Project Downward Spiral

[Begster]

I did get them partially welded on before I took a break for dinner... that was a bad idea cause I just didn't want to get started again tonight.

Ha, I have had this happen way too many times. I've came inside and sat down for a quick bite to eat, found something good on tv, and just not gone back out to work anymore.

That looks like a ton of work though, those look awesome. Nice job, can't wait to see more progress pics.

 

[RCman]

Minor updates from the past weekend:
-I got the rear inner braces 85% welded up. Got a little more work on them and then the rear suspension mounts can go up.
-The newly released frame stiffeners I ordered from H.D. Offroad Engineering look good and should save me a ton of time and seem to be worth the cash. I do have to build a x-member first before I put them up though.
-Called Summit Machine on Friday and the flex joints should be shipping out this week after a minor delay due to their plating source.
-I've now logged a TON of hours with my angle grinder and I know I will log a ton more. Thinking about it it would be kinda neat if had an hourmeter on it, then again I almost don't want to know.

 

[Justpunchit]

Wow bill it looks great so far, I'm Keeping my XJ after all so I have the same ideas in mind. I gotta stop by!!

 

[RCman]

Wow bill it looks great so far, I'm Keeping my XJ after all so I have the same ideas in mind. I gotta stop by!!

Thanks Eric!
Give me a call sometime.

 

[RCman]

Well, I started this weekend with intentions of building a cross member for the trans, but didn't end up getting that far.

I pulled down the stocker (no pics for that) and started laying out the new one on some 2x4 3/16" wall box and 1/2" plate. Then I kept crawling under wondering if I really wanted to stick with short arms. So I dug out the truss for the front D60, unburied the front D60 itself and started setting up some angles. I ended up with about 3 degrees of caster and 7.8 degrees for my pinion angle.

Then after looking at it for awhile, I realized that I could use the RE Adj. Uppers I had, and cannibalize the joints from the RE lowers and go with a radius arm setup that mounted on the cross member. So I decided to tack on the truss and see what would work. That's where I ran into a small issue.

The above is where I had set the "ride height". It looks like I severely miscalculated that. The axle center line is 17.25" off the ground (estimate for partially deflated 38"s). With that it gives me about 7/8" of clearance before I uppercut the oil pan. Great, I can run over some M&Ms and thats about it. So I'll have to crunch some more numbers and raise the XJ up some more.

Above shows how much spring would have been if I had left everything alone. I'm thinking I'll bump stop the bottom 4.25" and where it sits now should be pretty close to full compression.
I am a little worried though, as I planned to use the brand new RE 4.5" coils I've got up front. Yet with my calculations they should be about 14-15" total length at static ride height with just the weight of the XJ. Going from the above picture, you can see that that would give me about 3" more at best. I can crank down on the ACOS to gain some more, but I don't really want to use that for more than say 1.5". That would give me about 4.5" of uptravel, seems kinda small to me. :dunno: I'll have to work on that.

 

[Gravesdiggerxj]

5-6" of uptravel works great for me

 

[RCman]

5-6" of uptravel works great for me

Yup, I've been doing some reading and had some convos with others and it seems like if I can get to about 5" of uptravel from static height I should be alright.

I'm thinking I'll probably end up clearancing the truss some. The more and more I look at it the more I'm unhappy with the front truss, but I've got it so I'll use it now.

 

[RCman]

So I bailed on going out on a Friday night with freinds and figured I'd watch the highlights of the debates on the morning news so that I could get some work done.

Didn't end up getting to much done, but I did get the weight of the Jeep on the RE 4.5" XJ Coils. I added 160lbs of weight to the front to simulate the weight of the winch and the bumper. I also threw a length of steel up there to simulate the added weight of the front frame plates. Ended up with this at static height:

In case you can't read that, that is 15.75" inches. So assuming that I bumpstop it to stop at the 11.75" shown a few posts above (giving me 7/8" clearance to the oil pan), that will give me 4" of uptravel without adjusting the ACOS. I'll move the ACOS down 1" to get my target of 5". This also means I won't have to notch the truss at all.

