Feeling stuck

[SAMSET]

Cliffs
not sure if i should continue on with school
looking for unbiased advice
Its long, its personal, and im looking for real answers.






So im looking for a little advice here from what I assume would be the most unbiased and most diverse thoughts.

A few years ago I started going to school for a 2 year degree in electrical technology specializing in renewable energy. I do not veiw myself as being some electrical guy, before this class I did very little with wires in general. I chose this path for money. The websites my school showed me made it seem(at least at the time)this job would get me around 65/70k a year. Now, I chose renewable energy for me. That was a choice I made because I love the Earth, Nature, and being out there in life(hence the offroad passion).

Recently, as some of you know, I went to my 1st interview, while still far from having my degree. Since then I have been in a mental funk. Towards the end of that interview it was made obvious in my opinion, that the offer they give me would be significantly lower than my current pay should they decide they wanted me. Afterwards I asked several people about their jobs that are similar to what im going to school for and come to find out, they to do not make that much more than me.

So last night I hop online and do some research. I find out that the average for an electrical tech is 35/45kyr. A little more searching and I find that the average for a parts guy is 35/40kyr. So now im stuck. Im about half way done with my degree and the classes are getting more difficult. Not to mention half way done means about 2 more years, at which point I will graduate at 32yrs old with a 2 year degree, that took me 5 years to get. Then, it is out into the world, where I will start the search for a job that may pay less than I currently make with higher risk and more mandatory overtime away from my family.

Im asking you guys because any teacher or consoler I ask is going to say stay in school and better yourself. Those that are close to me are going to say stop wasting money and time for nothing, if they even have an answer because non of my friends are collage grads. My wife just wants to give me the answer im looking for but I truly am lost, I don't want to be told to stop or to continue.

A couple notes to add.
*In high school I managed to be in the lower GPA of my graduating class. I was mostly a C and D student. At my current school, the lowest passing grade is a 73%C. 72 and lower, you failed that class. I have not failed yet but have struggled to keep up.
*I chose this to be out there in the world. As the classes keep ticking on, I feel the only place I will actually end up is a factory job.
*I made about 37k last year and feel that if my searching is correct im already at the top of my pay in the parts world. But also not far from the top in the electrical world.




Thanks for reading

 

[XJ&CHZ4ME]

Sam,

First and foremsot, I respect that you came here to your mixed brothern to ask about this. And as you know, you will get varied levels of answers. I will throw some misc thoughts out there and you can take away from it as you see fit. So, fill your coffe cup and settle in for the read......

I too was a less than stellar HS student...I actually dropped out at one point and had to take summer school and night school to just get enough credits to graduate. I did not even think about college (except for college girls!) for a few years after I got out of HS. When I finally did decide to go to college, it was a rather scenic tour...it was shy of 7 years to get a 4 year degree. BUT, when I was finally into it and really found an interest in agriculture, I was able to graduate with a 3.0, not bad for a do nothing flunkie (and the first in my family history to ever graduate college too). I had various jobs leading up to that point and they paid very well at times (prevailing wage on construction was $28/hr back then). It was brought to my attention by an older coworker that what we were doing was simply a job, not a career. When I pondered that, he was absolutly right. As a young know it all, I never thought about retirement or anything beyond the forseeable future. When you take that moment and realize that what you are doing is just a job and there is not any advancement after a certain point, in your case, the near future per your last years salary, you really need to think about what the future holds for you and your family. Now also keep in mind, if you are truely happy doing what your are doing and do not aspire to go beyond that, that is totally fine as well, but make sure you are making the precautions for your future as well as a future that does not inhibit or hinder your family (kids etc) from their lifes goals (schooling etc). If you are concerned about the schooling taking a few more years and you will basically be making the same money, think about it this way.....do you have good benefits, healthcare, retirement, 401K, pension provided there? If not, does the possibility of using this new degree land you in a job that would offer that in its salary package? If so, you are making more than you realize. Another thing I would like to add...is that even if you go all the way and get that degree, and then decide you do not want to use it immediatly, you still own that degree and no one can ever take that away from you. Education is priceless, and I have never had a regret about getting my college education. I had a college advisor tell me at one time "a degree in any subject is also a degree in discipline" and many employeers look at it that way as well. I only use about 10% of what I learned in college at my day job with the USDA, but I learned alot in so many other areas of education and life in general. Dont let your age hold you back, I had classmates that were in their 50's and they were just as happy to be there as the younger kids were. Somthing else to think about, with your 2 yr degree, you could possibly land in a job with a company that will allow you to get your bachlors degree at their cost and have the possibility of upward mobility. I know that the overtime/time away from family sucks at times, but weigh it in as to how often it actually happens and it probably is not as bad as it sounds. So in closing, I would encourage you to complete the schooling and see where it leads you. If it is not what you want, then pursue what is. Oh, read your own signature.......

