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BS or not?

Rev Den

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Plainfield, IL
Re: BS or not>

eu do a l know $hat the .96 Flob in th$$'burbs was caused by the Clinton administrations continued cloud sdedib operaD`onr ru thru tH` CHA t increse the peB`eptionphat the public NEEDS the goverment to take care of them. I have 1st had persohal kno`edfe o thdse @CTS, so anyone who sayp that this is not true is lying. I would post these facts, but that wo`d dxpod md to`xtreme`ibdral that a"` out to get meŽ
:D

Rev
 
Gotta ask youself the question, how much do you trust the govt ? Me, not as far as I could throw a good sized refrigerator, seen em do too many things that turned my stomach. Would they admit it if say a silkworm hit it, I think not. The pentagon hit got alot of coverage but not nearly as much as the towers and the one that crashed in Pa. Yea, there was alot of coverage on post operations but not alot of pre impact information that I can remember and if the seized and missing films are true then that makes me even more uneasy.
This country now is alot different from one I grew up in during the 50's and 60's. Govt has their nose in alot of things they would not have dared to getinto back then as we head towards a more controlled society. My question is, just how much would they allow to happen thru non-action if it forwarded this trend of control. Could you even imagine trying to setup a homeland security dept and pass the patriot act in even 1980 or 1990 ? Just my .02
 
saw that about a year ago on another forum im on and it stirred up A LOT emotions...

from that forum it was almost a 50/50 split on who believed it... oddly enough was similar to election results, lol....
 
RichP said:
Could you even imagine trying to setup a homeland security dept and pass the patriot act in even 1980 or 1990 ?
Under Reagan I think it would have had a considerable chance of success because most people loved and supported him.

That is a wicked video... certainly makes you think.
 
Never did like our government much. They do way to many suspicious things in my opinion. That video really makes you think.

Kim.
 
Ok,

So what happened to these people?

CREW



Charles Burlingame of Herndon, Virginia, was the plane's captain. He is survived by a wife, a daughter and a grandson. He had more than 20 years of experience flying with American Airlines and was a former U.S. Navy pilot.

David Charlebois, who lived in Washington's Dupont Circle neighborhood, was the first officer on the flight. "He was handsome and happy and very centered," his neighbor Travis White, told The Washington Post. "His life was the kind of life I wanted to have some day."

Michele Heidenberger of Chevy Chase, Maryland, was a flight attendant for 30 years. She left behind a husband, a pilot, and a daughter and son.

Flight attendant Jennifer Lewis, 38, of Culpeper, Virginia, was the wife of flight attendant Kenneth Lewis.

Flight attendant Kenneth Lewis, 49, of Culpeper, Virginia, was the husband of flight attendant Jennifer Lewis.

Renee May, 39, of Baltimore, Maryland, was a flight attendant.






PASSENGERS



Paul Ambrose, 32, of Washington, was a physician who worked with the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services and the surgeon general to address racial and ethnic disparities in health. A 1995 graduate of Marshall University School of Medicine, Ambrose last year was named the Luther Terry Fellow of the Association of Teachers of Preventative Medicine.

Yeneneh Betru, 35, was from Burbank, California.

M.J. Booth

Bernard Brown, 11, was a student at Leckie Elementary School in Washington. He was embarking on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

Suzanne Calley, 42, of San Martin, California, was an employee of Cisco Systems Inc.

William Caswell

Sarah Clark, 65, of Columbia, Maryland, was a sixth-grade teacher at Backus Middle School in Washington. She was accompanying a student on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

Asia Cottom, 11, was a student at Backus Middle School in Washington. Asia was embarking on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

James Debeuneure, 58, of Upper Marlboro, Maryland, was a fifth-grade teacher at Ketcham Elementary School in Washington. He was accompanying a student on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

Rodney Dickens, 11, was a student at Leckie Elementary School in Washington. He was embarking on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

Eddie Dillard

Charles Droz

Barbara Edwards, 58, of Las Vegas, Nevada, was a teacher at Palo Verde High School in Las Vegas.

