Please do. I'm trying to visualize your issues/solutions, but not sure I'm getting it. Hopefully your solution will help me see it better.
wet carpet, take 2. AAAARRRRGH!!
- Thread starter wgregt
- Start date
Please do. I'm trying to visualize your issues/solutions, but not sure I'm getting it. Hopefully your solution will help me see it better.
I kept having a wet carpet in the rear of my 89.
The problem ended up being leaks at the back end of the rain gutters.
A little rust and body flex had created small cracks.
I could not see the rust until I pulled the trim off the back part the the gutter.
RTV all cracks and the pinch seam.
Some of the cracks extended to the back, they got RTV too.
No more water in the rear.
Found out the black RTV is not that black, matched my gray almost perfect.
The problem ended up being leaks at the back end of the rain gutters.
A little rust and body flex had created small cracks.
I could not see the rust until I pulled the trim off the back part the the gutter.
RTV all cracks and the pinch seam.
Some of the cracks extended to the back, they got RTV too.
No more water in the rear.
Found out the black RTV is not that black, matched my gray almost perfect.
Hmm. I'm trying to picture where this is exactly. My raingutters are metal, but I'm not sure about the trim on them. Not sure if I even HAVE trim on them (mine are painted). Pinch seam? You mean the seam between this rain gutter and the body? Some of them extend to the back, meaning across the body to the rear of the vehicle?
Sounds like your saying the cracks were on the body BEFORE the hatch itself?
Got any fotos of this fix?
Agreed. Used the same black RTV, and if you have the Dove Grey Metallic like I do it's damn near a perfect match.
More rain today=good for me.
Opened the rear hatch after the last deluge, and the only thing I see is water coming inside the cargo area by flowing OVER the rear floor ridge at the gate.
In other words, it's flowing around the door seal (like I thought) and filling up the depression where the pin/catch is on the body (like I frequently have seen after washing it) but it's running OVER that small half-circular ridge that goes around the pin itself (and UNDER the plastic molding that goes around the pin @ the edge of the rear hatch on the bottom) and flowing onto the floor and the channels on the floor. AND it's crossing that same long transverse ridge that runs L to R in various places (on both the right side AND the left side now), not just at the pin depression.
Baby powder around the rear cargo side window seals is still bone dry, and I'm down to JUST the bare window seals and metal on both sides now. If it was leaking, I'm confident I would see it come in there.
So...looks like I'll have to pull up that entry floor trim (that goes around the pin) once again and try and silicone a ridge under it, and see if that works.
That is, unless you guys have other/better ideas...
Opened the rear hatch after the last deluge, and the only thing I see is water coming inside the cargo area by flowing OVER the rear floor ridge at the gate.
In other words, it's flowing around the door seal (like I thought) and filling up the depression where the pin/catch is on the body (like I frequently have seen after washing it) but it's running OVER that small half-circular ridge that goes around the pin itself (and UNDER the plastic molding that goes around the pin @ the edge of the rear hatch on the bottom) and flowing onto the floor and the channels on the floor. AND it's crossing that same long transverse ridge that runs L to R in various places (on both the right side AND the left side now), not just at the pin depression.
Baby powder around the rear cargo side window seals is still bone dry, and I'm down to JUST the bare window seals and metal on both sides now. If it was leaking, I'm confident I would see it come in there.
So...looks like I'll have to pull up that entry floor trim (that goes around the pin) once again and try and silicone a ridge under it, and see if that works.
That is, unless you guys have other/better ideas...
update:
I actually sat inside the back of the jeep in the pouring rain today. Crawled in thru the rear passenger door so I wouldn't have to open the hatch to ensure I didn't get any stray drips from opening it.
And, I think I may have this thing solved. I had water directly on the rear floor, but not anywhere near the seam/entry seal. Looking directly upward from the water I saw where water is coming in from the top of the rear window seal (one both the left and right side of the window) and dripping straight down on the floor. With my cargo tray in, this won't be a problem b/c it'll drip on top of the tray, and not on the carpet, but I'll pull that rear window seal (and window?) and try and silicone it nonetheless since it may be an easy job.
Anyone ever done this?
If not, I guess I could always just silicone the spot where it's dripping, but I'd like to try and do the whole thing. Would have done it tonight, but it won't cure right when it's less than 70 degrees or so and it needs to be dry for a day, which is impossible in CA lately. I had 12+ hours of continuous non-stop rain here today.
