Please review my dream build(s)

For my "expedition" style rig, I went for a very similar set up to what you are talking about.

About 4 inches of lift- (remember that xj's are so short stock that my xj is about the height of a new jk rubicon) (Rubicon Express 3.5 inch kit with longer rear shackles, no sway bars and OME shocks)

Long arms- They make washboard/fast trail driving more fun and more comfortable. (Not to mention the droop...) (Rough country)

255/85/16 km2's, its a 33.3x10.4 on a 16 inch rim

4.56 gears with a front lock right- Still not enough gear in my opinion, considering the weight, and terrain I drive in. 4.88's would be best

Armor front to back, inside and out
-Rigidco front bumper, with a smittybilt winch plate grafted in, xrc8 winch with synthetic line (has saved my butt more than a few times, I would recommend a winch for any type of long distance travel)
-Custom4x4 rear bumper bumper with tire carrier- reinforced to tie in with the hitch, has a hilift mount too.
-AJ's off road sliders with outer tube
-HD offroad frame stiffeners
-Rock Hard 4x4 roll cage (major frame stiffening)

These mods among others have made for a really reliable DD and expo rig, I still want to do more things like alloys and such, but I'm still a starving student.

And here's what it looks like, not too big, and just tall enough.


IMG_5061 by Sean Mitchell 707, on Flickr


IMG_5119 by Sean Mitchell 707, on Flickr
 
x WHATEVER on frame stiffeners.
Definitely get something better than the BFG's There are other tires for the $$ that are better. Yes, I know 33x10.5 is harder to find others. Might want to step up to a 16" wheel and find something close/in between if you really are set on 10.5. Before I got my MTR-k's, I had a few options that I contemplated. I really wanted a set of the Bridgestone Dueler AT REVO's, still the best AT tire money can buy, IMO.
Other tires I considered were, the GY Duratrac/Kelly Safari TSR, Falken Wildpeak AT/Rocky Mountain ATS, General Grabber Red Letter, Yoko Geolander ATS.
 
I can't say how much my stiffeners helped because well I kinda got a whole hybrid cage welded on while he was at it It's so stiff now(that's what she said). :D
 
I threw the stiffeners on my current rig a week or so after I picked it up while it was still 2 wheel drive. I won them in 2008 at moab, went to put them on the first XJ and after looking at how beat the rails were, I was like uh, never mind. Second rig was easy since it was bone stock, and I had them sitting under my work bench. You could immediately feel the difference in how the doors closed, how it felt driving, etc. This is now my first recommendation to anyone who has a virgin body.

As for gears, looks like most agree with my 4.56's. :) Trust me, we've all been there, done that. Final ratio in the 5 speed or the Auto are pretty close, 2-300 rpm at highway speed. You want the lower gears.

Tires: If you want skinny, go with a 16 or 17" wheel, and a metric tire. 285/70-17 or a 285/75-16 are both 33" tires and are on the narrow side, about 11" wide. I'm on 285/70-17 MTR-K's and they had no trouble driving through stuff at Johnson Valley, so I think they'll work fine for an Expedition rig.
 
srmitchell said:
Long arms- They make washboard/fast trail driving more fun and more comfortable. (Not to mention the droop...) (Rough country)
Click to expand...

Longarms and drop brackets are unnecessary on anything under ~5" of lift.

the ride difference will be almost unnoticeable between a CA at 5* and one at 20*

that is left up to the springs and shocks (mostly the shocks)
 
Really? If you are at 5" of lift with short arms, you're 5" into your droop. Drop brackets make a heck of a difference in the ride. Ask anyone who's on 5" or so of lift and has gone to drop brackets or long arms after being on short arms that are 5" into droop...
 
markw said:
Really? If you are at 5" of lift with short arms, you're 5" into your droop. Drop brackets make a heck of a difference in the ride. Ask anyone who's on 5" or so of lift and has gone to drop brackets or long arms after being on short arms that are 5" into droop...
Click to expand...

