Crossover and High Steer (Wagoneer Dana 44) Clearance Issues?

[GraniteCow]

I'm in the process of putting together a Wagoneer Dana 44 for the front of my XJ and was about to order a flat top knuckle kit for crossover/high steer, but just looked under my XJ and realized I might run into clearance issues with the coil springs and sway bar end links. Does anyone know how to set up high steer on an XJ without hitting the coils or ditching the sway bar? Is this doable? Maybe just crossover but not high steer? Is there even any advantage to just crossover but no high steer? Is high steer but no crossover (keeping an inverted y) an option? The flat top kit I'm eyeing is the $700 eBay kit and comes with arms. I already have a Barnes truss/swap kit for the Waggy 44.

Are high steer and crossover the way to go with this, or should I try to build an inverted y setup with the stock Waggy knuckles? Does anyone run a high steer inverted y link? I was pretty excited to go with both high steer and crossover steering, but I drive this thing on pavement and kinda need the sway bar.

 

[XJlimitedx99]

In my opinion, the sway bar is a lower priority than the steering. You absolutely can get the sway bar to work with high steer, but you'll likely need to cut off the OEM sway bar mounts to clear the steering, then make some custom sway bar mounts that clear the new steering setup after its installed.

How do you figure the steering will interfere with the coils? High steer should really only be moving the steering location vertically, not in closer to the coil. Do you have aftermarket coil mounts on that axle?

Crossover steering mounted onto the top of the knuckles (in the high steer config) is an excellent setup. The geometry works out to be as good as it gets. I would try very hard to make it work.

To answer your questions: yes, there is an advantage to crossover without going high steer. Crossover separates the drag link and tie rod, so you will not have toe-in change as the suspension cycles up/down.

High steer without crossover is certainly an option. Not sure I've ever seen someone do inverted Y, but have definitely seen inverted T. There are some drawbacks with that. Inverted T tends to have an issue of the tierod rolling back/forth which creates a deadspot in the steering.

I'm assuming this eBay kit is what you're looking at. That is exactly what I had planned on using when I thought I was going to build a Ford HP 44. I ended up changing my mind to go JK 44, so I never bought these parts, but from what I research it is the best option.

You're far from "bolt in" territory with this mod. You'll have to understand how to set everything up to get the geometry correct, but this has the ability to have the best steering geometry possible on a lifted rig.

 

[GraniteCow]

In my opinion, the sway bar is a lower priority than the steering. You absolutely can get the sway bar to work with high steer, but you'll likely need to cut off the OEM sway bar mounts to clear the steering, then make some custom sway bar mounts that clear the new steering setup after its installed.

How do you figure the steering will interfere with the coils? High steer should really only be moving the steering location vertically, not in closer to the coil. Do you have aftermarket coil mounts on that axle?

Crossover steering mounted onto the top of the knuckles (in the high steer config) is an excellent setup. The geometry works out to be as good as it gets. I would try very hard to make it work.

To answer your questions: yes, there is an advantage to crossover without going high steer. Crossover separates the drag link and tie rod, so you will not have toe-in change as the suspension cycles up/down.

High steer without crossover is certainly an option. Not sure I've ever seen someone do inverted Y, but have definitely seen inverted T. There are some drawbacks with that. Inverted T tends to have an issue of the tierod rolling back/forth which creates a deadspot in the steering.

I'm assuming this eBay kit is what you're looking at. That is exactly what I had planned on using when I thought I was going to build a Ford HP 44. I ended up changing my mind to go JK 44, so I never bought these parts, but from what I research it is the best option.

You're far from "bolt in" territory with this mod. You'll have to understand how to set everything up to get the geometry correct, but this has the ability to have the best steering geometry possible on a lifted rig.

Yep, that’s the kit. I have a HP f250 housing, complete Wagoneer front, and 5.5 hubs and Chevy short spindles ready to go. It’s gonna be a project . I was about to order the knuckles/steering last night until I realized the coils on the factory Dana 30 actually sit forward on the axle and the drag link goes under the coil perch. Moving the drag link up in the stock configuration would hit the coils. The sway bar links barely clear the coils.

I emailed Barnes to ask about clearances. Hopefully they have someone there who has done this. I had an inverted T for a while and it was terrible. I would ditch the sway bar before I went with a T setup, but I drive about 400 miles on pavement including windy mountain roads on most of my trips. I drove without a sway bar before and it was sketchy. One of the reasons I want the D44 is I carry about 1k lbs of cargo/passengers on these trips, and with longarms it definitely gets some body roll.

