Should I buy five new tires? Who does a 5 tire rotation?

[Blaine B.]

I have full size matching-size spares in both my Jeep and car but I never put them in the rotation. I just let them stay clean and classy in the "trunks".

 

[RedHeep]

It is worth it. You're not wasting money on the spare if you rotate it in. It's still the same miles / dollars / tires. Let's use your example of $150 a tire and for the sake of round numbers say we only get 20,000 miles tread life out of each tire.

If you have 4 and rotate them every 5000 miles, $600 gets you 20,000 total miles which is $0.03 per mile.

If you have 5 and rotate them every 5000 miles, $750 gets you 25,000 total miles (each has taken a 5,000 mile break as your spare) which is again $0.03 per mile.

The only way you could possibly lose money on the deal is if you drive your Jeep so few miles that the tires dry rot before you have a chance to wear them out.

Ok, but at 20,000 miles I spend another $600 and get 4 new tires. For arguements sake, lets say the spare is still serviceable.

At 25,000 miles, you spend $750 and get 5 new tires.

So for your first tire change plus your original investment, you've spent $1500 and I've spent $1350.

At 40/50,000 miles, you and I spend the same again. Again, lets pretend the spare is ok, given that the average nowadays is 15,000 miles, a spare should last 3 years at least.

Now your investment is $2250 and mine is $2000. You've spent 22 cents a mile and I've spent 20 cents a mile.

I still have a $150 tire on the back of my jeep and you have to buy 5 more.

So maybe you're getting the better of me at 100,000 miles, but I'm saving $750 in spare tires that's in my pocket and not invested in a theoritical game of how much per mile my tires cost.

25000 miles at $750 is 33 cents a mile, not .03.

 

[Silver60th]

You could either tie it down flat in the cargo area, or...

http://www.detoursusa.com/tailbone.php

***my page didn't load the new replies since I last logged in...disregard my comment***

 

[H8PVMT]

when I moved from Cali back east I bought a matching 5th at the last minute for my TJ, then at 2am I blew a flat somewhere in gods blind spot, KS and couldn't have been happier I had it with me

 

[tbburg]

I do a 5-tire rotation since I put 30"s on it. ('had to buy a matching stock rim to replace the doughnut) Got about 15K on the tires now, they're all wearing evenly. Did the 5-tire on my CJ also, tires wore down evenly. I recommend it. You may not get exactly 25% more mileage out of a set of tires, but your tires will last longer. The only way you loose is if(as stated above) you don't drive your jeep enough and the carcasses rot off before the tread wears out.

Interesting story about the stock spare. A few months after i replaced it(sitting in the garage)I needed to roll a project out of the way. It had air and was easiest to get to, so I slapped it on. It went flat 5 minutes later. Glad I never needed it on the highway.

 

[96XJ_4.0]

I used to buy 6 for the M3. I burned through 4 rears as fast as 2 fronts...

but yea, rotate that 5th or your just left with 1 good tire and 4 50k mile tires. THEN, they do th new tread design change and your ****** stuck with a new tire in your backyard!

 

[Talyn]

Its called a spare for a reason.

 

[XJ86Fever]

Its called a spare for a reason.

Something to do with bowling, right??? :laugh2: Sorry, couldn't resist eace:

 

[chameleo78]

but yea, rotate that 5th or your just left with 1 good tire and 4 50k mile tires. THEN, they do th new tread design change and your ****** stuck with a new tire in your backyard!

Very good argument for rotating the 5th one in. I have a brand new OEM rim and Yokohama Geolander AT+II in my cargo area that I don't think I'll be able to find a match for as Yokohama has changed the tread on them. The other 4 tires have probably 20k on them. Maybe I'll get lucky and be able to find one to match my spare....

 

[fyrfytr1717]

Ok, but at 20,000 miles I spend another $600 and get 4 new tires. For arguements sake, lets say the spare is still serviceable.

At 25,000 miles, you spend $750 and get 5 new tires.

So for your first tire change plus your original investment, you've spent $1500 and I've spent $1350.

OK, I'm following you. But as you just stated, I went 5,000 miles further than you before I had to buy tires again.

At 40/50,000 miles, you and I spend the same again. Again, lets pretend the spare is ok, given that the average nowadays is 15,000 miles, a spare should last 3 years at least.

Now your investment is $2250 and mine is $2000. You've spent 22 cents a mile and I've spent 20 cents a mile.

Took me a minute to figure out your math, but that's because there are a few problems with it. First problem is that you're doing it backward. You're solving for miles/dollar instead of dollars/mile. So basically, you just proved my point. You get 20 miles for every $1 while I get 22 miles for every $1.