X2^^

4.5" and the drop brackets made all the difference. We've got a lot of concrete roads around here and the seams are much smoother with a lower control arm angle.
 
markw said:
Really? If you are at 5" of lift with short arms, you're 5" into your droop. Drop brackets make a heck of a difference in the ride. Ask anyone who's on 5" or so of lift and has gone to drop brackets or long arms after being on short arms that are 5" into droop...
Click to expand...

my jeep sits somewhere between 5" and 6" of lift with short arms... the ride quality is the same as similar rigs with both drop brackets and longarms.. or at least as is perceptable by the average human.... what most people perceive as a change in ride quality due to the control arms is a change in shock or spring performance.

I can assure you it is very easy to run a rig with short arms that rides better on the road and handles better at speed offroad than an off the shelf "longarm" kit. proper spring selection and shock tune are much more important.

as far as being "5 inches" into your droop... control arm angle has very little to do with that.

spring and shock length determine the amount of droop and uptravel, not CA angle. I can use all of a 12" shock, in fact I could probably run a 14" shock if the springs would travel that far.
 
rockclimber said:
my jeep sits somewhere between 5" and 6" of lift with short arms... the ride quality is the same as similar rigs with both drop brackets and longarms.. or at least as is perceptable by the average human.... what most people perceive as a change in ride quality due to the control arms is a change in shock or spring performance.

I can assure you it is very easy to run a rig with short arms that rides better on the road and handles better at speed offroad than an off the shelf "longarm" kit. proper spring selection and shock tune are much more important.

as far as being "5 inches" into your droop... control arm angle has very little to do with that.

spring and shock length determine the amount of droop and uptravel, not CA angle. I can use all of a 12" shock, in fact I could probably run a 14" shock if the springs would travel that far.
Click to expand...

I'm sitting here looking for a nice way to say this, but failing.


You're an idiot rockclimber. You're consistently posting bad tech that is contradictory to whatever anybody else is saying and cluttering the forums up with lousy incorrect information. We've all gotten used to that from you, but I think this post takes the cake by a long shot.
 
cal said:
I'm sitting here looking for a nice way to say this, but failing.


You're an idiot rockclimber. You're consistently posting bad tech that is contradictory to whatever anybody else is saying and cluttering the forums up with lousy incorrect information. We've all gotten used to that from you, but I think this post takes the cake by a long shot.
Click to expand...

LOL
harsh *and* funny.
 
:doh:
 
I'm with Cal! :doh:
 
rockclimber said:
Longarms and drop brackets are unnecessary on anything under ~5" of lift.

the ride difference will be almost unnoticeable between a CA at 5* and one at 20*

that is left up to the springs and shocks (mostly the shocks)
Click to expand...

are you on crack?
 
rockclimber said:
spring and shock length determine the amount of droop and uptravel, not CA angle. I can use all of a 12" shock, in fact I could probably run a 14" shock if the springs would travel that far.
Click to expand...

There isn't a driveshaft in the world that could back that claim up.

If your rig is special or built for a different purpose that the op is asking about, please leave your info out. It only adds confusion.
 
everything has already been covered, however i wont vouch for the overall accuracy...
all i'm gonna add about the gears is 33s AX-15 and 4.56s is the ideal mix. i drove that combination (with a spool even) in my 90 XJ as a DD for 2 years, including the 5000 mile round trip to Moab. a good usable 5th gear and acceleration/throttle response on the highway is a good thing, and dont be afraid of letting the 4.0L rev to 3000 RPM on the highway if you like to drive fast, it likes to breathe. the higher RPM doesnt use as much additional fuel as lugging the engine with your foot on the floor with higher gears.
if it were a trail-only rig, gear as deep as possible, dont wory about "ideal. if it's going to see regular street driving, do the 4.56s.
if you find you want more gear or larger tires after that the next step should be a 4:1 t/case anyways.
 
rockclimber said:
you should know, you don't have to be nice to me, I don't take this shit personally.



please, prove me wrong


please, prove me wrong.


:eeks1:
Click to expand...

ive made enough geometry changes from bad to worse to good back to bad to much better, and i can tell you without a doubt you're not helping yourself or the OP here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0
 
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