Charles S. Falkenberg, 45, of University Park, Maryland, was the director of research at ECOlogic Corp., a software engineering firm. He worked on data systems for NASA and also developed data systems for the study of global and regional environmental issues. Falkenburg was traveling with his wife, Leslie Whittingham, and their two daughters, Zoe, 8, and Dana, 3.

Zoe Falkenberg, 8, of University Park, Maryland, was the daughter of Charles Falkenberg and Leslie Whittingham.

Dana Falkenberg, 3, of University Park, Maryland, was the daughter of Charles Falkenberg and Leslie Whittingham.

Joe Ferguson was the director of the National Geographic Society's geography education outreach program in Washington. He was accompanying a group of students and teachers on an educational trip to the Channel Islands in California. A Mississippi native, he joined the society in 1987. "Joe Feguson's final hours at the Geographic reveal the depth of his commitment to one of the things he really loved," said John Fahey Jr., the society's president. "Joe was here at the office until late Monday evening preparing for this trip. It was his goal to make this trip perfect in every way."

Wilson "Bud" Flagg of Millwood, Virginia, was a retired Navy admiral and retired American Airlines pilot.

Dee Flagg

Richard Gabriel

Ian Gray, 55, of Washington was the president of a health-care consulting firm.

Stanley Hall, 68, was from Rancho Palos Verdes, California.

Bryan Jack, 48, of Alexandria, Virginia, was a senior executive at the Defense Department.

Steven D. "Jake" Jacoby, 43, of Alexandria, Virginia, was the chief operating officer of Metrocall Inc., a wireless data and messaging company.

Ann Judge, 49, of Virginia was the travel office manager for the National Geographic Society. She was accompanying a group of students and teachers on an educational trip to the Channel Islands in California. Society President John Fahey Jr. said one of his fondest memories of Judge is a voice mail she and a colleague once left him while they were rafting the Monkey River in Belize. "This was quintessential Ann -- living life to the fullest and wanting to share it with others," he said.

Chandler Keller, 29, was a Boeing propulsion engineer from El Segundo, California.

Yvonne Kennedy

Norma Khan, 45, from Reston, Virginia was a nonprofit organization manager.

Karen A. Kincaid, 40, was a lawyer with the Washington firm of Wiley Rein & Fielding. She joined the firm in 1993 and was part of the its telecommunications practice. She was married to Peter Batacan.

Norma Langsteuerle

Dong Lee

Dora Menchaca, 45, of Santa Monica, California, was the associate director of clinical research for a biotech firm.

Christopher Newton, 38, of Anaheim, California, was president and chief executive officer of Work-Life Benefits, a consultation and referral service. He was married and had two children. Newton was on his way back to Orange County to retrieve his family's yellow Labrador, who had been left behind until they could settle into their new home in Arlington, Virginia.

Barbara Olson, 45, was a conservative commentator who often appeared on CNN and was married to U.S. Solicitor General Theodore Olson. She twice called her husband as the plane was being hijacked and described some details, including that the attackers were armed with knives. She had planned to take a different flight, but she changed it at the last minute so that she could be with her husband on his birthday. She worked as an investigator for the House Government Reform Committee in the mid-1990s and later worked on the staff of Senate Minority Whip Don Nickles.

Ruben Ornedo, 39, of Los Angeles, California, was a Boeing propulsion engineer.

Robert Penniger, 63, of Poway, California, was an electrical engineer with BAE Systems.

Lisa Raines, 42, was senior vice president for government relations at the Washington office of Genzyme, a biotechnology firm. She was from Great Falls, Virginia, and was married to Stephen Push. She worked with the U.S. Food and Drug Administration on developing a new policy governing cellular therapies, announced in 1997. She also worked on other major health-care legislation.

Todd Reuben, 40, of Potomac, Maryland, was a tax and business lawyer.