Cheese "my fingers hurt" Man

 

[Big Hank]

Very short background on me... I'm 31, no degree, working on one but not going to see even a two year degree until I'm 33 at the rate I'm going.

From here I'm just going to blabber out some truth about me and my gut so you can see what someone else is thinking.

I've somehow snuck into the coporate world. Good work/ethic resume, knowing some of the right people, working as a contractor currently and always trying to model myself after the people I'm striving to be has landed me in a tough spot. I can relate to you because I know how hard managing life can be when we sit back and look at our age. I'm constantly asking how desireable I am to an employer if I'm a fresh out of college 35 year old..... I've worked myself into a situation that pays okay by most peoples standards. I could never leave at this point without a drastic lifestyle change. My workload leaves almost zero time for school, etc... I'm basically at the top of my current mountain and there are no other places to stand next to me.... Every direction around me is down. If I want more ground to stand on I will have to finish my degree. The degree will also cause the mountain to grow and I can then continue going upward. In my little cartoon explanation here I am at the point where I need to define how high I want this mountain to be and how large of plateau I want to stand on when I get where I'm going. The plateau defines your job security or lifestyle security before you have to start selling your organs. You can look at it either way. To me it sounds like you are in the same spot... All around you is down.

Can you fast track school? I've been debating on quitting work, taking on college loans and just dealing with it as fast as I can. Think about making 300-400 more dollars per week and only having a $400 loan payment each month. You are still 900-1200 ahead each month. I'm really considering this.

Who are you selling yourself to when you do a job interview. Are you going to the right people? Are you looking at how diverse you major really is? I'm thinking health and safety in a factory or corporate side of a company? Waste management, power management, financial side of solar and tax benefits to costomers (thinking sales) I've seen people with culinary arts degrees start marketing truck engines. Don't be narrow minded in where your degree can take you.

Use your friends and people you meet. Always be putting off the impression that you are someone hungry to move-up at a moments notice and you are the right guy for any job better than the one you have.

On to the interview process and this is heavily in my opinion... Sell yourself. Always be creative and process what they are telling you so you can articulate your words into an answer that doesn't sound like a telemarketer. Take your passion for Jeeps and how you would explain the way a D35 blows up with 37" tires and use that same passion in your answers. Someone doing the interview is not looking for someone that's searching for a good example. You need to have all the potential thoughts ready to fire away and with passion. Sell yourself! What you can do for them is key!

Resume - There are many types of resume formats. Don't assume you have a resume that is good for the company you are applying. Research the type of business and adjust it accordingly. I see people all the time with the high school format for a resume. Get on Linked-in and find out how other people express themselves. Find someone at your current company or a friends parent that is on there and been successful. It's amazing how those people express themselves. They won't even have a degree in a field of your interest but they will appear capable of anything.

I see people all the time with great degrees and they just suck at life. I see people all the time who are great at life with no degree and both end up in the same place. Find the balance. Get a plan. Execute the plan.

Long two cents with not much structure. Just wanted to share some things that come to mind.

I'm at work now typing this out... I better get back to work.

Big 'a lot of life to live' Hank

 

[BRIANHO13]

I machining intrests you and you have the ability to learn it I would say go that route. Learn how to run/program CNC mills and in 10 years you will be able to request pretty much whatever you want. Most of the machinnists in this country are older and getting closer to retirement. Most of the younger crowd wants to sit beihnd a cumputer and not learn any skills. There would be plenty of open doors.....

