A Rubicon Express customer testimonial ...

[TrueBlueXJ]

Hey gang.

I haven't been around the forum in some time, but I thought this warranted a comeback. After all - isn't this what public forums are for? I shared my experience on my local forum, and the consensus there was: take it to .

Long story short - Rubicon Express won't ever get another cent of my money. Now for the reason(s) ... (this is long, but in your best interests, please read)

About a year ago I noticed one of my RE mono-tube shocks (rear) was leaking fluid. I inspected the shock for abnormal wear and saw none, but the seal had clearly deteriorated. I spoke to their customer service who asked that I file the complaint through the vendor (Quadratec). Fair enough - so I contacted Quadratec who is normally very helpful. They spoke to RE for me and came back to inform me that "Rubicon Express will not warranty their shocks if they use salt on the roads where you live." ... Sorry I don't live 20 miles from the Rubicon Trail in sunny California, maybe you should just make your shock seals with better materials. :dunno: Clearly companies like Rough Country, Rancho, Skyjacker, et al. understand this principle.

Anywho, I gave them the benefit of the doubt and thought maybe it was a fluke. I'm not hard on my Jeep, in fact I hardly ever get a chance to wheel it, but maybe I was just unlucky enough to get a flawed shock. Afterall if it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. :wierd:

So I bought a set of Skyjacker Hydros and called it good (which by the way are still running strong).

But fast forward 9 or 10 months to two weekends ago. After noticing uneven wear on my front tires I had an alignment shop take a look at the front end who deemed that I needed to replace two ball joints. In the interest of not tearing it all apart twice - I replaced all 4. Had I not done so it might have taken me even longer to notice this ...

Yep, that's right ... my driver's side coil spring is literally broken in half. How long has it been like this? No idea. But in all my years around Jeeps I have never, EVER, seen a coil spring break in half. Not in the mud, not on the rocks, not slamming down off of ledges, and not jumping the front end up and down trying to climb a root-covered hillside. Never. I've seen shocks blow out, I've seen control arm brackets sheered, I've seen tie-rod ends snapped, I've seen driveshafts twisted like a rung-out wash cloth, and I've seen axle shafts break in half and a Jeep left standing there like a three-legged dog. ... But I have NEVER seen coil spring break in half.

Need I remind you that this a DD. It seems at minimum 250 miles a week, but most of time quite a bit more. It's taken off-road maybe 3 or 4 times a year outside of weekend camping trips up old logging roads, in places a stock Jeep could make it but a lift and tires makes it easier. It's babied, because come Monday morning it's got a 20 mile drive to get me to work. So a broken coil spring is the absolute LAST thing I would expect to find next to a broken leaf spring.

Rather than reiterate the entire conversation, here's how the "customer service" transaction went when I contacted RE ...

Mike,

We spoke yesterday about the broken coil spring on my XJ. As I said in our phone conversation, this is a daily driver XJ that sees about 95% pavement. It's seen a few trails but is mostly used for camping trips in areas a stock Jeep could probably make it, but the lift and tires just make it easier. I've seen a lot of Jeeps used and abused to the limits of their capabilities, but I've never seen a coil spring break, even under the most heinous amounts of stress, and my Jeep sees more potholes than rocks. I don't know how long it's been like this, as I just noticed it over the weekend when replacing the still factory ball joints.

What I didn't mention yesterday is that this is actually the second Rubicon Express part that's failed me. Last year I attempted to file a complaint about a broken rear shock (RE mono-tube), that began leaking after about a year and half and eventually seized up under the Jeep. I was told to place the complaint through Quadratec, and after some brief communication I never heard back from them. Being that it's a DD and that it sees quite a few miles in a week, I just bit the bullet and replaced all 4 shocks with Skyjacker Hydros rather than wait it out any longer. At the time I thought maybe it was a fluke - that I just got a bad shock - but now that the coil spring has broken under very little stress (certainly not the amount of stress you advertise your products can stand up to, and I would hope not the amount of stress they were designed to withstand), I'm beginning to hold a poor opinion of RE's products.

From an economic standpoint it would have made more sense for me to go with Rough Country when I decided to modify the Jeep, as I don't make a lot of money, but being that it's a DD and that it sees a lot of miles, I listened to reviews and forum feedback and went with RE. The old adage when comparing RC and RE is that "You get what you pay for." If that's truly the case, then I'm confused on what exactly it is that I paid for ...

Like most Jeep enthusiasts I frequent a lot of online forums and I've shared my experiences with many of them. I don't intend to turn people away from Rubicon Express, but I'm hoping that in the interest of saving face and doing what's right, you'll be willing to rectify this situation.

Thanks Mike. I hope to hear from you soon.

-Kyle


Kyle—I have forwarded your e-mail to the sales manager and production manager.I personally will be out of the office tomorrow so more than likely will not be able to get back with you until Thursday.I am sorry to hear of the issues you had regarding the shock.The dealer who you purchased the product through should have take care of that issue but unfortunately that is not something we are able to control.Thank you for all of the information regarding your purchase however if you have an actual invoice as well that is certainly preferred.Regarding the shock—it is not a run of the mill mainstream type shock.That shock is made by Edelbrock on a private label basis so we do expect to have a good quality It kind of annoys me that they got off so easy.