John Sammartino

Diane Simmons

George Simmons

Mari-Rae Sopper of Santa Barbara, California, was a women's gymnastics coach at the University of California at Santa Barbara. She had just gotten the post August 31 and was making the trip to California to start work.

Bob Speisman, 47, was from Irvington, New York.

Hilda Taylor was a sixth-grade teacher at Leckie Elementary School in Washington. She was accompanying a student on an educational trip to the Channel Islands National Marine Sanctuary near Santa Barbara, California, as part of a program funded by the National Geographic Society.

Leonard Taylor was from Reston, Virginia.

Leslie A. Whittington, 45, was from University Park, Maryland. The professor of public policy at Georgetown University in Washington was traveling with her husband, Charles Falkenberg, 45, and their two daughters, Zoe, 8, and Dana, 3. They were traveling to Los Angeles to catch a connection to Australia. Whittington had been named a visiting fellow at Australian National University in Canberra.

John Yamnicky, 71, was from Waldorf, Maryland.

Vicki Yancey

Shuyin Yang

Yuguag Zheng


I know, someones gonna tell me the plane actually crashed somewhere nearby and "whomever" hid it.

Yikes!

--ron
 
kinda scary when you start to think about it, but it all comes down to misinformation..(imho)...the video left out the or failed to justify what ron brought up...where are the passengers..if that plane didn't crash are we hiding them somewhere or what...? questions questions questions.....?
Maier
 
I think I'm gonna get some pop-corn and a $14 soda, sit back and watch the thread fow a while.
 
looking at that video damn near changes my mind about 9/11. but my better judgement holds me in place. i still think weve been told the truth more or less. but those pictures of the pentagon with the hole 10 ft in diameter after going through 3 layers of concrete walls........no airplane would still be intact that deep, where are the pieces?, where is the plane in that video?, im not convinced it WAS a plane that hit. perhaps they landed the plane in the middle of the ocean and took a missile to the pentagon to make us think thats what happened. but why?
 
It makes you think. Was the info in this video real? Or was it a Michael Moore-style editing job? I don't know, but Ron brings up a good point about the passengers.
 
What happened to the wings, the tail, the entire plane?

What happened to the fuel?

The fuel (and the pentagon) happened to the wings, the tail, the entire plane. The crash photos shown are the unusual ones. High speed aircraft impacts usually leave a burnt smear of aircraft and occupants. Consider the recent AF flight that had a relatively "soft" impact, then ripped in half and caught fire.

Not enough damage? Looks like enough to me. It is the freakin' PENTAGON, not your apartment building, after all. One just might believe it just might be built stronger than average.

Eyewitness accounts regarding aircraft size and type? Please. The general public can't tell an A380 from a Cessna 152. Jets and Props are the only discernment generally made. Every prop is a Cessna, every bizjet is a Lear, and every airliner is a Boeing, right?
I work for an airline, and I first saw the news while getting dressed to go to my flight school that day. Ignorant crap like that video shows intolerable disrespect for the lives lost that day and makes me want to vomit.

No offense to you, Lawn Cher...it was a dramatic, if ignorantly made video.
 
If there were two holes parallel to each other it would easily be explainable. The engines have enough force (and mass most importantly) behind them to make a clean 10 foot hole through many layers of reinforced concrete. In the WTC pics the planes made suprisingly clean cuts into the building and you can clearly see the engines zip out the opposite side where as the plane remained inside the building.

However, I would still expect to see the frame and tail of the plane. The tail section of planes have an uncanny ability to stay intact in most cases.

Perhaps when the E ring collapsed it covered up the wreckage in the rubble. Where are the plane wreckages from the WTC? same deal.
 
All the people claiming it was a missile based on noise were great. Jets can make some big differences in noise. C5s sound downright sickly. Listening to them orbit overhead in Kandahar, I thought they were all gonna fall outta the sky...
 
