Roller Camshafts for the 4.0

[Flash]

So did you have one of their cams fail on you because of lack of ZDDP in the oil you were running or was it something else? They're not the only ones with cams that have flattened due to the newer oils.

Kyung

I will 2nt that!!!! the lack of ZDDP in the oil is do blame,,,,,Crane was not the only one to have cam failers! and with a roller cam, the new oil can't harm your cam!

How ever, if you must, you can have you cam blank made, and have another cam grinder, Finnish you cam.......... My self, "Crane' will be doing the Finnish grinding on mine.

Flash.

 

[Dr. Dyno]

How ever, if you must, you can have you cam blank made, and have another cam grinder, Finnish you cam.......... My self, "Crane' will be doing the Finnish grinding on mine.

I didn't know Crane had relocated to Finland.

 

[Flash]

I didn't know Crane had relocated to Finland.

:yelclap: :looser: "Spell check" can hide most of my poor spelling but, don't work worth a SHE'IT for my Grammar:gee:


Flash.

 

[MrShoeBoy]

So did you have one of their cams fail on you because of lack of ZDDP in the oil you were running or was it something else? They're not the only ones with cams that have flattened due to the newer oils.

Kyung

I have had two of their cams fail, both of which where not related to oil. Sure the oil didnt help the situation but it was not the primary cause of failure. First time their springs and retainers where not right and flattened the cam, second time the cam gear went soft. Both times they said it was all my falt, kept making excuses, and finally after me calling every day for two weeks and then finally showing up at their office and complaining in person with cam in hand did they offer to replace the cam. That was "nice" of them but they still fucked me over on the rest of the motor which needed new bearings, seals, oil pump, fluids, hone the block and polish the crank. If Crane wasnt involved, I would be all over a big roller cam for the 4.0L motor.

AARON

 

[MrShoeBoy]

I am very happy with the Hesco cam that I put in my new stroker. It feels a lot stronger than the old Crane cam, even others who have driven my Jeep say the new motor has more power than the old one. I am well aware of the oil additive or lack of in most conventional oils and avoid them.

AARON

 

[Flash]

I have had two of their cams fail, both of which where not related to oil. Sure the oil didnt help the situation but it was not the primary cause of failure. First time their springs and retainers where not right and flattened the cam, second time the cam gear went soft. Both times they said it was all my falt, kept making excuses, and finally after me calling every day for two weeks and then finally showing up at their office and complaining in person with cam in hand did they offer to replace the cam. That was "nice" of them but they still fucked me over on the rest of the motor which needed new bearings, seals, oil pump, fluids, hone the block and polish the crank. If Crane wasnt involved, I would be all over a big roller cam for the 4.0L motor.

AARON

As i have said before Crane in not involve with this cam Blank, let me repeat my self, CRANE IS, IN NO WAY, INVOLVED, WHAT SO EVER, in the Building of the Roller Cam Blank, for the 4.0L (it has the fuel pump lobe on it, so it can be used for any AMC/Jeep L6) Jeeps.

You don't have to buy the "Roller Lifters" from Crane either.

Once you have the "Roller Cam Blank" built. All you have to do is hand, or mail your 'Cam Blank' to your favorite "Cam Grinder." Then you and your Cam Grinder can decide on what cam grind, that will work best, for you application!

Crane real does not need to be involve, with the proses, and that is completely you choose.

Who know, you just might find a "Cam Grinder", that is willing to mas produce this product.:thumbup:

Flash.

 

[MrShoeBoy]

That works I saw Crane and grinding and that was going to be a no go for me. Who else would grind a cam blank?

AARON

 

[Flash]

That works I saw Crane and grinding and that was going to be a no go for me. Who else would grind a cam blank?

AARON

To be honest, I'm really not sure. when i was e-mail several cam names. "Isky Cams" was on of the fue that responded to my e-mail, and i thing.....they said they ground there own cams as well as special cams.
don't hold me to it but if it wasn't them, they were nice enough, and would point you in the Right direction.


Flash.

 

[kremlin]

I don't count lock failure as Cranes' Cam fault - AMC locks are notorious for failing - gear failure is indicative of cam walk - which is why MoPar installed the
cam buttons in later production. Crane gave you a free cam ? and you gripe...

I've dealt with Crane since the mid 1970s - top notch. Made the custom roller cams in the Factory BMW race team bikes > took 1-2-3 Daytona.

I ran one of their 'Special Design' cams in my street BMW racer..... nice item.

As to them shaping a roller cam blank - and - the blank maker worked for Crane for years prior - and - Crane did the design work for the Mopar Performance 4.0 cams - and - they are one of the top two choices of the MOAB Race Jeep Engine Builders.........and - you strongly believe they'll 'screw up' - try J.C. Penny's ... they're 'Experts' too.

 

[Dr. Dyno]

I don't count lock failure as Cranes' Cam fault

But I definitely do consider one collapsed but unworn lifter after 34k miles as Crane's fault, and I don't think one cam lobe and another lifter wore away because the quality of the surface-hardening process was top notch. I used Mobil 1 from the 3000 mile mark right up to my cam failure, so I had no reason to believe that a top quality oil wasn't going to protect my cam from wear.

