Best trailering tie down point

[OT]

I coulda posted this in other tech, I know, but I actually wanted people to see this post. So you drive-by moderators can kiss my toe.

Anyway.......
I prefer to tie down my rig using front and rear bumper D-ring points. I figure this cinches the body down a couple inches and prevents body roll on cornering. But I also know some people strap down the axles.

Which method do you guys prefer? Which way do y'all think is safest?

 

[Beezil]

Just had this discussio at winterfest....

seems the popular answer was Two straps to secure the "body" of the jeep (use suitable tow points) and two straps criss-crossed to secure the axle of the jeep. (triangulation strikes again)

thats a little different to what i was doing, but I changed my style since the gang thinks differently....

 

[4ward]

I chain the back axle so I know it won't drive over me in a bad wreck. Tie downs are hooked to the front bumper to cinch the body down and keep it from flopping side to side in the wind/ruts/etc.

B, did you notice any difference? I know it wasn't a windy drive home, but did you notice anything changing lanes?

 

[Beezil]

I chain the back axle so I know it won't drive over me in a bad wreck. Tie downs are hooked to the front bumper to cinch the body down and keep it from flopping side to side in the wind/ruts/etc.

B, did you notice any difference? I know it wasn't a windy drive home, but did you notice anything changing lanes?

no, i had a nice light wind at the back, and its hard to feel the trailer at all with a dual cam anti sway/ WD hitch plus airbags.......that's not to say the effect isn't there, just can't be felt......I trust what the rest of you were saying, and scott macs story didn't sound like much fun, or else i wouldn't have changed my tie down locations.....

 

[Ghost]

Being in the transportation industry this is widely misunder stood and not properly done. All of them are not the "correct" way to do it. I tried to find it on the net but was unable to so far. The way we (trucking and towing companys) are suppse to tie a vehical down is to the DOT required frame tow point. Every vehical is required to have them front and back IMSC. They are usually oval shaped holes in the frame. Some of the newer cars actually have little hoops on them. I have seen them on a lot of the newer inports. the Hummers we haul are tied to the D rings front and rear. The straps, or chains and binders, are then supose to be crossed to the opposit side of the trailer like an X front and rear. There is supose to be enough tension on the suspension to keep it from bouncing. HTH.

 

[Grant]

I know all vehicles come with tie downs on the frame, but in many cases these are useless to the average guy unless he has the J-hooks the truckers use. And I have no problem with cinching a stock vehicle down a few inches on a trailer.

However I do have a problem doing that on any high travel suspension. I think most people will fail to compress the suspension sufficiently to prevent the shock loading of the tie-downs that will occur over every bump. Extremely fatigueing (sp?) for your straps and binders.

My trailering long distance includes
Jeep - Chain over rear axle to both sides of trailer then tension by driving foward. No binder to fail. Chain and binder on front axle. Backup 30K lb straps over each axle. Have towed with body cinched - tree saver and winch in front, straps through rear receiver. Have also towed with body free. Shocks turned to stiffest setting is best.

Mini and Subie - Tie down straps through the wheels. Two straps front and rear. Car in gear, e-brake on. Subie center diff locked. Bodies not strapped down.

Indy cars in 18 wheeler. - Tie down straps over each wheel to D-rings in trailer floor. In order to preserve our setups, and not have the car suspension cycle over every bump, we had an inflatable bladder that sat under the chassis and cushioned the race car.

 

[ChiXJeff]

Grant probably has more experience trailering than the rest of us put together. I've been wondering for quite a while about how far to compress a long travel suspension, he's nailed my concerns pretty square.

I certainly would NOT tie down a trail rig to the axles only. That allows too much sway on everthing the suspension holds up. I have tied my 94 XJ on a gooseneck trailer for 400 miles by the front shackles, and rear hitch, using 10,000# nylon load straps. It was a little fun getting the suspension compressed down far enough, but the XJ did not wobble on the trailer at all. The straps didn't loosen up over the trip either.

I have tied a stock vehicle down by just the axles, and that seemed to work okay for a couple of hundred miles. Not my first choice, though.

If you do tie down to the front tow points, make sure to check the bolts occasionally.

 

[Beezil]

However I do have a problem doing that on any high travel suspension. I think most people will fail to compress the suspension sufficiently to prevent the shock loading of the tie-downs that will occur over every bump. Extremely fatigueing (sp?) for your straps and binders.

grant, we got into a mini-debate about this this past weekend....