IIRC there was some debris from the aircraft found that day. Engine turbine blades, tires etc... I think it's just a slick job of editing. NO ONE brings this stuff up when it happens, ONLY well after, when details and things are no longer fresh in your mind.
 
Damn...

That's some f'd up stuff!

Spooky...

Altho not as spooky as this one videotape I heard about...

it was filmed by some college kids doing a research project...

































IIRC... it was called the Blair Witch Project

btw... Lawn Chair has now been added to a secret government list for posting that link...

Avoid ANY contact with him or suffer the same fate!





:D
 
This is no different that the OKC bombing.
Every one wants to cry "conspericy" or how ever you spell it.
With the OKC bombing there were hundreds of theroies,
I sat and watched the live news feeds the morning it happened,
I heard the OKC fire chief say they found two more unexploded bombe in the basement, I saw the pictures of the people running away from the area.
I saw a fire engine sitting on the spot that the "huge crater" was s'posed to be.
I went down to OKC for the memorial of the first aniversary , I saw the building across the street 99% intact.
How could a truck sitting out side the building only "blow" one way?

What really happened in Dallas with Kennedy?
This country thrives on conpsericy, alway has, always will.
That is part of life in a free scocity, freedom of the press, to print the truth, to print a lie, to print what they are told, or to print what ever sound good and gets ratings!

Welcome to america!
The best place on earth, regardless of what goes on here!
 
This video has been around (in some form) for a few years (and it improves with added editing).

The producers of the theory are not too experienced with airplanes at high speed or crashes (IMO).

In the desert growing up we used to encounter many plane crash sites (came with the EAFB territory). There is not much left of a plane after a crash and fire on open ground, and I expect to find much less in a structure crash. The photos of large remaining plane structures is not typical unless fire retardant is applied immediately (like at an airport with immediate response). Aluminum burns, magnesium burns brighter/warmer yet, and plastics and composites leave even fewer residues. If you know what happens with many of these materials under high temperatures you will have a good idea of the heat released and the possibility of anything to survive (slim).

How many of you have been close to a jet aircraft traveling well over 400 mph and been spooked (within a few hundred feet, not knowing it was there, until ... whoosh-boom)? The folks with Carrier experience can relate to it, with a big old F-14 (maybe), but with an airframe as large as a commercial carrier it's hard to explain. When I was spooked by a B1 at 200 feet AGL it was near impossible to identify, until the pilot made a second pass (and a fighter jet is silent until after ... folding the brush and me down with the sonic boom). Thinking the airframe was shorter is a typical reaction to processing something traveling that fast (the brain cannot ID the big picture and relates it to what is more familiar).

Where did the people go (where are they, etc.), including the suspected terrorists?

The video is slick, but under-qualified with facts and experience. Why can a Goggle search NOT find mainstream media reports verifying the quotes and information within published news articles? The questions about the release of the video images from the surrounding business cameras are valid, until you realize the release will not help anyone except a future terrorist. Bush has nothing to gain (the doubters will still have doubts), the anti-Bush people will gain nothing (it will not change minds), and if anything new is revealed to the public would it be valued more than the propaganda damage when the footage is aired on Al Jazzara? Will more fuzzy photos resolve anything to everyone's satisfaction?

This gets to the point of the big picture, what is achieved by making people doubt the obvious (the plane with the published passenger manifest crashed into the Pentagon)? What is the goal of this well funded (and slick) conspiracy theory?

With the 911 Trade Center Tower radio data release, what is left to doubt, and where is the FOIA for the videos "taken" by the FBI? We are expected to believe the Soros anti-Bush team can make slick videos but cannot file for a FOIA (and get the media to claim any foot dragging by the government is obstructionist political posturing)?

PT Barnham had a saying ... (are you next?)
 
btw...

Not that any of you care...

but the JFK assasination...

Now THAT reeks of hidden agendas and backdoor agreements and coverups.

Tinfoil hat for me please!
 
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