking for trouble!!!

5-90 taught me a trick, you take 2-3 old head bolts, cut off the head, and then cut a slot in what was the head end of the bolt. Thread them in the block and then use them for guides for getting the head lined up properly. Then use a long blade screw driver to remove them. Works great!

Also it is easy to damage the head gasket, so you want to get the head on there once, and get it on right!!! So make sure you have enough strong armed people, or equipment to lower it slowly. The hardest part is getting the rear bolt in. You either need to drop the engine/trans some, or install the bolt in the head first!!!! I installed the bolt first and used duct tape on the top side to hold the bolt up enough to keep the threads from being exposed on the bottom side until the head was in place. Then just remove the duct tape once the head is on the block!

Also you want to either paint the head gasket with aluminum paint or use Indian head gasket shellack
on the gasket.

The copper RTV works the best!!!! We installed the manifolds before we put the head on, so it was heavier and bulkier, took 3 of us. But it made torquing the manifold bolts a lot easier.
 
Also be sure to inspect the block as much possible, cylinder walls for any signs of crack.
 
Ecomike said:
I would not trust a helicoil on a head bolt for 110 lbs of torque, I would scrap the block, or ask a local engine machine shop if an over sized bolt can be used, but even then I suspect it asking for trouble!!!
Click to expand...

The Helicoil(tm) threads will be at least as strong, if not stronger than the original threads. The manufacturer kits them up specifically for a variety of head bolt repair applications.
 
But I question if they will duplicate the proper torque on the head bolts, as I have had helicoils slip on me in other applications. Also their is the question of getting them installed perfectly straight, perpendicular to the head which is also a torque issue I think.

I love helicoils, but I would not trust them to duplicate an iron OEM thread for a head gasket torque spec.
 
Thanks for that information. My god that bolt trick sounds brilliant. Perfect and genius way to line up the head the first time you drop it on.

Machine shop called today, and my head was indeed crack. I'm rather relieved actually to know that. Now i don't have to keep searching for the problem.

That just goes to show that even the 1999 Jeep 0630 head can crack as well. I was brainwashed into only thinking the 2000 and 2001 heads could crack.

Currently looking at a 0630 on ebay that is a guy is selling for 100OBO that has already been pressure checked. Says its off a 99 XJ that was junked due to a shot transmission.

Would you go for it? It seems like a cheap alternative to buying a manufactured one. \

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jeep-cylind...Parts_Accessories&hash=item2328b6db7d&vxp=mtr
 
I am awaiting mine being diagnosed a little further. I am planning on the head being cracked, and if that is the case, I will consult my mechanic as to sourcing the better casted one. If the head is ok, well then the repairs might not be so bad, it its say a freeze plug, then the time isn't going to be as much as a whole head replacement. Maybe this will bring my mpgs back up to 20 where it was when I first got it. We shall see by end of day Wednesday. I don't have the time to work on it as I am starting a new job and need a dependable rig for the wife to drive the kiddos around to come and visit me, so this one wont get the head replaced by me. :(

Jeff
 
I would say go for it, or make him an offer, whats the worst he's gonna say, no??

Jeff
 
ihscoutlover said:
I am awaiting mine being diagnosed a little further. I am planning on the head being cracked, and if that is the case, I will consult my mechanic as to sourcing the better casted one. If the head is ok, well then the repairs might not be so bad, it its say a freeze plug, then the time isn't going to be as much as a whole head replacement. Maybe this will bring my mpgs back up to 20 where it was when I first got it. We shall see by end of day Wednesday. I don't have the time to work on it as I am starting a new job and need a dependable rig for the wife to drive the kiddos around to come and visit me, so this one wont get the head replaced by me. :(

Jeff
Click to expand...

What year XJ are you diagnosing a cracked head on? I could actually see my head crack, but i didn't trust myself, and turns out the crack i saw, was the crack they found. Much easier to see what the head cleaned off.

My understanding and this (and trust me i could be miles off) if you have a 00 or 01, you should get the 0630 head for the 99, but it needs to be slightly modified. (Still reading into how slight of modifications these are) or you could get a 03+ (I think) TUPY 0331 head.

You can also buy a new head from Alabama cylinder head or clearwater, but they're more expensive (and it sounds like you and me both are pinching pennies).

Why do you think you have a cracked head? What were your symptoms?

Either way, good luck man, and post away in this thread. I'm just about as clueless as you are.

I'd pay full retail for it, my problem is that i'm not sure if i trust the thing. Would be terrible for me to go get it shaved and the machine tell me that this one is also cracked.
 
I have bought a lot of great deals on Ebay the last 13 years, but a head is not something I would buy there. Freight is a killer, and a triple killer if you expect any warranty. I would worry about shipping damage, and he says in the ad it needs to be shaved before use, which means paying a machine shop after you get it anyway.

Have you asked the local machine shop what they can offer with a warranty?
 
Ecomike said:
I have bought a lot of great deals on Ebay the last 13 years, but a head is not something I would buy there. Freight is a killer, and a triple killer if you expect any warranty. I would worry about shipping damage, and he says in the ad it needs to be shaved before use, which means paying a machine shop after you get it anyway.

Have you asked the local machine shop what they can offer with a warranty?
Click to expand...


Let me state it again; I have no clue what i'm doing. All i know is i need a new head, and i'm trying to be cheap. I am attempting to soak up as much information as you put out.

How would you get another head? Is mine even fixable, or should i just throw it in the trash can? Should i buy another one flat out, look for a re-manufactured one, go to a junkyard and pull one, or what?

I'm clueless.
 
I would ask the machine shop you used, that confirmed the head is cracked, if they can supply you a good used, ready to install head at a decent price, with say a 60 or 90 day warranty.