 

[Ol Blue]

Hard to say without seeing your axle and how far forward/back that specific kit puts the tie rod and drag link.

I run crossover steering on WJ knuckles on a TJ Rubicon style D44 and ran into issues with the drag link hitting the sway bar links. No issues with the drag link hitting coils. My set up isn't high steer but as XJlimitedx99 said that should just move the drag link/tie rod up, not forward or back. I can't see moving it up causing issues, its too far back that creates the problem. But I suppose that depends on your set up.

Solved my problem with 1" offset rod ends. They helped push the tie rod and drag link forward bought me the clearance I needed. If you go with the GM one ton ends the offset PNs are OS2234R and OS2234L. That kit uses the GM one ton ends so these offset rod ends would directly replace the ones supplied in that kit. Lots of people sell the offset ends including Barnes.

 

[GraniteCow]

Hard to say without seeing your axle and how far forward/back that specific kit puts the tie rod and drag link.

I run crossover steering on WJ knuckles on a TJ Rubicon style D44 and ran into issues with the drag link hitting the sway bar links. No issues with the drag link hitting coils. My set up isn't high steer but as XJlimitedx99 said that should just move the drag link/tie rod up, not forward or back. I can't see moving it up causing issues, its too far back that creates the problem. But I suppose that depends on your set up.

Solved my problem with 1" offset rod ends. They helped push the tie rod and drag link forward bought me the clearance I needed. If you go with the GM one ton ends the offset PNs are OS2234R and OS2234L. That kit uses the GM one ton ends so these offset rod ends would directly replace the ones supplied in that kit. Lots of people sell the offset ends including Barnes.

Those offset tie rod ends might just be the ticket. Thanks!

 

[Ol Blue]

Hopefully that works out for you.

The set up I use is:

Driver Tie Rod: OS2234L
Passenger Tie Rod: OS2234R
Drag link at Knuckle: OS2234R
Drag link at Pitman: ES2027L

One thing to note. While the 2234 and the 2026/2027 have the same taper of 7° or 1.5" per ft, the drag link style (ES2026R/ES2027L) need the taper sunk a little deeper (just 0.046" more). Wasn't an issue for me since I was reaming myself so I just stopped reaming where I needed. So depending how deep those knuckles were reamed, you could have an issue replacing ES2026R with OS2234R since it could be reamed too far.

 

[GraniteCow]

Hopefully that works out for you.

The set up I use is:

Driver Tie Rod: OS2234L
Passenger Tie Rod: OS2234R
Drag link at Knuckle: OS2234R
Drag link at Pitman: ES2027L

One thing to note. While the 2234 and the 2026/2027 have the same taper of 7° or 1.5" per ft, the drag link style (ES2026R/ES2027L) need the taper sunk a little deeper (just 0.046" more). Wasn't an issue for me since I was reaming myself so I just stopped reaming where I needed. So depending how deep those knuckles were reamed, you could have an issue replacing ES2026R with OS2234R since it could be reamed too far.

Awesome info! Thanks! Which pitman arm are you using btw?

 

[75SV1]

I am doing a Waggy D44 swap on my Comanche, too. Mine is passenger side drop. I have no gotten to this point. I have done two WJ Big Brakes. Both are cross over, but Under. I used some extended Swaybar brackets from TnT or ??. They were OK. I used Ironman's on my last one. I like them better. I did buy a set for this setup. Not sure how they will work though. There was a thread on here, that the guy used extensions coming from C-frame stiffeners. WJ BB on a Dana 30. I did have to use at least 1 offset TRE on my last WJ BB. I think I added another as I put on Ruff Stuff's steering shock bracketed gear cover. Actually had it on the other setup. Didn't need offset TREs on that one. ????

 

[Ol Blue]

Honestly not sure, it came on the Jeep when I bought it. Maybe stock? It was reamed out to accept the GM one ton end. PN on it is 8952000615T27X

 

[Evan03]

Yes as mentioned above the biggest advantage is getting the tie rod and drag link seperated.

I woukdnt do all thevwork your doing then putt freaking shitty as inverted y peice of shit steering back on it.

Leaving the tie rod on the knuckles then putting the drag link on the high steer arm is a huge improvement . You will get many smiles from your investment.

Inverted y wont likly get any smiles

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