44/9 strength vs. tire size

CAJJ93XJ said:
no because I'm not actually ready to do any swapping or order gears. just doing a little recon. also all the information is listed on his pirate pages. will he be able to tell me if a cryo'd j54 is stronger than cryo'd 44 gears? yes of course. will he be able to tell me if I should settle for 44 gears and be "ok" running them in my specific application? probably not
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I guarantee you he would be willing to offer you a lot more insight than just that. just call and say "i'm considering your jana 54 system, tell me why I should bother with this instead of a 60."

plenty of people run d44's passed their limits. and the one I'm considering will be much more built than some of the 44's out there. I KNOW it will hold up. still the question is j54 worth it
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hold up to what? you've posted 3 different tire sizes... we all know you want to run the bigger ones, stop lying to us. I don't know why you are so against tons, the clearance difference between a 60 and a 44 is barely an inch. the weight difference will be minimal in the grand scheme of things.


oh and just a word to the wise, you will never get the kind of money out of that thing, trying to re-sell it, that you put into it. mostly because everyone knows a 60 is stronger and cheaper.


Vanimal said:
it will not be worth it because you can build a dana 60 for half the price.
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listen to this guy^ he knows.


your idea of a 9" rear is a good one. those are good axles that can hold up really well to big tires. don't **** it up with a d44.
 
rockclimber said:
I guarantee you he would be willing to offer you a lot more insight than just that. just call and say "i'm considering your jana 54 system, tell me why I should bother with this instead of a 60."
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I will give him a call when I'm serious about the swap
 
rockclimber said:
they aren't very common.... and still not as strong as a 60.
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yep. because the only axle worth building is a 60. got it.

not everyone needs 1 tons. yes I know the huge argument is that if you're going to spend 3k on an axle it's only WORTH it if it's a 60. I'm sick of hearing you guys tell me what's "worth" spending my money on or not. realistically I'll end up on 37" tires and not much bigger. I fully understand that a 60 is hugely stronger and a wiser investment. I know that many people run 44's for years and eventually graduate to 60's saying they should have gone d60 in the first place. if I start breaking shit I'll come back here and admit I was wrong for trying like many people before me

A built cryo'd dana 44 with RCV's will hold up against 37" tires all day long with a light foot no questions asked.

^^does anyone dispute that statement? not whether you think it's worth my time and money to do that. only answer if you or someone you know has broken an RCV AXLE or a RING AND PINION. I'm glad you guys care so much about me and my time and money but jesus let it go. it's not like I can't always build a 60 later on
 
you asked us for our suggestions so it doesnt make a ton of sense that you are sick of reading the suggestions that you asked for Jake. Next time if you dont want feedback , dont ask for it then. People are trying to help you since you openly posted a thread and asked for feedback about building something stronger than a 30/8.8 setup-specifically a 44/9 setup .

FYI d44 RCVS (1250$+) cost more than a craigslist ball joint hp60(i see them as low as 600$ here and there) , and stock 35 spline front 60 shafts are huge compared to a 760x joints. you are only lying to yourself if you think that you are going to build a 44/9 combo for "37s" and not end up on 39.5+ tires in like a year on those same axles ...

Allen wheels 40s on his 30. just keep your current axles and save your money for gas.
 
CAJJ93XJ said:
I'm not planning on any axle swap right now. I just had a couple questions about the strength possibilities of this axle setup I was researching

any suggestions or insight? besides tons
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Jon you've got me all wrong man. in my original post I said I don't want to hear about tons. I only wanted to know specifically about the d44 and more specifically a little info about cryo'd RP or jana54. yet people still feel the need to tell me all about dana 60's. I'm not trying to be a dick or ungrateful for info. but you guys are a broken record saying the same things over and over. Robz was the only person here who offered any actual information. I did not know RCV's can break on a tire bigger than 37". and also the guy who suggested I call Jana for all my j54 questions.

I'm not even planning a swap right now. so I'll just let it go. maybe I'll be smart and want a 60 next year
 
I can tell you that youll be way better off with a 44 front over your 30 thats for sure. if you throw some chromos in there and good ball joints you should be plenty strong with a full case locker and good gears. your 8.8 is strong enough I would say, but the 9 will be stronger. Id go grizzly/detroit front and rear, and deep deep gears, like you said before, 5.38s. A J54 would be freaking sweet. If you want to go for it, then Id say do it. itll be a plenty strong setup. Everyone is going to give you crap for not considering a 60 since they all wished they would have done so in the first place and they want to save you all the headaches they had. i should have started building a narrowed front 60 a long time ago... Really we are not telling you "how to spend your money", we are telling you how to "save your money" .
 
