old_man
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Loveland, Colorado
Coal, fueling electric cars for over 100 years. 
Emission-Free Gas for $1.50 Per Gallon
- Thread starter urban yan
- Start date
RichP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Effort, Pa
I'm pretty sure this new fuel does not work, if it did we never would have heard about it. Too many apple carts would be pushed over by something like this.
5-90
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Hammerspace
Oxides of nitrogen (NOx) is a product of high combustion temperatures - which cause the nitrogen in the air to split and combine with the oxygen.
Reduce the temperature of combustion, reduce the production of NOx. This is the idea behind the EGR valve (which craps the intake stream up with carbon,) and behind exhaust port reversion (which eliminates the EGR valve, and keeps exhaust gas out of the intake stream. Moderately better.)
The same result could also be obtained with a water/MeOH fogger - with the beneficial side effect of keeping the combustion chambers relatively - if not totally - free of carbon deposits.
If the new uberfuel combusts at a lower flash temperature than gasoline, it's possible that it has a much lower NOx formation - but how does it make useful power from a lower flash temperature? The flash temperatures are what drives the pressure spike that forces the piston down, to act on the lever arm of the connecting rod, to turn the crankshaft, to make torque - if you've reduced that pressure significantly you have massively reduced potential torque output.
May as well burn wood, then. (Anyone else recall the Stanley Steemer?)
Oil Town XJ
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
I wonder what the highest octane they could get out off it!? I want cheap race gas!!!
Gazogènes! Not uncommon in WWII France as conversions to gasoline-engined cars; it basically allowed them to run in a dual-fuel (wood or gasoline) configuration. There's a video here of a Peugeot 404 running as a gazogène - OK, it's a post-war car, but gives a decent basic overview of how it plumbs in.
And Doble, White, DeDion, Locomobile, et. al. I believe there were also attempts at steam-powered aeroplanes as well, but don't know if any ever actually flew or not.
ChicksDigWagons
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Upper Michigan
The only thing hydrogen is good for fueling is fusion reactors. So until we get that figured out we're spinning our proverbial wheels worried about hydrogen.
Where do these people think all the freaking hydrogen comes from anyway? It's not exactly falling from the sky.
Where do these people think all the freaking hydrogen comes from anyway? It's not exactly falling from the sky.
Ralph
NAXJA Member #149
- Location
- Lubbock, Texas
It's extracted from natural gas. What's wrong with that picture?
- Location
- Rainy side of Washington
usually that it leaves carbon (probably carbon dioxide depending on the extraction method...) behind, and takes just as much (or more) energy to extract than you get out of it by recombining it with other things. But I suspect you already knew that.
RichP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Effort, Pa
Really, Hond came up with a H2 fuel cell powered car in 2007 that was supposed to start delivery in march of 07, dealers even took orders for the car and the home fueling station. Vanished overnite including the web site.
As for H2 powered, cars, motorcycles, trucks, buses, Iceland is at 80% H2 now last I heard.
Want fast, how about http://ieee.ca/millennium/ballard/ballard_info.html,
for the cars try these, http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/news/4219741 , http://www.articlesbase.com/cars-ar...rlds-first-hydrogenpowered-saloon-148610.html
Build every car and truck with electric motor drive train and then offer different removable power packs, one battery, one H2 fuel cell, one gas or diesel generator for long hauls that can be swapped out quickly. Personally I think these battery only or fixed hybrids are a mistake, though one of my co-workers mentioned that his new ford fusion has a 300,000mi warranty on the battery pack.
heyhar
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- PA (near Poconos)
Other than you Rich, how many folks have the patience to go 300k in a single vehicle! I wonder if the biggest problem is how they're going to tax your driving with a fuel or energy purchased at residential cost per kw. With gasoline or diesel, the more you drive, the more taxed fuel you buy. But, the powers that regulate don't know if the kw flowing from that recepticle in the garage is feeding your Volt or an industrial-sized Beer Meister. And, don't forget that often law enforcement agencies have used electric consumption to find Cannibus cultivators using ultraviolet grow lights.
RichP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Effort, Pa
Did not look at the tax angle but that's another valid one for killing self sufficient fuel vehicles. Vehicles that the owner can manufacture their own fuel, either though solar, wind to charge a volt or a surplus electrolytic O2 generator that just happens to produce Hydrogen as a byproduct that submarines have been using for over 60 years.
pbones66
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- haslet texas
E-85 you will get 25% less fuel eco. at 25% more emmissions all at a higher price at the pump.
heyhar
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- PA (near Poconos)
How many times did we see, when all of the bio-diesel/cooking oil/fried-chicken home-brew stuff started, that instead of officials being happy about industrious individuals doing for themselves, a man in his seventies was jailed for tax evasion. But, there was no mechanism in place for an individual to pay fuel tax on his own. Way to applaud the enteprenorial spirit!!
heyhar
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- PA (near Poconos)
How many times did we see, when all of the bio-diesel/cooking oil/fried-chicken home-brew stuff started, that instead of officials being happy about industrious individuals doing for themselves, a man in his seventies was jailed for tax evasion. But, there was no mechanism in place for an individual to pay fuel tax on his own. Way to applaud the entrepreneurial spirit!!
srmitchell
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Mckinleyville (Humboldt) CA
I'm still baffled as to why we use ethanol. Maybe just because it's highly subsidized?
The EROI (energy return on investment) is pretty much 1:1, so any gas we're saving, is actually absorbed by the diesel used in the tractors, and equipment in the production of the corn. (or other bio-refuse)
And the fact that we get less mpg, wouldn't that mean more CO2 emissions, thus negating any benefit of using less gasoline?
The EROI (energy return on investment) is pretty much 1:1, so any gas we're saving, is actually absorbed by the diesel used in the tractors, and equipment in the production of the corn. (or other bio-refuse)
And the fact that we get less mpg, wouldn't that mean more CO2 emissions, thus negating any benefit of using less gasoline?
- Location
- Indiana-Missouri
Hey knock it off with all that linear logic buddy, you dont want to confuse liberals, do you?
tbburg
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Scottsdale AZ
I'm baffled as to why you're still baffled.
- Location
- Rainy side of Washington
Where do you propose getting hydrogen without using as much energy to free it as you get back when you use it?
Hydrogen as currently viewed is an energy transport, and a dangerous difficult to store one at that. It saves no emissions.
Hydrogen as currently viewed is an energy transport, and a dangerous difficult to store one at that. It saves no emissions.