Also, keep in mind that dividing the miles we've gone on two sets of tires (40K/50K) by the price we've paid for three sets ($2000/$2250) leaves me with a complete set of 5 new tires on my Jeep and you with 4 new tires and an unused 2+ year old spare on yours.

Lastly, let me help your argument a bit here. 750 + 600 + 600 = $1950 which means you've spent $50 less than you thought and actually helps your cause. But even still, how do you figure you're ahead? By the time we each wear out that third set of tires, I'll have driven 75,000 miles for $2250 and you'll only have driven 60,000 for your $1950. 2250 / 75000 = .030/mile and 1950 / 60000 = .0325/mile. A savings of a whopping $0.0025 per mile. Solving for miles per dollar as you did above shows I went 33.33 miles per $1 and you went 30.77 miles per $1.

I still have a $150 tire on the back of my jeep and you have to buy 5 more.

True, if you can find a buyer for 1 (old) unused tire when they discontinue your tread pattern or you change tire sizes. Chances are though that at 60,000 miles you have to throw it away and buy a new one because it is cracked and deteriorating. I on the other hand have saved myself enough money to buy a brand new spare in addition to the ones I've been rotating in once I hit 60,000 miles. (My $0.0025 savings per mile x 60,000 miles = $150.)

So maybe you're getting the better of me at 100,000 miles, but I'm saving $750 in spare tires that's in my pocket and not invested in a theoritical game of how much per mile my tires cost.

This isn't a theoretical game, opinion, or guess. It is basic algebra and given the same tread life and purchase price of a tire, there is only one right answer. Any way you look at it, it costs less to rotate all 5 tires no matter whether we're talking 20,000 miles or 2,000,000 miles. The only thing that makes this a game is that we're arguing over a piddly $50 per 20,000 miles (in my pocket ).

25000 miles at $750 is 33 cents a mile, not .03.

Boy am I glad your math is wrong again here. At that price, we'd actually be spending more on tires than gas! Think about it...

 

[RedHeep]

How long do you think it's going to take to get to 60,000 miles on a modified jeep?

I just pulled the brand new spare tire out of a '90 Volvo 740. It's 20 years old and I wouldn't hesitate to put it on a vehicle. So the 2 year old spare on the back of the jeep? Yeah, it's probably just fine.

You're right, I did the math wrong. But the point I'm trying to make is that with the amount of time you're going to drive your jeep (your jeep in your signature in particular), do you really think you're money ahead at 25,000 miles? You bought 5 and I bought 4. You're probably ready for an upgrade in tire size or you're tired of it and getting rid of it at that point anyway.

How much have you driven your jeep in the last year?

Not to mention, I highly doubt the majority of owners on this site are just driving back and forth on the highway. We haven't even discussed costs associated with tire failure on the trail or the advanced wear that you see because you take it offroad.

You can have your opinion and I'll have mine. No harm, no foul. I'd rather have a brand new spare on the back of the jeep when I go wheeling/driving than one that's a thousand miles away from being junk.

 

[FlexdXJ]

How long do you think it's going to take to get to 60,000 miles on a modified jeep?

I just pulled the brand new spare tire out of a '90 Volvo 740. It's 20 years old and I wouldn't hesitate to put it on a vehicle. So the 2 year old spare on the back of the jeep? Yeah, it's probably just fine.

You're right, I did the math wrong. But the point I'm trying to make is that with the amount of time you're going to drive your jeep (your jeep in your signature in particular), do you really think you're money ahead at 25,000 miles? You bought 5 and I bought 4. You're probably ready for an upgrade in tire size or you're tired of it and getting rid of it at that point anyway.

How much have you driven your jeep in the last year?

Not to mention, I highly doubt the majority of owners on this site are just driving back and forth on the highway. We haven't even discussed costs associated with tire failure on the trail or the advanced wear that you see because you take it offroad.

You can have your opinion and I'll have mine. No harm, no foul. I'd rather have a brand new spare on the back of the jeep when I go wheeling/driving than one that's a thousand miles away from being junk.

Josh, what do you care about the prices of tires and such, The Jeep you wheel was free! Sorry, had to give you a hard time!

 

[RedHeep]

Josh, what do you care about the prices of tires and such, The Jeep you wheel was free! Sorry, had to give you a hard time!

The jeep I built wasn't.

Neither was all the things I did to the "free" one so I could wheel it. Or the $3,000 Nate and I spent to go to Moab and back.

But you're right. I didn't buy the tires I have now.

Sometimes I wonder if a new set of tires would have been cheaper than winning the raffle.

 

[itbrokeagain]

JCR makes a solution just for you............and a bunch of other people! I will take IllianaXJ's advice and rotate the fifth tire so the sun doesn't hit the same part of the tire all the time OR get a cover for it.