Mike Koenig
Rubicon Express Sales
916-473-4603 direct line
866-284-7309 direct fax


Thank you Mike. I have the packing list that your warehouse sent with my order. I'll scan it tomorrow at my office and send it to you for verification. Had I known you were relying on someone else for the quality of your shocks (and your name), I would have worked harder to bring that to your attention. I do honestly believe that there was a fault in the shock, as I sold the other three in good working condition to a friend of mine who's still using them on his trail Jeep to this day.


Kyle—we will warranty the one spring but I would probably advise checking the other one more closely.I am somewhat concerned about only one cracking and also if you only replace one it may sit crooked.Let me know

Mike Koenig
Rubicon Express Sales
916-473-4603 direct line
866-284-7309 direct fax


Mike,

I agree with your concerns about the Jeep sitting crooked - a new spring will surely be more stiff than a three year old spring. If you're truly concerned I would hope you would warranty me a new SET of springs. Vehicle inspections in WV are very strict, and if one side of the suspension is within an inch higher or lower, or is even visibly off-kilter, I'll no doubt be red-flagged. Whatever flaw caused the coil spring to crack was no fault of my own, and I stand to gain nothing by getting two new springs except avoiding the headaches that an uneven suspension will cause, both from the inspection station and subsequently the law, not to mention the potential road manners - it's not like I can sell ONE spring.

Your product failed, and giving me one spring will only half-fix the issue and cause several new ones.

-Kyle


Kyle—if only one spring is broken then that is all that gets warrantied.As time goes on springs do settle and that is normal .If you need two springs we will gladly do a pro-ration.


Mike Koenig
Rubicon Express Sales
916-473-4603 direct line
866-284-7309 direct fax


and my most recent response ...


Mike,

I understand that it's normal for a spring to settle -- it's not the other spring I have a problem with. What's not normal is to have a coil spring break in half, putting me in a compromising situation where I have one spring that has faulted and one that has not, meaning that if you were to warranty only that spring, I'd be in a no-less compromising situation because my Jeep would very likely sit crooked. In other words, by fault of your product breaking, and by fault of you only wanting to warranty ONE spring, your company will have caused a chain of compromising situations.

I understand that the other spring has not failed, but sending me ONE new spring doesn't eliminate my problem, it only causes a new one. You have yet to offer me a real solution, which would be to send me a new SET of springs to fully right the wrong. I don't feel this is asking too much.

Again, Rubicon Express WILL NOT receive another cent of my money. They advertise themselves, and forum feedback reiterates their reputation as the "top of the line" suspension provider for Jeep enthusiasts. Perhaps if you live in the deserts of the West, you'll have better luck. But for the rest of us, for them to not once, but TWICE, argue that their products will not stand up to road salt (a shock, maybe, but a coil spring??) - then I would think twice about purchasing anything from Rubicon Express outside of a t-shirt. Although you never know, the California cotton fibers might melt right off your back should you dare to step outside.

 

[WB9YZU]

Maybe you should join and buy some new springs at a Club discount though one of our sponsors?

Ron

 

[ARB-XJ]

i have read ALOT about RE products failing lately....their quality has declined tremendously

 

[TrueBlueXJ]

I'm friends with a Rough Country vendor who's already offered to get me a set at his cost. RE offered to prorate me the second spring for $50, but I'd rather take my money elsewhere.

 

[TrueBlueXJ]

i have read ALOT about RE products failing lately....their quality has declined tremendously

During our initial phone conversation, he said "Yeah it's definitely not normal, but we've seen it happen a few times." So apparently this isn't the first time a coil spring has broken in half ...

 

[H8PVMT]

i have read ALOT about RE products failing lately....their quality has declined tremendously

you mean Edelbrocks quality

 

[kastein]

I wouldn't want to run the other spring even aside from sag issues, they probably came from the same lot and any material or processing flaw (which a cracked spring certainly indicates) will be much more likely to occur in the other spring as well.

 

[Dest]

If they're worried about it sitting level why not send you two? o.0 You'd figure for the amount of money you pay you'd get something...

 

[FlexdXJ]

That sucks about the coil. You gotta realize though that if a coil is not broken, they won't warrant it. They have no reason to warranty a perfectly good spring on the basis that the other one broke. How old were these shocks? that went bad. Sounds to me like the shock went bad in the time you had it. I didn't think shocks were covered by a warranty. Sounds like the guy did the best he could to help you out. You are asking for a set of coils when only one is bad. How much do you think they have sagged on your Jeep? I am not trying to stick up for RE because I don't have anything from RE on my Jeep.

 

[kastein]

Coil springs are sold as a set (at least mine were)... and replacing only one does not solve the problem, nor does it reduce the likelihood of another breakage due to the same failure being common to the lot.