Good news: my rubber watertight roof nuts are in. Pick them up tomorrow, and hopefully will get them in the roof rack and installed tight this weekend.
I actually sat inside the back of the jeep in the pouring rain today. Crawled in thru the rear passenger door so I wouldn't have to open the hatch to ensure I didn't get any stray drips from opening it.
And, I think I may have this thing solved. I had water directly on the rear floor, but not anywhere near the seam/entry seal. Looking directly upward from the water I saw where water is coming in from the top of the rear window seal (one both the left and right side of the window) and dripping straight down on the floor. With my cargo tray in, this won't be a problem b/c it'll drip on top of the tray, and not on the carpet, but I'll pull that rear window seal (and window?) and try and silicone it nonetheless since it may be an easy job.
Anyone ever done this?
If not, I guess I could always just silicone the spot where it's dripping, but I'd like to try and do the whole thing. Would have done it tonight, but it won't cure right when it's less than 70 degrees or so and it needs to be dry for a day, which is impossible in CA lately. I had 12+ hours of continuous non-stop rain here today.
Good news: my rubber watertight roof nuts are in. Pick them up tomorrow, and hopefully will get them in the roof rack and installed tight this weekend.
Jeez, what a PITA couple of days. I got the jack nuts finally, and installed them. What a PITA these things were going in the holes for the roof rails. They like to spin, and any tool to prevent the spinning will cut up the vinyl coating badly. I've done the outer 2 rails (6 holes each) so far, with the 12 inner rail holes yet to do. Pics of the jacknut with the rain sealer below.
I also drilled some holes (5 total) to the depression around the hatch pin in order to drain the water outta there. For me, after laying down a nice think spray of baby powder all around the inside of the hatch leading edge at the bottom and along the sides, it was easy to see that the water was pooling up in the depression and running along the floor. Also ran a heavy bead along the edge of the entire hatch to help..should be covered up by the molding. Also drilled a hole on each side between the rubber hatch trim and the body, right in the lower curve of the door to let some water out as well. Pics below.
And...I found yet more results. Yep: add me to the pretty much all-inclusive list of folks with rust on the floorboards of the XJ. If you're not yet in this group, you will be, apparently.
Was about to put the carpet and molding back in, and felt under it one last time. Yep: wet cotton/diaper. Right side, passenger, rear, just rear of the vertical seat support. Perfect place for the water to roll under the carpet, down the seat slope, wet that damn diaper-sandwiched-between-plastic thing and stop @ the vertical support, and stay wet for all eternity. F me. Removed lots of loose rust, and I'm gonna TRY and save the support, since there's a little rust on the other side of the support. Might get by with some sort of sealer there though. Pics below.
I'm really gonna have to figure out a way to attach a new sheet of metal to the inside of that seat support if I can, as the rust goes right to the edge, leaving nothing to weld on to. Any idea are welcome, as I'm doing this for the first time. Maybe some sort of L angle iron that can be welded to the support, giving me a ledge for the flat sheet metal to weld to?
I also drilled some holes (5 total) to the depression around the hatch pin in order to drain the water outta there. For me, after laying down a nice think spray of baby powder all around the inside of the hatch leading edge at the bottom and along the sides, it was easy to see that the water was pooling up in the depression and running along the floor. Also ran a heavy bead along the edge of the entire hatch to help..should be covered up by the molding. Also drilled a hole on each side between the rubber hatch trim and the body, right in the lower curve of the door to let some water out as well. Pics below.
And...I found yet more results. Yep: add me to the pretty much all-inclusive list of folks with rust on the floorboards of the XJ. If you're not yet in this group, you will be, apparently.
Was about to put the carpet and molding back in, and felt under it one last time. Yep: wet cotton/diaper. Right side, passenger, rear, just rear of the vertical seat support. Perfect place for the water to roll under the carpet, down the seat slope, wet that damn diaper-sandwiched-between-plastic thing and stop @ the vertical support, and stay wet for all eternity. F me. Removed lots of loose rust, and I'm gonna TRY and save the support, since there's a little rust on the other side of the support. Might get by with some sort of sealer there though. Pics below.
