school shooting

[johnlv6]

Pretty crazy stuff really. Seems like the world is changing so drastically. I see so many angry kids in school.

I just can't imagine hanging onto it for 20 years like that guy.

 

[riverfever]

I just can't imagine hanging onto it for 20 years like that guy.

I'm going to guess that there's a high likelihood that there was some mental illness involved. If he was sexually abused...it was haunting him each and every day.

Look at the changes over the years. Parenting styles are vastly different, there is less of the "it takes a village to raise a kid" mentality now (IMO...b/c parenting styles are so different now), the increased usage of video games and predominantly violent ones at that, violence in music. Yes, we listened to Metallica, Ozzy and some others but lyrically, it's worse today. I'm not trying to make excuses. A lot of kids can play the games and listen to the music but the kids I work with can't make rational decisions yet. Chronologically speaking, they are 14 year olds but developmentally, they average 8-10. It makes me sad.

 

[zachxj01]

w/e I was making fun with zach see we are friends now tell him zach

ehh were not friends and i read a whole post about you and people making fun of you for about 8 pages so i am not gonna make fun of you in fear u may shoot me:looser: except for that cuase that is just funny

 

[dzolcali]

haha, right....
I blame all this on the parents and the upbringings of these little bastards. I mean who teaches a kid or gives a kid a gun or even shows them what a gun looks like at that age. The other thing I would blame it on is all the misuse of pyschological drugs that kids and adults are consuming like vitamins these days. I bet 100 bucks if I wanted any random pill for my own personal pleasure I could go to the doctor and ask to be prescribed it for "said" condition and they would diagnose and prescribe me with it no questions asked. I've seen countless people at my work doing this and even more at school and etc...

but a drug I would really like to get my hands on is that designer drug that allows you to see in infared thats pretty bad ass.

 

[johnlv6]

I'm going to guess that there's a high likelihood that there was some mental illness involved. If he was sexually abused...it was haunting him each and every day.

I'm sure there must have been. I can't imagine what a younger girl would have done to him that would stick with him that long though (the young girls were his specific target).

 

[Hellbent]

in the end, regardless of anything else(except maybe delusions, brought on by severe mental illness), it all comes down to personal responsibility. you chose what you do. there's almost no way to predict when someone will chose to punish other people with a misplaced anger borne of inferiority and/or their inability to deal with living an imperfect life. f*ck blaming this-and-that; how about being a good, strong person? or is that an outdated mode of thinking? jmho

 

[ECKSJAY]

haha, right....
I blame all this on the parents and the upbringings of these little bastards. I mean who teaches a kid or gives a kid a gun or even shows them what a gun looks like at that age.

Responsibility is showing the children what firearms are and that they should respect them. If you don't shroud it in mystery there will be no dangerous curiousity. Children who are educated are less likely to be involved in negligent discharges or intentional, malicious acts. Plenty of cases where a kid 'in the know' averted danger by doing the right thing. My 5 year old daughter watches me shoot at the range and has a profound respect for firearms. She has been watching me shoot shotgun, rifle, and pistol since before she could even walk. I've got a modified Crosman pump pellet gun, stock shortened to her length of pull, that she has been learning with. In a couple of weeks we'll be taking a bird-hunting trip together. She won't be doing any shooting, but will be carrying her own unloaded pellet gun. I'm teaching her the safety of firearms handling and tradition of hunting. That, IMHO, is the best way to open doors for a child and get them involved. Television is SO overrated and is for those who aren't capable of imagination.

 

[goodburbon]

Responsibility is showing the children what firearms are and that they should respect them. If you don't shroud it in mystery there will be no dangerous curiousity. Children who are educated are less likely to be involved in negligent discharges or intentional, malicious acts. Plenty of cases where a kid 'in the know' averted danger by doing the right thing. My 5 year old daughter watches me shoot at the range and has a profound respect for firearms. She has been watching me shoot shotgun, rifle, and pistol since before she could even walk. I've got a modified Crosman pump pellet gun, stock shortened to her length of pull, that she has been learning with. In a couple of weeks we'll be taking a bird-hunting trip together. She won't be doing any shooting, but will be carrying her own unloaded pellet gun. I'm teaching her the safety of firearms handling and tradition of hunting. That, IMHO, is the best way to open doors for a child and get them involved. Television is SO overrated and is for those who aren't capable of imagination.