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CAJJ93XJ said:
Jon you've got me all wrong man. in my original post I said I don't want to hear about tons. I only wanted to know specifically about the d44 and more specifically a little info about cryo'd RP or jana54. yet people still feel the need to tell me all about dana 60's. I'm not trying to be a dick or ungrateful for info. but you guys are a broken record saying the same things over and over. Robz was the only person here who offered any actual information. I did not know RCV's can break on a tire bigger than 37". and also the guy who suggested I call Jana for all my j54 questions.

I'm not even planning a swap right now. so I'll just let it go. maybe I'll be smart and want a 60 next year
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nobody is telling you about tons. we're telling you that a built dana 44 is not worth it because there are much cheaper, better options. you just dont want to hear it. i know because i was there recently when i built my dana 44 and ripped it out because it kept breaking on 35's. i spent 2-3 times as much on it as it cost me to build my dana 60. the 44 is now up for sale.
i have been saying this since the week after i built my dana 44 and broke a chromoly shaft in the same spot with about the same amount of effort that it took to break the built 30 i had before it. or the 3 ring and pinions that failed in my rear 44.
 
Vanimal said:
nobody is telling you about tons. we're telling you that a built dana 44 is not worth it because there are much cheaper, better options. you just dont want to hear it. i know because i was there recently when i built my dana 44 and ripped it out because it kept breaking on 35's. i spent 2-3 times as much on it as it cost me to build my dana 60. the 44 is now up for sale.
i have been saying this since the week after i built my dana 44 and broke a chromoly shaft in the same spot with about the same amount of effort that it took to break the built 30 i had before it. or the 3 ring and pinions that failed in my rear 44.
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I have already researched multiple 1 ton combos, steering 9", yota axles, waggy's etc. 44/9 still sounds like the most appealing setup for my applications and style. If I'm wrong I'm wrong (and I'm usually wrong). I'm only being so difficult because I said 3 times that I don't want to hear anything another word about a 60 or cost or wasting my time.

things like your breakage is the reason for my wanting RCV's. problem solved right now I'll just be breaking RP's instead lol. isn't that the whole point of this hobby anyway? trial and error, build and rebuild, break and repair, but in the end were all just sitting in our garage busting our knuckles and wasting money. sure it's frustrating but I have no problem admitting I was wrong and building a 60 later. for now, all I wanted was some tech on 44's
 
CAJJ93XJ said:
yep. because the only axle worth building is a 60. got it.

not everyone needs 1 tons. yes I know the huge argument is that if you're going to spend 3k on an axle it's only WORTH it if it's a 60. I'm sick of hearing you guys tell me what's "worth" spending my money on or not. realistically I'll end up on 37" tires and not much bigger. I fully understand that a 60 is hugely stronger and a wiser investment. I know that many people run 44's for years and eventually graduate to 60's saying they should have gone d60 in the first place. if I start breaking shit I'll come back here and admit I was wrong for trying like many people before me

A built cryo'd dana 44 with RCV's will hold up against 37" tires all day long with a light foot no questions asked.

^^does anyone dispute that statement? not whether you think it's worth my time and money to do that. only answer if you or someone you know has broken an RCV AXLE or a RING AND PINION. I'm glad you guys care so much about me and my time and money but jesus let it go. it's not like I can't always build a 60 later on
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In your orginal post you were asking about 40'' Irocs, 38'' MTRs, and now you are asking about 37s.

What size tire are you wanting? Those are very different tire sizes.



My biggest question, besides why do you want such big tires, is why do you hate tons so much? I know not everyone needs a D60 or 14 bolt, but there does not seem to be a valid reason why you will not even consider them.



A fully polished d44 will hold up to 37s, and should have no trouble with a Jana kit and RCVs. I cant speak for a 9'' but I do know they can be built fairly well.

What axles and tires are you on right now? What trails do you run? Do you have other modifications that a 37'' tire requires?






You have to realize, you posted this on the internets. Everyone is going to come in and give you their 2 cents. You asked for it.... so people are giving it.
We arnt trying to force you one way or another, but I would like to think everyone tries to help out their fellow wheeler and avoid the mistakes others have made in the past.
 
Starboard M said:
In your orginal post you were asking about 40'' Irocs, 38'' MTRs, and now you are asking about 37s.

What size tire are you wanting? Those are very different tire sizes.