 

[corbinafly]

But I definitely do consider one collapsed but unworn lifter after 34k miles as Crane's fault, and I don't think one cam lobe and another lifter wore away because the quality of the surface-hardening process was top notch. I used Mobil 1 from the 3000 mile mark right up to my cam failure, so I had no reason to believe that a top quality oil wasn't going to protect my cam from wear.

The Mobil 1 0W40 that you were running seriously lacked the zinc and phosphorous that we need with our flat tappet cams.
http://www.lnengineering.com/oil.html
So maybe that had something to do with it.

Kyung

 

[Dr. Dyno]

Maybe, though the other 11 lobes on my Crane cam looked as good as new. I wish I'd known a long time ago that the lack of ZDDP in the oils could be a problem, but then the cam companies probably didn't know either until recently. I'm using an SL rated 10W-40 semi-synthetic now.
At the end of the day, ZDDP levels will continue to go down since modern engines don't need the same high levels of these additives as our old hydraulic flat-tappet cam pushrod OHV engines. Oil manufacturers, under pressure from environmentalists and politicians, want our old engines to slowly wither away and die.

 

[seanyb505]

Oil manufacturers, under pressure from environmentalists and politicians, want our old engines to slowly wither away and die.

well thats just not good for anyone...except everyone else

 

[Flash]

Maybe, though the other 11 lobes on my Crane cam looked as good as new. I wish I'd known a long time ago that the lack of ZDDP in the oils could be a problem, but then the cam companies probably didn't know either until recently. I'm using an SL rated 10W-40 semi-synthetic now.
At the end of the day, ZDDP levels will continue to go down since modern engines don't need the same high levels of these additives as our old hydraulic flat-tappet cam pushrod OHV engines. Oil manufacturers, under pressure from environmentalists and politicians, want our old engines to slowly wither away and die.

And that is the problem! NO one new there was a problem, with the new oils(or that the oil's had changed:dunno: ) until there cam failed!:doh:

I'm not saying that the lack of ZDDP is the total answer to why we have seen so many cam failed. but, if there would have been more ZDDP in our oils, even DR.Dyno's bad (noise) and soft lifter(ground down by the cam lobe) would have lived longer..... Noise, But lived longer.

The lack of ZDDP uncovered problem,.........We didn't now we had.

Flash

 

[MudDawg]

Oils WITH ZDDP and other additives are still available....and there is always the option of additives to bring oil up to snuff.....GM EOS comes immediately to mind...and most likely other companies like Lucas will step up....and if I was a cam manufacturer, I would be developing my own label additive or oil right now.....It's true that flat tappet PUSHROD motors are going the way of the DoDo bird, but they are still being built, and millions are still on the road...not to mention the more modern shim and bucket OHC designs...which for all practical purposes ARE flat tappet motors...

Some of the WORST cam/lifter wear I have ever seen were in Honda motorcycle engines which used slipper tappet/rockers...and in Suzuki GS series engines....if you upgrade the springs, the only way to keep the valvetrain happy is to hardface the cam and rockers regardless of the oil being used....but then again these engines were sprung to spin to 12K+.

 

[Flash]

Oils WITH ZDDP and other additives are still available....and there is always the option of additives to bring oil up to snuff.....GM EOS comes immediately to mind...and most likely other companies like Lucas will step up....and if I was a cam manufacturer, I would be developing my own label additive or oil right now.....It's true that flat tappet PUSHROD motors are going the way of the DoDo bird, but they are still being built, and millions are still on the road...not to mention the more modern shim and bucket OHC designs...which for all practical purposes ARE flat tappet motors...

Some of the WORST cam/lifter wear I have ever seen were in Honda motorcycle engines which used slipper tappet/rockers...and in Suzuki GS series engines....if you upgrade the springs, the only way to keep the valvetrain happy is to hardface the cam and rockers regardless of the oil being used....but then again these engines were sprung to spin to 12K+.

Most of them have updated to the, Roller dezine..............I really don't thing there is much, automotive Eng's, of 2007, that are a Flat Tappet deszine!........Would be interesting to find out.

Flash.

 

[Dr. Dyno]

if there would have been more ZDDP in our oils, even DR.Dyno's bad (noise) and soft lifter(ground down by the cam lobe) would have lived longer..... Noise, But lived longer.

I couldn't have put it better myself but not even a high ZDDP oil would have saved my collapsed no.6 exhaust lifter so I would have needed to remove the head and replace the lifters anyway. It might have prolonged the life of the cam though and maybe I wouldn't have lost the no.6 intake cam lobe and lifter as well.

 

[Flash]

WHO'S READY FOR A HIGH DOLLAR, TOP QUALITY HYD ROLLER CAM BLANK............thats stronger then today's oils:scottm:


The unique AMC dist. gear, was our last hurtle and has been figured out.

Any one who has done, any kind of machining can relate, It takes a lot more time setting up a tool then to us it.

This is why we need to make a volume buy here to get a good price on the
Cam Blank, Joe at Roto Faze is working up the numbers for 1 or 6 cam blanks.......if we have more then 6 cam ordered the price could even be less:clap:



It may be next week before i get some numbers. For those that are serious about this, just wanted to give ya some heads.

Flash

 

[BlueCuda]

I am interested, can't say how serious at the moment though.

 

[brent]

what are the numbers?