 

[89eliminator]

i went to tech school to be an electrical tech but went on to get my bachelors in electrical engineering. 35-40k/yr for a tech seems low, but maybe its location dependant. i know around here, good ones are looking at about 45-55k/year. we had a tech leave because he had an offer for 62k/yr. i wasnt the best student (graduated with a 2.9gpa) but learned way more being in industry then i ever did at college. like tyler said, some companies will take on a tech and pay for their school to get a bachelors degree and subsequent raise.

with all that being said, the renewable energy field has had a downturn lately especially wind power. those numbers may have been pretty accurate a few years ago. we have a few big accounts in wind power and havent seen much sales from them recently.

 

[SAMSET]

Thanks for the responses guys. Some of what you guys said is a reminder for me as to why I got in this in the 2nd place(1st was moneyatriot but to do something I care about more. Something that makes me feel good at the end of the day. I am not going to derail this thread with a bunch of political views on what everyone thinks about renewable energy. I will just say this, I personally feel that eventually renewable energy will be the norm. Even if it is not in my life time, it will be. With that said, I sometimes have to remind myself that I want in on that. I want to look back years from now and know that I had a part in it. So I think my current plan(as of this week :looney is to pass on any normal factory jobs that I fear I will get trapped in for years to come. Unless the pay is unpassable(since money was 1st). But I think for now I will not make a lateral move, Ill wait for that renewable job. I also think that I may start applying at renewable companies as a just in case type of situation. Also, my wife and I talked and agreed that I should get more involved to keep my spirits up on the subject, so I will have to read up and keep with the most current news.

Thanks again for the words as they did help remind me of my goals

 

[Molly Ann]

Sam, the next time you have an interview, read this. This has been my interview bible and has helped me tremendously. Best of luck in whatever you decide to do! It can only get better from here.

http://www.conceptsl.com/veille/Divers/How to answer the 64 thoughest interview questions.pdf

 

[old_man]

I have been in the electronics field for over 40 years. Unlike the parts business, the longer you stay in the field, the more you learn and the more you earn. When I started back when, I took a cut in pay from my union journeyman grocery store pay rate. I now make probably 8 times what they make. You have to look at the long term.

 

[karstic]

Try to find an internship. Thepay may be low but the experience you gain would be invaluable.

 

[kmanxj5050]

Re: Re: Feeling stuck

I machining intrests you and you have the ability to learn it I would say go that route. Learn how to run/program CNC mills and in 10 years you will be able to request pretty much whatever you want. Most of the machinnists in this country are older and getting closer to retirement. Most of the younger crowd wants to sit beihnd a cumputer and not learn any skills. There would be plenty of open doors.....

X1,000

Machining is a growing field and they're are WAAAYYYY to many young guys like me that are completely worthless. We looked for a year for a decent CNC tech if they were good the shops they were at weren't going to let them go.

And a lot of places are willing to do just what Brian said and train you on site. And you can make damn good money.

Whatever you do, do it for you. At the end of the day you have to sleep with your decisions.

Best of luck my friendZ

 

[w_howey]

I remember typing a message or two to you about a year ago for exactly the things you are now talking about... That the renewable energy field is not the panacea that it has been billed as. The number of projects starting is really down, and the ones that are starting are smaller than the ones in the past. And the tech schools/jr colleges continue to crank out technician graduates.

One of the schools local to me has now shut down their wind tech program as they struggled to get students and the ones that were graduating were struggling to find jobs that payed enough to succeed on and pay off student loans at the same time.

Sit down with the folks that are the most important in your life. Think about which path will be best for those people short term and longer term. The right decision will come to you.

 

[vt98xj]

A little background about me and then some advice.

I was working at a dealership in detail right after high school and moved into an entry level tech position. In the mean time I applied and was accepted into BS mechanical engineering technology. Very similar to the BS Mechanical engineering but MET seems to be looked down upon. I got some advice from the master tech in the shop and he told me to go for the degree if I had a choice, so based on his recommendation I followed thru with the MET degree.

Graduated in college in 2009 and could find a job to save my life, every free minute was spent job hunting, and I ended back at the same dealership! I was freaking out because the pay would barely cover my loan payment and I was back living in my mom's house. One year later I finally got an offer and accepted, and moved to the Midwest to work as a contractor for CAT in engine calibration development. Pay was normal for an entry level engineer, worked for a year and got a huge bump. My overal goal was to become full time at CAT, that didn't work out to transfer over to full time CAT. So I stated looking at other jobs, interviewed and got an offer at Kohler then told CAT the did a rush interview and made a counter to bring me on full time, haha I guess they needed a little pressure. Went back and forth between the two and finely ended up accepting kohler a offer. This move almost doubled my salary from when I first started as a contractor at CAT.

