New SYE early 242 idea

[Gojeep]

Just been looking at my tail cone on my 95 242. It does appear that I could just shorten the tail cone right back to only just long enough to hold the same yoke seal that is at the end of it now. So would be as long as the seal housing supplied with a Tom Woods or RE early 242 kit. Then I was thinking of using a 27 spline yoke to fit directly to a double cardon joint like below.

Hoping to be able to use the far right one so you can place bolts in from behind like the front output shaft yoke. Would cut the yoke part right back to leave only enough length for the seal to run on in the shortened tail cone housing. Have it so it rests against the output bearing to stop any movement in that direct and cut back the output shaft the same as a RE hack and tap so you have a retaining bolt and washer to stop the yoke from coming off in the other direction.

You could also maybe use this 27 spline yoke providing it is setup to accept a double cardon joint using the same bolt up arrangement as the front output shaft yoke. This means you dont need the centering part like you have with the flange style setups as it is part of the first uni joint.

That yoke comes with this description:
Wrangler 27 spline slip yoke eliminator CV style or U-joint style
Yoke only

These slip yoke eliminator Yokes are made custom and fit jeep 207, 242, 231 transfer cases and turbo 350 transmissions (for low rider fixed yokes when using our long slip shafts).

This flange is 27 spline and is installed just like the yoke except that the purpose of a flange is to support the use of a one ton (1350) CV or a Saginaw (GM) CV like from a front of a 77 and up Chevy pick-up or Blazer.

From http://www.gloeco.com/drive_shaft_SYE.htm

Am I missing something that no one I know has done this before that I know of?
I will have to pull the tail cone off and measure the inside diameter to see if it changes from one end to the other but doesn't appear that way from the outside. Unless someone can check that for me that has one off already??

Any input into to this please?

 

[John90XJ]

Marcus,

The yoke in your smaller photo is the same as the slip yoke on the right in your upper photo. It's just a deceiving angle making it look as if it's shorter in overall length. I thought it would be shorter when I bought it but found out it was about the same as a regular slip yoke. That being said, it's very easy to cut to your specific length. I cut it so it maximized spline engagement, butted up against the larger diameter part of the output shaft at the end of the splined shaft section and allowed for the ZJ/XJ front shaft length to be used.

Here you can see the yoke after being cut down. The front output yoke is to the upper right.

Here is the completed job using an RE seal housing, a specific National seal to match the different shaft diameter and a ZJ front driveshaft.

I would be inclined to find a later model speedo housing that incorporates the seal. With that, and the National Seal search engine, you can dial in exactly what seal you would need to fit the bore hole.

http://www.21cgt.com/FMWebCatalog/default.htm

 

[Gojeep]

Thanks mate. I looked at swapping the two housings but there is a difference in the switch for the 4wd light, I think it is, is not tapped to accept one in the later housing. Also I expect there would be a difference in the shaft spline that the newer wont have any where the seal runs where I think mine still does. Do you know if a tail cone could just be cut down and used instead of the RE housing you used? That is not available on it's own either that I have seen so how did you have one?
You wouldn't be able to measure the yoke diameter so I can see if it is different to my 242 shaft and if there is a seal to suit if not?
What did you do to retain it BTW? Just a large washer and drill and tap the end of the shaft and use a bolt? Looks like you welded something into the end of the shaft though?

 

[John90XJ]

The yoke outer shaft diameter is 1.50"....it should be the same as your existing slip yoke. I know a stock 231 yoke is the same.

The RE piece was one Mike had laying about. The question would be whether the later model speedo housing is actually deeper than the one you have.

I'm unaware of anyone cutting down a tailshaft housing. However I just looked at my old one and think you could do this leaving the tailshaft housing in place and still using a CV style shaft. You would have plenty of spline engagement to support the change. The question would be finding an appropriate length shaft.

As for the indicator switch, I no longer have the lights on my dash as the vacuum switch is not plugged into anything. I do it simply by feel now. This changed when I went from a 242 to a different year 231 with a different connector.

 

[XJ_ranger]

im not sure how similar the 231 and 242 output shaft housing is, but have you looked at this?
http://www.4x4getaways.com/oldmansye.htm

Old_Man on here runs that page..

 

[Gojeep]

The yoke outer shaft diameter is 1.50"....it should be the same as your existing slip yoke. I know a stock 231 yoke is the same.

The RE piece was one Mike had laying about. The question would be whether the later model speedo housing is actually deeper than the one you have.

I'm unaware of anyone cutting down a tailshaft housing. However I just looked at my old one and think you could do this leaving the tailshaft housing in place and still using a CV style shaft. You would have plenty of spline engagement to support the change. The question would be finding an appropriate length shaft.

As for the indicator switch, I no longer have the lights on my dash as the vacuum switch is not plugged into anything. I do it simply by feel now. This changed when I went from a 242 to a different year 231 with a different connector.

Thats great John. That is the same size diameter as my 242 shaft. So if the tail cone is the same size all the way through it would mean that even a stock seal can be used. Do you have the seal out of yours and can check the inside size of the tail cone from one end compared to the other?
I am not worried about the shaft length as will get one made up anyway. Even stock front shafts are $150 here second-hand and very hard to find one that does not have play in the slip yoke. Mine has just started to get some as well so will get a new one made up for it as well.

 

[Gojeep]

im not sure how similar the 231 and 242 output shaft housing is, but have you looked at this?
http://www.4x4getaways.com/oldmansye.htm

Old_Man on here runs that page..