I'm really gonna have to figure out a way to attach a new sheet of metal to the inside of that seat support if I can, as the rust goes right to the edge, leaving nothing to weld on to. Any idea are welcome, as I'm doing this for the first time. Maybe some sort of L angle iron that can be welded to the support, giving me a ledge for the flat sheet metal to weld to?
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GrimmJeeper
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Gardena, CA
Hopefully this will help you out a little Greg : http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=93863
cracked-butt
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Eastern Tenn.
greg, check my posts, think i posted up the "fixes" i did to get rid of my wheel-well rust.
sheet metal & pop-rivets
all i had to work with, no welders handy
sheet metal & pop-rivets
all i had to work with, no welders handykennzz05
basic dumbass
- Location
- palm coast fl.
wont those holes you drilled also let water spray in while driving
cracked-butt
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Eastern Tenn.
actualy no they won't. they sit directly above the gas tank
Well, there's a plastic cover trim piece that sits over them on top, so that will catch any water that comes up from underneath. I'm much more concerned with getting the water in that depression OUT of there.
I drove it in the rain today, and there's a lot of spray/water coming up thru that open hole in the floor. Shocker. For some reason I thought the muffler would block it, or turn it into steam when it splashes up. Enough water to make me double-think the idea of the water running down the slope from the rear hatch and settling where it rusted out...now I'm thinking that somehow the floor rusted out (from too-high heat from the muffler?) and the water was coming up from the road and soaking the mat/carpet from underneath.
I DID have a CD changer mounted there, which required 4 sheet metal screws in the floor to mount it...maybe those small holes got the rust started when they got wet? (I was young & ignorant when I installed it and didn't think about silicone around the screws...I guess I was so jazzed to actually find a place that would allow me to hide it I didn't think about rust!)
You should have seen the 4 screws that came out of the floor for the bracket. All about an inch long. 2 were about the same thread diameter as when they went in 10+ years ago. Two were the width/look of a sewing needle, and just as sharp. You could easily break these screws in half with just your finger.
Anyhow, just now I checked, and yep...the FRONT side of that vertical seat brace (which would be the right rear passenger floorboard now) has rust too. I just pushed my finger thru the bottom of the bracket (where it's welded to the floor) AND the floor itself. Good times. Now, this project just got bigger. I'm hoping that once I cut that brace out I can somehow figure how to get it back in in the same location.
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greg, check my posts, think i posted up the "fixes" i did to get rid of my wheel-well rust.
sheet metal & pop-rivets
Been all over the SEARCH, even filtered the results thru YOUR postings, but can't find any mention of it....you?
Hey guys, put your heads together on this one for me...
Went to the junkyard today to scope out XJs, and I have 3-5 to choose from. Various years. Some 2 door, some 4 door. One electric lime/kawasaki green exterior with neon blue interior, plastic, body carpet, everything. I'm sure there was either a story or a bet involved with that one. Possibly both.
Anyhow, all have intact rear floorboards. Was wondering how I could cut one out with hand tools, or is there another way? Love to get a plasma torch to make quick work of removing enough to weld to mine, but have no idea how to go about it. And I've never used a plasma torch before, so there's that.
I've seen guys walking around there with car batteries for juice, but not sure what kinda work it would take to cut one out by hand/hacksaw. Any ideas? I'd like to take the whole passenger right floor pan and seat support as well, then weld it to mine as one piece.
What kinda sweating and cursing would I entail by the hacksaw method? Are we talking "like Mike Tyson at a spelling bee" kinda sweating, or "Sir, The IRS is on the phone for you and the guys from 60 Minutes are in the lobby" kinda sweating?
Went to the junkyard today to scope out XJs, and I have 3-5 to choose from. Various years. Some 2 door, some 4 door. One electric lime/kawasaki green exterior with neon blue interior, plastic, body carpet, everything. I'm sure there was either a story or a bet involved with that one. Possibly both.
Anyhow, all have intact rear floorboards. Was wondering how I could cut one out with hand tools, or is there another way? Love to get a plasma torch to make quick work of removing enough to weld to mine, but have no idea how to go about it. And I've never used a plasma torch before, so there's that.
I've seen guys walking around there with car batteries for juice, but not sure what kinda work it would take to cut one out by hand/hacksaw. Any ideas? I'd like to take the whole passenger right floor pan and seat support as well, then weld it to mine as one piece.