At this point 28 yrs old i am very happy in the choice i made to continue schooling after highschool, getting out of the dealership environment and I am doing a lot of the same troubleshooting that I did at the dealership and a lot more, doing Application reviews and engine tuning/calibration work.

50-60k is normal for a entry level engineer fresh out of college, so for an experienced tech to be around 45-55k seems about right, but would be hard to get much above that.

at minimum finish the 2 year. Have you thought about going into a more general degree? If you study for a specific then you will more then likely get a job only in that specific. Have you ever though about trying to do a 4 year degree? It opens up a lot of different doors and a higher salary...

 

[GoSlowGetStuck]

Regarding the degree, remember that renewable energy is just your specialization. It's still a major in electrical tech, which is going to be widely applicable. I went through a similar thing, I specialized in network engineering, now I have worked as a software developer for 7 years. They both use computers but within that industry they are very different. Things don't always work out how you plan, but I know that I got a lot more consideration for jobs because of any technical degree than I would have without one.

Having said that, the value of a degree is increasingly debated. Does a degree increase your chances of getting a job? Yes. A higher paying job? Probably. Is it worth the expense to get the degree? Increasingly the answer for many people is no. Yes, it will open many doors for you, but if the immediate return is finding a job that pays the same, that will be a tough pill to swallow.

I know that doesn't help you much. You need a "should I go to college or not?" answer, but in short there is no right answer. I think that education is very valuable, generally speaking. But that doesn't mean it's automatically the right answer.

Tyler nailed one of the most under-considered issues - benefits, health care, and retirement. Does your current job offer you health benefits? If so, you want to be very cautious about jeopardizing that, especially if your family is depending on health insurance.

I will give you another option to consider. One benefit of your current job is the predictable hours. You still get 16 hours a day to do whatever you want. Think about side jobs. What skills do you have that you could apply in your free time? Taking a part time job may not be worth it for what they would pay, but do you have any business ideas? You can do a lot of auto maintenance and you have access to cheap parts right? Spread the word through family and friends, offer to do oil changes, brake jobs, etc. at competitive rates. Unless of course your employer has said that you can't do that

There is a lot to be said for having a stable full time job to pay the bills, and still having time to explore other options. Even better, when it comes to learning new skills and researching things, you are fortunate to have a job where you can sit on the computer and do that during your downtime. For instance, regarding machining - there is probably enough free information on web sites and YouTube about CNC and G-code that you could learn a ton, even without any hands-on experience. Yes, it will be hard to get an interview with no formal education or real experience, but - wouldn't it be impressive to say "I learned how to do this on my own, just because it was interesting to me." That would be the number one thing I would look for when hiring - someone who does something just because it's interesting to them.

 

[SAMSET]

Sam, the next time you have an interview, read this. This has been my interview bible and has helped me tremendously. Best of luck in whatever you decide to do! It can only get better from here.

http://www.conceptsl.com/veille/Divers/How to answer the 64 thoughest interview questions.pdf

Thanks molly. This will be helpful since I have close to no experience with interviews. Like I said before, I got my current job when I was 16.

I will keep this.

A little background about me and then some advice.

I was working at a dealership in detail right after high school and moved into an entry level tech position. In the mean time I applied and was accepted into BS mechanical engineering technology. Very similar to the BS Mechanical engineering but MET seems to be looked down upon. I got some advice from the master tech in the shop and he told me to go for the degree if I had a choice, so based on his recommendation I followed thru with the MET degree.

Graduated in college in 2009 and could find a job to save my life, every free minute was spent job hunting, and I ended back at the same dealership! I was freaking out because the pay would barely cover my loan payment and I was back living in my mom's house. One year later I finally got an offer and accepted, and moved to the Midwest to work as a contractor for CAT in engine calibration development. Pay was normal for an entry level engineer, worked for a year and got a huge bump. My overal goal was to become full time at CAT, that didn't work out to transfer over to full time CAT. So I stated looking at other jobs, interviewed and got an offer at Kohler then told CAT the did a rush interview and made a counter to bring me on full time, haha I guess they needed a little pressure. Went back and forth between the two and finely ended up accepting kohler a offer. This move almost doubled my salary from when I first started as a contractor at CAT.