Make a mount that has a unit bearing on it. That way you can give the tire a good spin every now and again and you have an extra unit bearing.

 

[FlexdXJ]

Make a mount that has a unit bearing on it. That way you can give the tire a good spin every now and again and you have an extra unit bearing.

Now we're thinking!

 

[FlexdXJ]

The jeep I built wasn't.

Neither was all the things I did to the "free" one so I could wheel it. Or the $3,000 Nate and I spent to go to Moab and back.

But you're right. I didn't buy the tires I have now.

Sometimes I wonder if a new set of tires would have been cheaper than winning the raffle.

I understand. I was just lightening the mood in here. When Brendan and I go to Moab(hopefully he buys a 2 place trailer), I hope it doesn't cost that much. I kinda figured you had another Jeep anyways since IIRC the raffle rig belongs to your dad right? If its any consolation the tires on my Jeep were on there when I bought it too!

 

[RCP Phx]

One thing not mentioned yet is "Warranty".Ive been buying tires from Discount for about 40yrs.Didnt even realize till about 10yrs ago that there is a 3yr time clause.Big-O out here has the same clause.
So bottom line is they can refuse to warranty a tire even if it has never seen the road.
On that same thought,I dont like the thought of putting on a spare when really need it,that could possibly fail 5 miles down the road!

 

[kastein]

Make a mount that has a unit bearing on it. That way you can give the tire a good spin every now and again and you have an extra unit bearing.

:doh: why did I never think of that?

I just bought a wheel mount from ruffstuff for the bumper+tire carrier I'm planning on building... and I have a couple old dud unit bearings sitting around I was going to give to a scrapper with the next pile of scrapmetal.

EDIT: probably will deter theft too, ever try and unbolt lugs with a front wheel off the ground and spinning free? Guess I'll bring along a bar to stick through the u-joint ears

 

[fyrfytr1717]

How long do you think it's going to take to get to 60,000 miles on a modified jeep?

I just pulled the brand new spare tire out of a '90 Volvo 740. It's 20 years old and I wouldn't hesitate to put it on a vehicle. So the 2 year old spare on the back of the jeep? Yeah, it's probably just fine.

You're right, I did the math wrong. But the point I'm trying to make is that with the amount of time you're going to drive your jeep (your jeep in your signature in particular), do you really think you're money ahead at 25,000 miles? You bought 5 and I bought 4. You're probably ready for an upgrade in tire size or you're tired of it and getting rid of it at that point anyway.

How much have you driven your jeep in the last year?

60,000 miles takes me a long time... My Jeep is my daily driver, but I'm fortunate enough to have a commute of less than 10 miles per week. Tends to make the mileage accumulate pretty slowly. I just replaced a set of 5 BFG MT KM1's. I got about 55,000 miles out of them over the course of the last 7 years. They were starting to get close to the tread wear indicators, had plenty of scuffs on the sidewalls, had chunks missing out of the tread blocks, had lots of surface cracks from sun damage, and were worn unevenly due to my toe being set improperly since they were first installed. Deciding it's time to swap out mud tires is almost always a judgement call though. Do you change them at 50% tread, 25% tread, when you hit the TWI's? I felt they had enough tread left last season, but I decided it was time for new tires this year. Admittedly, due to my lack of annual mileage (and the amazing wear I got out of my tires) the surface cracks were starting to make me nervous. Had I only been rotating 4, they would have worn out at about 44,000 miles and I would have swapped them out with about 1.5 years less sun damage. Undoubtedly this would have been safer than squeezing that last year and a half of life out of them.

I replaced them with a set of KM2's in the same size as even 7 years later I was still happy with the size and performance of my original KM1's. In fact, I would have stuck with the KM1's had they not been discontinued. Fortunately, the discontinuation didn't result in me having to throw away an unused spare tire.

Not to mention, I highly doubt the majority of owners on this site are just driving back and forth on the highway. We haven't even discussed costs associated with tire failure on the trail or the advanced wear that you see because you take it offroad.

Offroading is definitely rough on tires, no question there. While my old tires showed obvious sign of offroad abuse, I was lucky enough to never have an outright failure. Tire damage is just a "cost of doing business" in our hobby. I don't see how tire rotation affects this.

You can have your opinion and I'll have mine. No harm, no foul. I'd rather have a brand new spare on the back of the jeep when I go wheeling/driving than one that's a thousand miles away from being junk.

True, we are each entitled to our opinions. No harm, no foul intended here either. As for the second part, keep in mind that when you include your spare in the rotation, it will never be any older or more worn out than the other 4 tires that got you to the trail. If your spare is a thousand miles away from being junk, so are the rest of your tires.