What kinda sweating and cursing would I entail by the hacksaw method? Are we talking "like Mike Tyson at a spelling bee" kinda sweating, or "Sir, The IRS is on the phone for you and the guys from 60 Minutes are in the lobby" kinda sweating?
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cracked-butt
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Eastern Tenn.
then its in a diff site.. heres a link to the pics i took....
the problem culprit...
http://gi106.photobucket.com/groups/m280/FNHYF6DJLS/001-1.jpg
wire brushed all the rust & used sheet metal, drill & pop rivets to fix it all. then sprayed it all with the rubber undercoating to keep the water out.
(can't find the pic's either, not even in my photobucket? the link...http://s200.photobucket.com/home/jaugernot/index
Sprayed the top side of it (the side you pop-riveted), or do you mean you sprayed it from underneath (like they allegedly do @ a dealer when you buy it new)?
Damn! Was that thing in Katrina? Kudos to you for doing that big of a job...I may have "set her free" after seeing that....
The kind where you don't even get halfway through it, breaking umpteen hacksawblades and eventually giving it all up. New cursewords will pop all over the place.
At least get a grinder with a decent cutting wheel. Make sure you remove the fueltank and do not grind the fuel lines.
Some kind of face shield is clever... lots and lots of dust and nastyness.
cracked-butt
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Eastern Tenn.
once i clear out the back i'll take & post the pics from inside. but mainly from underneath. but also from the inside (around the edges & on the pop rivets) to fill in any gaps & to assist in any areas i might have missed from underneath.
:roflmao: no it wasn't in Katrina!! we got rear-ended by some female that was doin the 55mph speed limit. and i'm workin on repainting it.
:idea: once i can finish the primer i'm gonna get a box full (8-10 cans) of metallic purple and do something crazy like put either a hot pink pin-stripe down her sides or something crazy like that.:wow:
the xj is actualy in my gf's name, so "technicaly" it's hers. and she likes the metallic purple.
my touch for it will be paintin the P.O.W. / M.I.A. flag on her somewhere. not sure if it'll be on the rear hatch or a corner panel. any suggestions for that?
Well, I've cut out all the rust from the passenger floor, and got a sheet of 18ga ready to drop in. What an ordeal. Got the seat brace cut out too...what a PITA. It needs to be cut down a bit in order to keep it flush with the top of the brace on the other side as well.
But first I need some welding advice.
Since I'm covering up a hole with a sheet of metal that's a bit wider on all sides, is there some sort of caulking or adhesive that I should put AROUND the edges of the hole first in order to make a better seal and prevent water from coming up from underneath and getting between the floor and the sheet I'm welding to it? In other words, I'm trying to figure out if this is necessary, and how to seal the water out since the actual weld beads are gonna be not at the edges of the hole (it's bigger by about 3-4 inches on all sides.) Would clear silicone work, or would the heat from the welding melt it and make it useless?
Still got water coming in the back somehow around the molding. I've siliconed around the rear windows and the hatch trim, but the floor is still wet, damn it.
Here's one for you: I looked down the insides against the rear qtr panels yesterday (all the trim molding is removed from the rear right now, so it's easy to see.) Both sides were filled with water, about 4" in each side! I got under and pulled the plugs and it all drained out, but can't figure how water got in there. Any ideas? Just from driving in the rain? Can't see how water would fill those areas up just from driving that much.
But first I need some welding advice.
Since I'm covering up a hole with a sheet of metal that's a bit wider on all sides, is there some sort of caulking or adhesive that I should put AROUND the edges of the hole first in order to make a better seal and prevent water from coming up from underneath and getting between the floor and the sheet I'm welding to it? In other words, I'm trying to figure out if this is necessary, and how to seal the water out since the actual weld beads are gonna be not at the edges of the hole (it's bigger by about 3-4 inches on all sides.) Would clear silicone work, or would the heat from the welding melt it and make it useless?
Still got water coming in the back somehow around the molding. I've siliconed around the rear windows and the hatch trim, but the floor is still wet, damn it.
Here's one for you: I looked down the insides against the rear qtr panels yesterday (all the trim molding is removed from the rear right now, so it's easy to see.) Both sides were filled with water, about 4" in each side! I got under and pulled the plugs and it all drained out, but can't figure how water got in there. Any ideas? Just from driving in the rain? Can't see how water would fill those areas up just from driving that much.