At this point 28 yrs old i am very happy in the choice i made to continue schooling after highschool, getting out of the dealership environment and I am doing a lot of the same troubleshooting that I did at the dealership and a lot more, doing Application reviews and engine tuning/calibration work.

50-60k is normal for a entry level engineer fresh out of college, so for an experienced tech to be around 45-55k seems about right, but would be hard to get much above that.

at minimum finish the 2 year. Have you thought about going into a more general degree? If you study for a specific then you will more then likely get a job only in that specific. Have you ever though about trying to do a 4 year degree? It opens up a lot of different doors and a higher salary...

This is very helpful because its seems as you were in a similar spot. Having a job that pays well and could easily be consider the rest of you life career but you decided to go to school instead. I only wish I started after high school instead of 26

Regarding the degree, remember that renewable energy is just your specialization. It's still a major in electrical tech, which is going to be widely applicable. I went through a similar thing, I specialized in network engineering, now I have worked as a software developer for 7 years. They both use computers but within that industry they are very different. Things don't always work out how you plan, but I know that I got a lot more consideration for jobs because of any technical degree than I would have without one.

Having said that, the value of a degree is increasingly debated. Does a degree increase your chances of getting a job? Yes. A higher paying job? Probably. Is it worth the expense to get the degree? Increasingly the answer for many people is no. Yes, it will open many doors for you, but if the immediate return is finding a job that pays the same, that will be a tough pill to swallow.

I know that doesn't help you much. You need a "should I go to college or not?" answer, but in short there is no right answer. I think that education is very valuable, generally speaking. But that doesn't mean it's automatically the right answer.

Tyler nailed one of the most under-considered issues - benefits, health care, and retirement. Does your current job offer you health benefits? If so, you want to be very cautious about jeopardizing that, especially if your family is depending on health insurance.

I will give you another option to consider. One benefit of your current job is the predictable hours. You still get 16 hours a day to do whatever you want. Think about side jobs. What skills do you have that you could apply in your free time? Taking a part time job may not be worth it for what they would pay, but do you have any business ideas? You can do a lot of auto maintenance and you have access to cheap parts right? Spread the word through family and friends, offer to do oil changes, brake jobs, etc. at competitive rates. Unless of course your employer has said that you can't do that

There is a lot to be said for having a stable full time job to pay the bills, and still having time to explore other options. Even better, when it comes to learning new skills and researching things, you are fortunate to have a job where you can sit on the computer and do that during your downtime. For instance, regarding machining - there is probably enough free information on web sites and YouTube about CNC and G-code that you could learn a ton, even without any hands-on experience. Yes, it will be hard to get an interview with no formal education or real experience, but - wouldn't it be impressive to say "I learned how to do this on my own, just because it was interesting to me." That would be the number one thing I would look for when hiring - someone who does something just because it's interesting to them.

Yes sir! I was just going to say lots of this.
My degree will be in Electrical/Electronics Technology SPECIALIZING in renewable energy. More important than the renewable field out there, I will have a degree in Electrical/Electronics Technology. I also plan to take on the other fields but that would be an after degree is truly mine. Then I can continue going and taking the classes that specialize in industrial, mechanical and process control.

Brad you are correct there. Is college worth it anymore? That has been a huge consideration I am battling with right now. It will probably cost me 20k+ to get my 2yr degree. Will that ever pay for itself? How long will it take. My buddy is an electrical tech, he has 9yrs experience so far and no degree. If we were applying for the same job, I dont see a company preferring me over him because I have a degree and no experience.

 

[BRIANHO13]

Brad you are correct there. Is college worth it anymore? That has been a huge consideration I am battling with right now. It will probably cost me 20k+ to get my 2yr degree. Will that ever pay for itself? How long will it take. My buddy is an electrical tech, he has 9yrs experience so far and no degree. If we were applying for the same job, I dont see a company preferring me over him because I have a degree and no experience.