 

[TrueBlueXJ]

That sucks about the coil. You gotta realize though that if a coil is not broken, they won't warrant it. They have no reason to warranty a perfectly good spring on the basis that the other one broke. How old were these shocks? that went bad. Sounds to me like the shock went bad in the time you had it. I didn't think shocks were covered by a warranty. Sounds like the guy did the best he could to help you out. You are asking for a set of coils when only one is bad. How much do you think they have sagged on your Jeep? I am not trying to stick up for RE because I don't have anything from RE on my Jeep.

The shocks were a year old when they started to leak, and after 18 months the shock in question would no longer compress. I actually ran on three shocks for a while because it was ten times smoother.

I can honestly see it from both sides - one spring broke, so replace one spring. But from my side I'm not only inconvenienced with the knowledge that I've been driving 300+ miles a week on a broken coil spring, but I'm potentially causing a new set of problems by having springs that cause the front of my vehicle to sit uneven - unavoidable of course had the spring not broken in the first place.

 

[dagr8tim]

Hope it works out for ya bro.

 

[Coastie]

Coil springs are sold as a set (at least mine were)... and replacing only one does not solve the problem, nor does it reduce the likelihood of another breakage due to the same failure being common to the lot.

X2

Good luck man, I would be looking for 2 coils if I were in your place.

Oh and props on providing both sides of this issue. And not being just another guy slamming a vendor.

 

[xcm]

quit bitching, theyre willing to warranty the coil that broke...

how does replacing the broken coil NOT solve the problem? what other problem is there? the hyped up inspection BS line? as i was reading it, i felt like you were pushing for free shit too, i cant blame him.

add an extra coil isolator, and get over it.

ALSO, shocks go out, theyre made for like, what, $20-30 each? theyre not top of the line shocks, you got a year and a half out of them.


i really cant find any fault with what rubicon's done in this thread...

 

[UNCC_99XJ]

Interesting situation. On the one hand, I could see how it'd be hard for RE to justify doing a warranty swap on two springs, when only one is broken. But on the other hand, it's a very valid argument that the Jeep would sit uneven with only one new spring, and that springs are certainly sold in pairs. Personally, I would go for two springs. While I see their point in one spring still technically being fine, considering the amount of money they make it's not like they'd be taking a big hit at all on warrantying an extra spring. Nice to see someone looking at it from both sides and not automatically slamming a vendor.

I'm sorry to hear you've had such a bad experience with RE. I've been running one of their kits for almost 2 years now and really don't have too many complaints. Smart move on the Skyjackers...I love my Nitro's. Best riding shock for a Jeep i've experienced yet. I too do the same type of driving that you do with your Jeep. 250+ miles a week, wheeling 3-4 times a year. I also live in a similar climate as you (ungodly amount of salt for nothing during the winters...and this winter was particularly bad given all the snow we got). My only gripes with their kit at the moment are my sway bar end links like to loosen up rather quickly and pop/bang like crazy, and i've been getting a hellacious pop from the right rear when the suspension flexes. At first I was thinking shackle or bushings, but the more I look at it the more I think they're OK and it's something in the leaf spring. Haven't had a chance to dig into it and look.

Hope it works out well for you in the end!

 

[RCP Phx]

I see several issues here.

First of all you could have purchased from a vendor that would take care of this.RE's service has always been poor,so you just buy through someone else.

Second,that spring could have failed from many reasons(rust being one of them) and they are going to replace it!

Third,look at your pic,theres "Massive" rust there,you should blame your local DOT!

Fourth,you didnt have a problem with RE,you had a problem with Quadratech.

 

[ECKSJAY]

They offered to warranty the broken part...and you turn it down while coming across as a douche.

To each his own.

 

[GrimmJeeper]

I haven't been around the forum in some time, but I thought this warranted a comeback. After all - isn't this what public forums are for? I shared my experience on my local forum, and the consensus there was: take it to .

I find this statement to be the only interesting part of this thread.

 

[xcm]

can we send it back?
OR EVEN BETTER, take it to pirate!

i AM sticking up for rubicon! theyve done nothing wrong here, except sell to the wrong person.
you will be much happier with rough country, for future referance.

 

[FlexdXJ]

The shocks were a year old when they started to leak, and after 18 months the shock in question would no longer compress. I actually ran on three shocks for a while because it was ten times smoother.

I can honestly see it from both sides - one spring broke, so replace one spring. But from my side I'm not only inconvenienced with the knowledge that I've been driving 300+ miles a week on a broken coil spring, but I'm potentially causing a new set of problems by having springs that cause the front of my vehicle to sit uneven - unavoidable of course had the spring not broken in the first place.

You don't really think the Jeep leaning is going to affect it that much do you? You could have been driving on that for months and not known it. The weight of the Jeep was on it. It was not going to fly off. If it was broken in the middle it would be a different story but its broke close to the spring bucket. It wasn't coming out unless you were out Jumping it. I did see where your inspections in WV were strict but I think you wouldn't get much hassle for a slight lean.