My local guy has a deal with the local junk yards, they sell him a good used head (guaranteed not to be cracked), he cleans, inspects (makes sure it is not cracked) and does any minor work needed on the head, like valve work, lapping the valve seats if needed, installing new oil seals, machining the head surface to make sure it is flat and true, and gives you a ready to reuse, clean head.

Call several local engine machine shops and see which one has the best price, warranty and reputation.
 
Been calling around to machine shops. Just called levines and they're checking with their distributor for a price.

One thing i didn't know though. The guy asked me if i needed a hole in the head for a "temp sensor" or i think that's what he said. I took a shot in the dark and told him that i didn't need the hole. Do i need it?

I think i remember reading about it somewhere, but i can't remember.
 
The temp sensor in the head, for the dash gauge was last used in 1995.

96-01 did not have that sensor in the head.
 
Here around STL, the local machine shop dealing with my parts guy, has a ready to go new cast head for $595. Its ready to go with the valves installed. That seems like a lot, but for something that is basically bolt it on and go, im game.

Kong, my symptoms are quite similar. A '00 XJ 4.0. I overheated back in November due to poor cooling system maintenance of a PO, and went ahead and replaced the water pump, radiator, upper and lower hoses, thermostat, and numerous flushes. The first flush looked like the water coming down the Mississippi River near my house. 2 weeks later its back to that again, even after flushing it till the water came out clear.

I just took a trip to Louisville, KY last week, and in 440 miles I lost 1 gallon total of coolant. It hasn't run hot since the water pump and radiator change, its actually running below the 210 mark. Prior to this trip the Jeep was checked for compression, and the testing revealed no known operational issues, and the following numbers:

1=110 2=115 3=90 4=100 5=115 6=115

After seeing these numbers and doing a tad more research, I am led to believe that the gasket, or something between #3 & 4 is bad, although the mechanic believed that his air hose might not have been 100% hooked up right. He tightened down some of the clamps I thought I had gotten tight, and checked all other functions and found nothing. From the numbers he believed that the averages of the cylinders was about right. He is rechecking everything to actually rule out the head, and that's going to probably call for a leakdown test or pumping the system under pressure with the spark plugs out and see if we have coolant coming out the head.

Its got 178k on it. Had right about 170k when I bought it back at the end of October. I only recently have been going through more coolant, but not finding any leaks. The oil level seems to have gone up some, but no milkshaky oil. However, under the fill cap there is some white residue on the bottom of the cap. I am under pretty good suspicion that the head is cracked. Gas mileage has also dropped from 20 down to 18 mpg. Let me know if you need more information.

Jeff
 
Coolant can be going 2 places
Leaking it or burning it.

If you see a leak trace it to where it is coming from,
If not do the necessary tests to check for oil in coolant, exhaust gases in coolant ect.

I am pretty sure your compression shouldnt vary that much 25 is alot. If it is out of spec then there is a problem.
Corrosion builds up everywhere and to really clean up your system right you need to do a couple of flushes to get it as close to 100% clean as possible.
 
Funny you should mention that. I have done 3 rounds of flushing. Each time I probably went through 8 gallons of water. I haven't flushed the heater core real thoroughly, however the other sign I noticed was that I am getting very little heat inside the vehicle. My mechanic did check for exhaust in the coolant, with one of those goes to blue deals, and no exhaust detected in the coolant. Jeep seems to be running fine, but the gas mileage sufferage. No check engine lights, and nothing else out of the ordinary. And no leakage from the heater core area. Floors are dry. Hoping I get better news by the end of the day today.

Jeff
 
Just used google to find answers.. 120-150 is what you should be having
95 is low, would look into doing a headgasket.
Seeing you are also loosing coolant, and its not leaking.
Has to be burning it then right?
 
Yup. Probably is. Normal numbers should actually be around 125, but judging by the other lack of PM things the other PO's did to it, wouldn't surprise me that I have run into this issue. Funny thing is I don't have a whole lot into this one, and if I wasn't on a time crunch I would do the work myself, but I am getting ready to travel and I need the wife to have a more reliable vehicle than it is right now.

Jeff
 
ihscoutlover said:
Yup. Probably is. Normal numbers should actually be around 125, but judging by the other lack of PM things the other PO's did to it, wouldn't surprise me that I have run into this issue. Funny thing is I don't have a whole lot into this one, and if I wasn't on a time crunch I would do the work myself, but I am getting ready to travel and I need the wife to have a more reliable vehicle than it is right now.

Jeff
Click to expand...


Well i just bit the bullet. Bought a head for $500. Gaskets are going to be like $100. Head Bolts were $40. $50 for the test on my old head.

About $700 later my jeep should be back to running condition. Could be worse i know, but my god, i did not want to spend any money. I'm trying to save as much as i can. Hoping the jeep is more reliable after this.

I had the same symptoms. My oil fill cap was milkshaked, then about two weeks later i pulled the valve cover, and that too was milkshaked. Oil level seemed fine as well, no lack of performance, and my temperature was lower than 210. Spark plugs looked fine as well.

I even had the 0630 head, and it still cracked.

I'm curious. Where are you guys traveling to?

I have a question. I've never replaced a headgasket in my life. Do i apply the headgasket dry, or do i add RTV around all of it, or do i put on a few dabs of RTV around the outside of it to hold it onto the head or what?

After reading that tip about using old bolt heads with cut off heads and slots in them, i was thinking i should just drop the headgasket over those bolts dry, and then drop my head down on top of that. No RTV or anything. Is that correct? Or do i need RTV?

What about the intake manifold and the exhaust manifold? Those installed dry as well?

Thanks!
 
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