Doctors, Engineers and Lawyers these degrees almost guarantee a payback. MOST others aren't worth nearly as much. If you go to a small state school where the education doesn't cost a ton some degrees might be worth it.....

You can always do a four year and go into the military as an officer and retire in 20 years....Wish I had done this 14 years ago, I would be 6 years away from retirement.

 

[vt98xj]

I am 28 and almost have college loans paid off and just bought a house last year. I would say that my degree paid off very well once I got a job. I make more then both my parents who are in their mid 50s...

If I were you I would look into a mechanical/electrical combo. This is going to be huge very soon. I graduated with a BS MET and spend a lot of my time doing both electrical and mechanical engineering work.

The big question is would you be happy doing the parts counter(or something similar) job for the rest of your life?

 

[WB9YZU]

Sam, My thoughts FWTW:

Old Man put forth good points abut Job vs Career vs Education.

You have a Job. $37K isn't aweful, just, that's going to be about the ceiling.
Good Benefits are worth the trade in pay. Steady Honest work.

Your grades may be a problem. Having a Degree is one thing, having a Degree where it showed that you took it seriously is another. I'm not telling you to drop out, I am saying that if you really want this thing to seriously apply yourself. It won't stop when you get out of school. Learning new things advances your career.

Also, Electrical and Electronics are 2 different fields, seldom do they cross paths. A Electrician who does low voltage or data wiring is still an Electrician

All in all, it comes down to what you are happy with and exactly how hard it is that you want to work for it.

Want money and an awesome career (or at least be happy with your place in the world)?
You have to be motivated, be flexible, and have a certain amount of natural talent for what you do.
If that place in the world for you is "Parts God", then be the best damn Parts God you can be.
Want a different career? Then choose what will make you happy, and if you excel at it, the money will come.

-Ron

 

[89eliminator]

If I were you I would look into a mechanical/electrical combo. This is going to be huge very soon.

THIS. We have an intern at work that is getting his bachelor's in ME and EE. He says companies are pretty much lined up for him for when he graduates. Its called mechatronics around here. I would guess that will be a program at universities soon.

 

[altrocker1]

Lots of good advice here...there are huge skilled trade shortages in this country right now (part of the reason why there are programs to help pay for school for some of them) I know vermeer in Iowa has a huge shortage of machinists and welders. I would guess some of that deficit carries over to the renewable energy world as well. The big thing to think about is that that deficit is only getting worse as the baby boomers and the generation after start to retire. The amount of workers over 55 in the the skilled trade work force is staggering and the potential to get paid well for those jobs is going to grow again in the not so distant future. Its the reason you see celebrities like mike rowe getting involved because it will have a big economic impact on this country...outside of a few states on the east coast, Illinois has the largest shortage of workers in skilled trades west of New England...even if you put your head down now and work hard to finish your degree, you may actually be surprised (in a good way) and what is available to you when you're finished. After we move, I am seriously contemplating getting my welding certification. not just because it would be of huge benefit to me, but there is actually a need now for freelance welders in some areas because of shortages.

 

[BRIANHO13]

Sam, My thoughts FWTW:

Old Man put forth good points abut Job vs Career vs Education.

You have a Job. $37K isn't aweful, just, that's going to be about the ceiling.
Good Benefits are worth the trade in pay. Steady Honest work.

Your grades may be a problem. Having a Degree is one thing, having a Degree where it showed that you took it seriously is another. I'm not telling you to drop out, I am saying that if you really want this thing to seriously apply yourself. It won't stop when you get out of school. Learning new things advances your career.

Also, Electrical and Electronics are 2 different fields, seldom do they cross paths. A Electrician who does low voltage or data wiring is still an Electrician

All in all, it comes down to what you are happy with and exactly how hard it is that you want to work for it.

Want money and an awesome career (or at least be happy with your place in the world)?
You have to be motivated, be flexible, and have a certain amount of natural talent for what you do.
If that place in the world for you is "Parts God", then be the best damn Parts God you can be.
Want a different career? Then choose what will make you happy, and if you excel at it, the money will come.

-Ron

I graduated with a 2.9 never put it on my resume, it didn't matter because I interned and co-oped 30-40hrs a week my last three years of school.

I had so much experience by the time I graduated no one even asked about my grades.