Rear flex with Rusty's. Is this normal?

[woody]

" noticed something a while back that might relate to your problem. If you look closley at your pic of the shackle, you will see the bumper bracket bolts sticking through into the box that the shackle mounts in. As you compress the spring, the shackle moves back, directly into one of the lower bolts. Call it a design flaw in the shackle if you want, but you either need to notch the shackle to clear the bolt, or whack the bolt off with a grinder or sawzall."

Ya I found out this was why my revolver shackles werent revolving...they hung up on the rear bumper mounts (not factory) and severley limited the swing of the shackle. I removed the shackles to sell them, then removed the bumper to 'clearance' the mounts...installed some MJ shackles and flexed it up w/o the bumper on there...WOW what a difference. It rides SO MUCH better on the road now that the shackles & springs have free movement. Also agree with JnJ to check that the shackle bolts aren't too tight.

FWIW I am running 4.5" Rusty's pack with an extra leaf that nets 6" approx (with approx 400# of 'junk' in the back)

Thanks all for the Track Bar advice...mine needs some attention to the mount clearance...

 

[SV1CEC]

I noticed something a while back that might relate to your problem. If you look closley at your pic of the shackle, you will see the bumper bracket bolts sticking through into the box that the shackle mounts in. As you compress the spring, the shackle moves back, directly into one of the lower bolts. Call it a design flaw in the shackle if you want, but you either need to notch the shackle to clear the bolt, or whack the bolt off with a grinder or sawzall. As for the track bar, you're fine just cutting a little out of the bracket to allow more flex. Are you running a HD track bar mount or just an upgraded track bar? You might want to consider moving the passenger side mount further twoard the center of the vehicle as well, if you don't want to grind anything.

You are right about that bolt. Actually, when I had the shackles installed, the mechanic put a thick washer on the bolt, so that it does not go so far inside the shackle mount. However, when I was trying to flex the truck, I checked that area and the shackle was not even close to that bolt, so that was not the issue. I plan to have that bolt shorten, unfortunatelly I do not have a swazal, so it is only elbow grease!!!

Thanks for bringing this up though.

As for the track bar, this is an upgrade of the standard trackbar that Rusty sells. The one I got with my lift kit had the TRE at the frame end, which was dead-on-arrival. It was not that obvious though, so I never noticed it. What I did notice was a severe problem with my steering, which took me 6 months to troubleshooot. So, I just got the heavy duty bushing end and the corresponding frame. Of course they didn't fit, unless I chopped off a piece from the threaded end of the trackbar. So moving the passenger's side to the center will probably mean I have to trim the threaded end even more, I 'll probably end up running out of thread. I think I'll trimm a little that area above the trackbar.

Many tnx and rgds

 

[Danno]

John, your real solution is to:

patch up all the "bullet holes" cuz your leaf spring fluid is leaking out of them.

 

[Crunch]

The easiest way I found to trim for the trac bar was to get out the sawzall with the tracbar off and trim right back to the coil bucket. I saw no need for this extra bit of metal overhanging. Actually, I left about 1/16", and once I cleared the top, I cut horizontally on the back side to complete the cut.

Question; The last several shots you showed of the shackles, were those shots with the weight of the XJ or were they with the weight unloaded from the spring?

If they were unloaded, I'd say they are just about right. If that was sitting on level ground, I'd say short springs.

Crunch

 

[Nay]

If noboby told you...you have to leave the bolts loose until all the weight is on the springs, and then torque them.

Heavy duty, tall lift springs don't ride very nice if you want any handling at all. Your shackles are still a bit short. At a minimum, you should have the droop/compression of the movement of the shackle within the shackle box, which would be more than exhibited in your pictures.

On the other hand, what you are doing in your pics doesn't require much rear flex, so you probably aren't seeing all the movement. Are you sure your rear swaybar is removed?

If any of this is redundant to the rest of the thread, pls forgive me for not reading it.

FWIW, I don't have a ton of rear flex, and I like the extra stability on and offroad.

Nay

 

[SV1CEC]

Re: John, your real solution is to:

patch up all the "bullet holes" cuz your leaf spring fluid is leaking out of them.

No, no you got it wrong, what is leaking is the lightbulbs lubricant!

rgds

 

[SV1CEC]

The easiest way I found to trim for the trac bar was to get out the sawzall with the tracbar off and trim right back to the coil bucket. I saw no need for this extra bit of metal overhanging. Actually, I left about 1/16", and once I cleared the top, I cut horizontally on the back side to complete the cut.

My track bar does not bind on the downward part, it is hitting the upper wall of its mount. I do not think I can cut it there, I think there is the steering stabilizer mount, right there. I'll have too check, to late in the evening to remember.

Question; The last several shots you showed of the shackles, were those shots with the weight of the XJ or were they with the weight unloaded from the spring?