X a brazillian

I got a bow and arrows when I was 8 and my first air rifle when I was 9. I was taught to respect firearms and handle them with care from a very early age. I was given my first shotgun at 11 and rifle at 13. We brought firearms to school, no one ever thought of using them there. There were many occasions when we had ammunition in our backpacks from the hunt the weekend before, guns under the seat, etc. They cracked down on it while I was there, installed metal detectors and got serious about punishment. Look at the good that's done.

The odd thing is that my father isn't a hunter. He has hunted, but he hasn't been since the last time he took me when I was 12.
:dunno:

 

[riverfever]

Absolutely. It makes zero sense to give a kid a video game where he/she can shoot and kill people and NOT explain that what they are doing isn't reality. I was exposed to guns (first an air gun) at probably the 5th grade and then was gradually showed "real" guns as I earned it through responsibility. I still feel education is key.

 

[DaJudge]

Absolutely. It makes zero sense to give a kid a video game where he/she can shoot and kill people and NOT explain that what they are doing isn't reality. I was exposed to guns (first an air gun) at probably the 5th grade and then was gradually showed "real" guns as I earned it through responsibility. I still feel education is key.

X2...I grew up with guns. Rifles, shotguns, hand guns. We were taught the responsible use of firearms and more importantly to respect others and respect life. All of us new there was a loaded handgun in my dads dresser. None of us ever thought of touching it. Of course as River brought out things are different. My parents didn't worry that if they slapped us in public the state would arrest them and take us away from them.

 

[ECKSJAY]

X2...I grew up with guns. Rifles, shotguns, hand guns. We were taught the responsible use of firearms and more importantly to respect others and respect life. All of us new there was a loaded handgun in my dads dresser. None of us ever thought of touching it. Of course as River brought out things are different. My parents didn't worry that if they slapped us in public the state would arrest them and take us away from them.

Oddly enough, I DIDN'T grow up with firearms in ready use. Dad had an old Springfield trapdoor .45-70 (now mine!) that was always in the old case in his closet, unlocked. I knew where the box of cartridges were, but never even had the thought to look at the thing. Dad made it a point to show my brother and I when we were very young, even demonstrating it to us when we'd go back to the grandparents' farm in NoDak. We knew the power it had and respected it. Dad NEVER denied us looking at it if we asked. I got my first and only air rifle when I was 11, from saving up lawnmowing money. I set up a trap in the backyard and Dad showed me how to use it properly, making sure I understood the safety rules in the book. Dad grew up hunting on the farm but never went since I was born. We all shot blackbirds on the farm in the Summer when we'd visit, but never went on an actual hunt together. When I was 16 I started volunteering with a police dept and through that was subjected to my first formal firearms training. Since then I've been a rifle and pistol basic marksmanship instructor and have taken many advanced courses in '3-gun'. I was formally introduced to hunting by a very good friend in the Army who began hunting with a .410 shotgun at the age of 6. Mike is now a hunting guide in El Paso, TX and is taking me on a hunt in January. I can't wait to get back there with him!

I always make it a point to remember the roots and to educate the uneducated. I also advocate personal responsibility. Nobody should be there to hold your hand. Seek your own answers. Those asked these questions should give the answers to the best of their knowledge/ability. If they don't know the answers, seek out the answers together.

 

[IcedXJ]

I always make it a point to remember the roots and to educate the uneducated. I also advocate personal responsibility. Nobody should be there to hold your hand. Seek your own answers. Those asked these questions should give the answers to the best of their knowledge/ability. If they don't know the answers, seek out the answers together.

That is quite a good point.

On a side note, I am gonna make it my sig...muhahaha

 

[ECKSJAY]

That is quite a good point.

On a side note, I am gonna make it my sig...muhahaha

Flattered, thanks.

 

[IcedXJ]

Flattered, thanks.