Know all about that one thanks as it started on here http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37015 but I dont want a flange.

 

[John90XJ]

Thats great John. That is the same size diameter as my 242 shaft. So if the tail cone is the same size all the way through it would mean that even a stock seal can be used. Do you have the seal out of yours and can check the inside size of the tail cone from one end compared to the other?
I am not worried about the shaft length as will get one made up anyway. Even stock front shafts are $150 here second-hand and very hard to find one that does not have play in the slip yoke. Mine has just started to get some as well so will get a new one made up for it as well.

I've still got that special seal you sent me in the tailcone...I've got it "glued" in place. Before I resort to destroying it let me check the seal dimensions for the replacement.

 

[Gojeep]

I've still got that special seal you sent me in the tailcone...I've got it "glued" in place. Before I resort to destroying it let me check the seal dimensions for the replacement.

Dont take that out as have the same one in right now too. I had forgot about sending that to you.

Just found this 27 spline yoke.

This new G.M .Slip Yoke has 1.172 x 27-spline 1.50 seal diameter. The “C” length is 5.531”. It uses 1310 series U-Joint for late aluminum Power Glides, Muncies, Saginaw (3 & 4-speeds), M-20, M-21, 65-70 M-22, Muncie 4-speed, Borg-Warner T4, T5, T10, T16, T56, GM T200, T350, some T375, 4L60, 4L60E, 200R4, 700R4, ZF 6-speed, BOP, Tremec, HD3-speeds. It is Part #SY1310-3500.

Looks like plenty of choice of picking up a yoke from any of these transmissions. The fact it shows the bolt through U bolts mean you can use the same setup as John has with a front shaft which in my case will have to be lengthened. Not all of those run the U bolt style like the Corvette pictured.
from here on eBay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Corv...33733QQitemZ7949637532QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V

 

[Gojeep]

John, what was that place like to deal with that I linked to above? Bit worried that their web site has not been fixed up in a very long time so dont even know of the prices are still current?

 

[John90XJ]

The site does look a little sketchy but I had no problems. The part arrived in just 2-3 days. Have them send it to me if you want.

And the price was still US$99.

 

[Gojeep]

The site does look a little sketchy but I had no problems. The part arrived in just 2-3 days. Have them send it to me if you want.

And the price was still US$99.

Cool

What did you do to retain the yoke John?

 

[John90XJ]

Cool

What did you do to retain the yoke John?

Drilled and tapped the output shaft.

Welded a thick washer on above the disc that is pressed into place to prevent leakage. We felt it would ultimately be stronger (if the strength was needed), would allow a good shoulder for the bolt to press on and thicken the area as the existing press in disc is relatively thin.

We then drilled it out the same as the output shaft and ran a bolt through it to hold it in place. In my first picture you can see evidence of welding around the yoke.

 

[Gojeep]

Thanks John and thought that was what you did as mentioned in the third post.

 

[John90XJ]

I was re-thinking your idea about cutting down the tailshaft housing and shortening it. I looked at mine again and don't see how you could do it without having problems putting in a seal.

I think you need to see the old style and new style speedo housings side by side to get an idea of the overall depth. I still think the newer style is your answer.

 

[Gojeep]

I was re-thinking your idea about cutting down the tailshaft housing and shortening it. I looked at mine again and don't see how you could do it without having problems putting in a seal.

I think you need to see the old style and new style speedo housings side by side to get an idea of the overall depth. I still think the newer style is your answer.

Any reason John why you think there would be a problem putting the seal back on the end of the shorten tail cone? I haven't had one off so you might be seeing something I dont know about? If it is just a straight tube on the inside it should not make any difference how long or short it is to before?
The newer housing would also require the new output shaft to make sure the seal had some thing to run on that was not splined and also be tapped to accept the 4wd light indicatior switch so not that easy.

 

[John90XJ]

Any reason John why you think there would be a problem putting the seal back on the end of the shorten tail cone? I haven't had one off so you might be seeing something I dont know about? If it is just a straight tube on the inside it should not make any difference how long or short it is to before?
The newer housing would also require the new output shaft to make sure the seal had some thing to run on that was not splined and also be tapped to accept the 4wd light indicatior switch so not that easy.

The interior of the housing is cast in such a way as to add ribs for structure (5 of them) and then deeper on one side for oil to travel to the end past the installed support bearing (the tubular one). f you were to shorten it there would be no place for the seal to sit and there would be a series of holes/gaps around it.

I think (underline think) the newer housing sticks out further than the old style meaning you would have splines to engage. Since it has the bearing and the seal it might just be longer.

As for the other issues, I've learned to live without the indicator lights....they're kind of pointless since the passenger can't see them and they're really the only ones that wouldn't know that you're in 4WD.

 

[Gojeep]

Is this the tail cone off the 242? I take it is as you have the seal in it I sent you. Would you be able to shoot a picture of the inside for me? Trying to see what you mean exactly.

 

[Wayne Sihler]

Just a thought-- would it be possible to use the housing from a 96+ 231,the out put shaft is sealed in the housing.Just like a H&T on the later case only with a bolted on yoke instead of a flange.
Just a thought,
Wayne

 

[bobb]

I'm curious why you need a new yoke? Can't you just cut down the stock slip yoke, and use that, or is it incompatible with a CV? N/M, I just figured out it's incompatible with a CV.