One ton, this is the rationale I've always heard about and was explaining to you....

however, i did notice on the way home that the jeep was not bouncing against the straps like I imagined. I guess the front was sufficiently compressed.

 

[4ward]

I've tried it every way imaginable and this seems to me to be the best. Getting my front to compress enough hasn't been an issue. We do the straps through the wheels on the race car though cuz it doesn't sway about like my obscenely tall jeep does.

 

[Grant]

The only way I have found to compress my junk, has been to use the winch up front. I am somewhat concerned about the shock loading of sometimes many hundreds of miles on the winch itself. So a chicken shit compromise is to use a tree saver to provide a little give.

On a trip to the Rubicon a few years ago, I had the usual axle tie downs in place, and then a strap over the roof rack cinched down. Compressed as much as I could ratchet. The roads in UT were lousy and somewhere on I-80 the jeep compressed enough to throw one of the hooks at the end of the strap. No place to pull over, jersey barriers both sides, construction everywhere. Kinda nervous dragging that strap for a few miles until it fell off completely.

Since then I have towed the Jeep with both the body cinched as well as the body free. Personally I do not find much difference. It actually seems to tow better with the body free and the Rancho's turned full stiff. trailer has no shocks.

I bought a whole lot of D-rings and was going to weld them to the trailer, and then use the rotating ratchet binders to attach the frame of the XJ to the trailer. Have never gotten around to doing it though.

Even the magazines seem to disagree on the "best" method. I just think long travel suspensions do not behave the same as stock vehicles and perhaps should be treated a little differently.

Is there a fatigue element if you travel a long distance with suspension under compression? Is that not excessive stress for coil-overs?

For some long distance travel with the race cars, like CO- FL for winter testing we would remove the coilovers, and replace them with solid steel rod, creating a solid suspension system. But of course we would then have to do the corner weight setup again once we arrived. Basically we were trying to avoid excessive shock wear.

I have found it useful to tie the XJ down, get everything tight, and then fill the tires to 30psi, really gets things tight.

 

[GSequoia]

Excuse me for any SPOBI here...but this is somethign I've been thinking of here and there for the day when I turn into a trailer queen...

About the suspension, Grant, you spoke about air bags. What about fabbing some sort of bracing to keep the suspension still. I've thought of steel bracing (I haven't thought this out...just thought of it, I come up with a lot of left field ideas while I'm commuting ) going from the trailer to some place on the Jeep (obviously you'd have to design these brace points in when setting the Jeep up, gots to make it easy).

I haven't quite gotten as far as thinking how much to compress the suspension, or what avenue I'd go to compress it (comealong perhaps...?). But the basic idea was compress the suspension, attach the brackets to the trailer and the Jeep (come up with some way to make it easy but secure), and then secure the wheels (I like those ratcheting wheel hold-downs that Iv'e seen the race boys use...I just don't knwo if they make them big enough for the likes of us!) and put a saftey catch or two (such as Sean's axle chain.

Anyway...again, this might be all :bs:...

Sequoia

 

[Grant]

Sequoia,
The airbag system for the Indy cars was about $2.5K each, so not something feasible for an XJ.

also on the race cars we are talking about total suspension movement in the range of 1.5 - 2 inches, not the massive movement monster XJ's have.

i wonder how the stadium truck and desert racers strap their junk down?

 

[Scott Mac]

My trailers tie downs location prevent me for tieing the frontend of the body down safely. I'd be pulling straight down on my front tow hooks. I may have to weld some D-rings to the front of the trailer, although I do have a set of adjustable shocks sitting in the garage waiting to go on. I will not tow again with the swaybar disconnected again until I can tie the body down safely.

 

[OT]

Just had this discussio at winterfest....

seems the popular answer was Two straps to secure the "body" of the jeep (use suitable tow points) and two straps criss-crossed to secure the axle of the jeep. (triangulation strikes again)

thats a little different to what i was doing, but I changed my style since the gang thinks differently....

Can you or anyone else show a picture of what you mean. I guess I can't picture it in my head. :dunce:

I have a concern that if I cinch the body down too tightly for too long a period over bumpy interstates that it'll prematurely sag the springs.

 

[woody]

Seems like we secured our wheeled vehicles for railroad flatcar transport was with eight (ratcheting) chain binders. The trucks had 2 'D-rings' on each bumper. On each, a pair of chains was crossed at 90* to just inboard of the wheels and a chain went from each D-ring forward & down at more than 45* IIRC. (did that make sense?)