If they were unloaded, I'd say they are just about right. If that was sitting on level ground, I'd say short springs.

Crunch

Crunch, all shackles pictures were taken with the truck sitting on a ... more or less level ground with the weight on the axles. So I think it is about right as it is now, the shackles are almost vertical.

Thanks for the tips.

 

[SV1CEC]

If noboby told you...you have to leave the bolts loose until all the weight is on the springs, and then torque them.

I'll unscrew them and retighten them this weekend. Tnx.

Heavy duty, tall lift springs don't ride very nice if you want any handling at all. Your shackles are still a bit short. At a minimum, you should have the droop/compression of the movement of the shackle within the shackle box, which would be more than exhibited in your pictures.

I am no suspension engineer, but I am not sure if what you are saying is 100% true. I would expect companies which develop lift kits, to offer soft springs, since you are going to use the truck off-road. Handling might be affected, but I am sure a compromise can be reached, where your springs are not soft enough to let your truck roll, while at the same time, they are not that hard to cause kidney relocation.

On the other hand, what you are doing in your pics doesn't require much rear flex, so you probably aren't seeing all the movement. Are you sure your rear swaybar is removed?

That might be true, I know a place where I can test the full flex, hopefully I'll be able to visit it this weekend. As for my rear sway bar, it was removed even before my lift was installed.

Rgds

 

[Crunch]

My track bar does not bind on the downward part, it is hitting the upper wall of its mount. I do not think I can cut it there, I think there is the steering stabilizer mount, right there. I'll have too check, to late in the evening to remember.


The cutting I was referring to is the top of the tracbar mount. The stabilizer is on top of the coil bucket and the tb mount is below and to the right.

Crunch

 

[SV1CEC]

My track bar does not bind on the downward part, it is hitting the upper wall of its mount. I do not think I can cut it there, I think there is the steering stabilizer mount, right there. I'll have too check, to late in the evening to remember.


The cutting I was referring to is the top of the tracbar mount. The stabilizer is on top of the coil bucket and the tb mount is below and to the right.

Crunch

Chuck,

I'll have a look at it today. If there is room there, it will be cutting time this weekend. The only problem is that it is too hot these days here, so I am not sure I would be in the "lying under the truck mood", most probably "stay in the sea mood".

Tnx and rgds

 

[SV1CEC]

Folks,

Yesterday, I took the XJ for some flexing. Here are some pictures:

This is a place I knew I could flex the suspension, almost to its limits.

Here is a picture from the rear opposite:

Here are two more pictures, where the left rear wheel is practically not touching the ground, so as someone suggested previously, this is the maximum flex:

Do you think that the rear flexes enough? My opinion is that the wheel going up, is not going as far up as it could go, the bump stops are way far from the axle, and as you can see from the picture below, the shackle has still enough to go to the rear.

A couple more shots, the first to show how much the leaves have been moved from their position, I guess this is normal.

And the second to show how close the bumper bolt was to the shackle.

It didn't touch, but was close enough. I took the bolts out today and have them trimmed. At the same time, I loosened the shackles bolts, they were very tight. I mean I had to use two wrenches one into the other, to loosen the nut. I shook the truck up and down by jumping on the bumper, and drove it a little back and forth and retightened them, but not that much. If I'll get the chance, I take it to the same place tomorrow to see if it made a difference.

I would sincerely appreciate your opinion, folks.

Tnx and rgds

 

[ChuckD]

Look fine to me, just as much as others with rear leafs. Like said before, more breaking in will help them flex a little more. Do you have extended bumpstops, because if you don't, you will never hit them or want to with the oversized tires.

 

[Casper]

I think that Scott Mac has the point here. I looked at your pictures, and it appears that with new springs, you are stuffing pretty good. Take it off road more and WORK IT. I think you will see a progressive difference. With the trac bar issue, either trim the top as suggested or get a drop bracket for the upper mount. You can also change out the end (if it is a tie rod end) for a heim joint and make a "U" bracket and bolt it to the original mount bolt and turn your heim (hole horizontal) bolt it to the "U" bracket and THERE YOU GO! We have done this many times and it works EXCELLENT.

Casper

 

[CJS]

Did you check to make sure your shocks aren't maxing out?? Sounds kinda stupid but I've had shocks on for a few months before realizing they were too short.

 

[SV1CEC]

To all who replied:

1. Thanks, I sincerely appreciate it.

2. Some comments/answers

- CJS : The shocks are OME long ones, they are far from maxing out.

- Casper : Track bar has already a lowered frame mount, Rusty's. And it has the horizontal bolt. I think I just need to trim the part above its axle mount a bit.

- Chuck : my bump stops are stock, I plan on extending them as soon as I get an idea of how much I need to.

Again, tnx all and rgds