My biggest question, besides why do you want such big tires, is why do you hate tons so much? I know not everyone needs a D60 or 14 bolt, but there does not seem to be a valid reason why you will not even consider them.

A fully polished d44 will hold up to 37s, and should have no trouble with a Jana kit and RCVs. I cant speak for a 9'' but I do know they can be built fairly well.

What axles and tires are you on right now? What trails do you run? Do you have other modifications that a 37'' tire requires?

You have to realize, you posted this on the internets. Everyone is going to come in and give you their 2 cents. You asked for it.... so people are giving it.
We arnt trying to force you one way or another, but I would like to think everyone tries to help out their fellow wheeler and avoid the mistakes others have made in the past.
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those tire sizes were just wishful thinking I guess. realistically I will end up on a 37. I think 60/14 is a great swap. but the reasons I don't really want it is because I think they're a little to wide, heavy, and if I do get tons I'll want 40's or 42's. then I'll want to trailer it everywhere and where does it end. I don't really have a good reason, I'm just exploring options so I can make an informed decision for myself

right now I'm at 30/88 spicer full circle clips, chromes rear, aussie/detroit 4.56. goes everywhere I tell it to and it works. I've only ran a few actual trails (which is why I said I'm not planning a swap for at least a year, just researching). but rubicon/fordyce are the trails. right now I'm doing stiffeners and a hybrid cage and a new suspension would go in with new axles

haha thanks for the disclaimer. I'll adjust my attitude
 
CAJJ93XJ said:
those tire sizes were just wishful thinking I guess. realistically I will end up on a 37. I think 60/14 is a great swap. but the reasons I don't really want it is because I think they're a little to wide, heavy, and if I do get tons I'll want 40's or 42's. then I'll want to trailer it everywhere and where does it end. I don't really have a good reason, I'm just exploring options so I can make an informed decision for myself

right now I'm at 30/88 spicer full circle clips, chromes rear, aussie/detroit 4.56. goes everywhere I tell it to and it works. I've only ran a few actual trails (which is why I said I'm not planning a swap for at least a year, just researching). but rubicon/fordyce are the trails. right now I'm doing stiffeners and a hybrid cage and a new suspension would go in with new axles

haha thanks for the disclaimer. I'll adjust my attitude
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Id wheel it with your setup for a few more years before Id worry about it. Youll be dine on your setup.
BTW axles can be narrowed and shafts resplined pretty cheap these days, WFO has reasonable prices out here for that, 14 bolts can be shaved, and converted to discs to save weight.
 
Jake I think we are on the same page here. Yeah a 60 is the way to go, but I don't want a 60 either. If Jon, rob, Alan, and others can make their Dana 30s last on 37s or bigger, then I can make a 44 last with 37s. There is more behind my drive for an axle swap than just strength. I can't speak for jake, but I personally want the width, radius arms, locking hubs, bigger ring gear, and deeper gear ratio choices as well. The 44 does that all for me without the weight and price of a 60.

Not everybody needs a 60. I guess jake and I are among the select few that think the same lol
 
blondejoncherokee said:
Id wheel it with your setup for a few more years before Id worry about it. Youll be dine on your setup.
BTW axles can be narrowed and shafts resplined pretty cheap these days, WFO has reasonable prices out here for that, 14 bolts can be shaved, and converted to discs to save weight.
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that's the plan. gonna pick up some 35's and just wheel it for awhile. or I could run hummer wheels. plenty of ways to remedy the negatives that come with tons. like I said, I'm just exploring various options

Jeep450r said:
Jake I think we are on the same page here. Yeah a 60 is the way to go, but I don't want a 60 either. If Jon, rob, Alan, and others can make their Dana 30s last on 37s or bigger, then I can make a 44 last with 37s. There is more behind my drive for an axle swap than just strength. I can't speak for jake, but I personally want the width, radius arms, locking hubs, bigger ring gear, and deeper gear ratio choices as well. The 44 does that all for me without the weight and price of a 60.

Not everybody needs a 60. I guess jake and I are among the select few that think the same lol
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bingo! that and the steering and brakes. to me, it's an axle that is worth putting on crossover steering, isntalling flush link mounts and a 3 link, panhard, hubs would be sweet. so many other things I'm looking for besides strength. for my 30 I have no motivation to work on it or upgrade with WJ knuckles or chromos or anything because fug it it's a 30 it works well enough I'll just leave it alone and keep my short arms and save my money.
 
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What about a 9" front with a HP 3rd member and run the same in the back. In theory, would only need to have 1 spare for either. Or maybe 2 but much simpler to swap than in a standard axle?
 
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