This is pretty similar to what Ghost outlined... could be duplicated with straps vs chains...though I sort of like the idea of a strong chain wrapped around an axle as insurance.

Another way help snug up to tighten the rig with trail-pressure in the tires, and then air up.

 

[Lincoln]

I would like to here Scott's story. Maybe something I should be thinking about.

My Jeeps been trailered quite a bit and I've alway's tied everything (2T trucks, tractors, and Jeeps) the same way. Moab was my first trip with ratchet straps and I alway's forget the X method. I'll strap (or chain) the front axle, back it up for tension, cench the rear axle down tight, then pop it back in neutral to balance the tension. I'll then drive it about 10 miles and check the tension on all of the straps and chains. I've towed mine at 4" with and without sway bars, but I have alway's kept the sway bars on since going more.

Granted most of my towing has been behind motorhomes and they usually handle corners worse than my XJ and the other crap doesn't have or has really stiff suspension.

I did get a little pucker coming through Price Canyon on the way back from Moab. Pickup leaned hard. I nailed the gas then looked up in the mirror at the Jeep. I couldn't see any lean and didn't feel any pull of the trailer. Even though only part of the front bumper could be seen, I knew there was a reason for leaving the curtains up. Testing purposes.

 

[Scott Mac]

I would like to here Scott's story. Maybe something I should be thinking about.

I was 4 hours into the trip heading down I-69 near the Mi/In border at approx 65 mph (posted limit is 70) In decent rain and a 20/30 mph west crosswind at 10:00 at night. I was passing a semi on the left when the trailer caught a gust of wind and started swaying. (the trailer was yet to be protected by the wind next to the semi) The trailer caught the shoulder and pulled the tow vehicle with it, I looked in the mirror and saw the Jeep swaying 10 degrees both ways. I powered out of it with white knuckles half on the shoulder till I was past the semi. Teal V6 called on the CB to ask how I was doing and my voice cracked when I answered back. Later after we stoped Steve (Teal V6) said the trailer swayed within a few feet of the semi while I was a quarter to half on the shoulder.

When I told the story at camp that night, Beezil asked me why I didn't use the trailer brakes to stop the trailer from swaying. I told him that Steve was right behind me and I didn't think that the brake lights came on when I used the brake switch on the brake controller. In truth I don't think anybody could have pry-ed my white knuckles off of the steering wheel with a crowbar to even reach for the brake controller.

 

[Lincoln]

I've had a few of those. Time to shampoo the seats. A lot more scary on slick roads when that happens. I've alway's had better luck powering (if it's there) out instead of the trailer brakes.

That's also why I strongly recomend sway control (not equilizers) on any trailer. Those little $80 jobbies do a great job. Even a properly loaded trailer can get out of hand in cross winds and passing trucks. Add some 6-8" ruts in the roads and you have Idaho. There the type of thing that only the people that never ran them tell you they're not needed.

Thanks for the story. I like making mental notes just to remind me I'm not driving a Mazda.

 

[Scott Mac]

I've had a few of those. Time to shampoo the seats. A lot more scary on slick roads when that happens. I've alway's had better luck powering (if it's there) out instead of the trailer brakes.

That's also why I strongly recomend sway control (not equilizers) on any trailer. Those little $80 jobbies do a great job. Even a properly loaded trailer can get out of hand in cross winds and passing trucks. Add some 6-8" ruts in the roads and you have Idaho. There the type of thing that only the people that never ran them tell you they're not needed.

Thanks for the story. I like making mental notes just to remind me I'm not driving a Mazda.

I was running sway control, and the Jeep was loaded evenly. I'm thankfull that the 4.7 in the WJ and enough power left over to save my @ss. My wife would have killed me if I rolled her Jeep.

Like I said previously I will not trailer my rig again with the swaybars disconected untill I can safely secure the body.

 

[Lincoln]

I was running sway control, and the Jeep was loaded evenly. I'm thankfull that the 4.7 in the WJ and enough power left over to save my @ss. My wife would have killed me if I rolled her Jeep.

Like I said previously I will not trailer my rig again with the swaybars disconected untill I can safely secure the body.

I won't argue with either. I ran about four years without swaybars on my Jeep so it got trailed quite a bit. When I added the coils in back and went higher I've never towed without it (back one never went back on).

Why hasn't anyone mentioned simple limiting straps? A lot of the lean usually comes from the unloading of the spring so wouldn't they stop the unloading. There would still be the compression causing lean but I think that would stop a majority of it.