He's blushing, I will make my move :laugh2:

 

[dzolcali]

Responsibility is showing the children what firearms are and that they should respect them. If you don't shroud it in mystery there will be no dangerous curiousity. Children who are educated are less likely to be involved in negligent discharges or intentional, malicious acts. Plenty of cases where a kid 'in the know' averted danger by doing the right thing. My 5 year old daughter watches me shoot at the range and has a profound respect for firearms. She has been watching me shoot shotgun, rifle, and pistol since before she could even walk. I've got a modified Crosman pump pellet gun, stock shortened to her length of pull, that she has been learning with. In a couple of weeks we'll be taking a bird-hunting trip together. She won't be doing any shooting, but will be carrying her own unloaded pellet gun. I'm teaching her the safety of firearms handling and tradition of hunting. That, IMHO, is the best way to open doors for a child and get them involved. Television is SO overrated and is for those who aren't capable of imagination.

I have to disagree, I never had a father figure or guns in the house. Never had access to a gun, never knew how to shoot one, and never had respect or lack of respect for a gun. But I gaurantee if there was a gun in the house, whether I respected it or not, if it came down to some moment in my 5 6 or 13 year old brain that i needed to shoot someone, respect or not, I would know where to locate the gun, and how to operate it. I agree with the right to bear arms but it is a double edged sword...

 

[ECKSJAY]

I have to disagree, I never had a father figure or guns in the house. Never had access to a gun, never knew how to shoot one, and never had respect or lack of respect for a gun. But I gaurantee if there was a gun in the house, whether I respected it or not, if it came down to some moment in my 5 6 or 13 year old brain that i needed to shoot someone, respect or not, I would know where to locate the gun, and how to operate it. I agree with the right to bear arms but it is a double edged sword...

The key in my equation is the locked gun safe. 5yo girl with no clue how to open the safe = no need to worry. I never said I advocated irresponsible ownership and storage.:rtm:

No father figure? You don't say...

 

[8Mud]

We've been succesfully indoctrinated, that guns equate with violence. If the firearms were tio disappear, the violence would stop.
Guns are used to cause bodily harm, because in many instances they are the learned proper tool for the job.
I'd be willing to bet, the instances of assault intended to cause death are fairly constant, between cultures, irregardless of the firearm laws.
Here in Germany, they are much more likely to design a fatal accident or by the less imaginative, use arson as a weapon. Maybe a Mercedes in a moment of rage.
I've said it before and will say it again. A certain percentage of the population is just plain dangerous. In stages from 1% to almost 15%, by the degree of there danger and the probability it will manifest. If it wasn't a gun, it would likely be something else, like a machette, an axe, a malatov cocktail, a motor vehicle or whatever, let your imagination run wild.
I'd actually feel safer, if the fairly stable 63% of the population, all had firearms and were self policing.
If guns never existed and/or ceased to exist, the numbers of homicides, would likely still be fairly constant. Maybe then they would try to outlaw any sharp edged tool, then all flamable liquids etc. ad nausium.

 

[Beej]

See? Once again, guns kill people.


Discuss...

 

[dzolcali]

I'd actually feel safer, if the fairly stable 63% of the population, all had firearms and were self policing.
If guns never existed and/or ceased to exist, the numbers of homicides, would likely still be fairly constant. Maybe then they would try to outlaw any sharp edged tool, then all flamable liquids etc. ad nausium.

agreed except maybe the number of homicides I think they would be lower still, but you would have to admit those who are intending on killing someone regardless of weapon, if you took away the guns there would be a lot messier murders and so forth. i.e. stabbing is bloodier than shooting in most cases, and chopping heads off or w/e also.

Then we gotta pay more janitors and crime scene clean up guys and things just get hairy after that.

 

[Beej]

agreed except maybe the number of homicides I think they would be lower still, but you would have to admit those who are intending on killing someone regardless of weapon, if you took away the guns there would be a lot messier murders and so forth. i.e. stabbing is bloodier than shooting in most cases, and chopping heads off or w/e also.

Then we gotta pay more janitors and crime scene clean up guys and things just get hairy after that.

Actually, if you take away guns, you get a lot less murders in general. Look at pretty much every other first world country in the world...