Darn near perfect.

 

[RCman]

Got some work down on the cross member then had yet more interruptions.
I milled the center section out and a piece will be cut to mount on the inside. This will drop the trans mount down and should help with the angles.

It probably looks very similar to some other cross members, probably because it is. There isn't to many ways to build one and be different.

Oh, and for those wondering. Red Dykem works well only on clean shiny steel. Anything like above and it becomes next to impossible to read. Blue Dykem > Red Dykem.

 

[nhrocker]

Eh, I just swipe black Sharpie's and blue Bic pens from work. Might not be the best, but free is free... I used to use some white paint markers, but they get expensive fast.

My front has about 5.5" of uptravel. It's on RE 5.5" coils and 11" travel shocks, but they're my limit straps at the moment. Just as the shocks max out my brake lines go taught. Once I redo brake lines I'll be looking at longer shocks.

Going through all this effort, I'm glad to see you decide to go long arms. A well designed short or mid-arm isn't bad either by any means, but I think you'll be happier with the LA's. Are you going to tuck them up to the insides of the frame rails or have them hanging down underneath? Also have you thought about turning that crossmember into a full belly skid, or making one to bolt under it? Might as well get some protection for your trans/transfer case while you're at it.

 

[RCman]

Ok, section by section.

Eh, I just swipe black Sharpie's and blue Bic pens from work. Might not be the best...

Sharpies work great when you are not using a cutting fluid that wipes them away. I do using them everywhere else.

free is free...

So is all that Dykem I have laying around.

I used to use some white paint markers, but they get expensive fast.

Same reason I don't use 'em.

My front has about 5.5" of uptravel. It's on RE 5.5" coils and 11" travel shocks, but they're my limit straps at the moment. Just as the shocks max out my brake lines go taught. Once I redo brake lines I'll be looking at longer shocks.

It should work out I'll get 5" of uptravel and the rest of the 12" (so 7") down.

Going through all this effort, I'm glad to see you decide to go long arms. A well designed short or mid-arm isn't bad either by any means, but I think you'll be happier with the LA's. Are you going to tuck them up to the insides of the frame rails or have them hanging down underneath?

They will be mounted on the cross member as high as I can get them.

Also have you thought about turning that crossmember into a full belly skid, or making one to bolt under it? Might as well get some protection for your trans/transfer case while you're at it.

I've got a DPG belly skid (3/16") hanging around. If I can modify that to work underneath I'll use that. If not, I'll come up with something.

 

[cracker]

I have been lurking..........

Why do you need a truss on the front end? It seems to be a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. Dana 60 front ends don't bend (easily) at all. A lot D60 front ends are 1/2" wall.

Also, look at how forward the coil pads are. Why don't you move them further back and push the front end out a tad? I had trouble getting mine to fit so I had to do the same (plus my tire size was quite large).

 

[RCman]

Lurking is fine, but it is nice to know people are reading it.

As far a the truss goes, you are right, I probably don't need it. However, I've got it now (something I'd do otherwise if I did it again) and it really doesn't weight much more than just building up and gusseting mounts themselves.

As far as the coil spring perch/pad issue I've been looking at a way to move them forward. I think I might cut them off and spin them around, but I fear that would be to far forward. Its something I'll have to look into, yet as it is the axle gets pushed forward 1.5" from stock as it sits.

BTW, Nice axle!

 

[cracker]

As far as the coil spring perch/pad issue I've been looking at a way to move them forward. I think I might cut them off and spin them around, but I fear that would be to far forward. Its something I'll have to look into, yet as it is the axle gets pushed forward 1.5" from stock as it sits.

You could reverse the pads or cut the pads and put them in the middle. The pinionand diff on a Dana 60 is huge and getting it out front will only be better int he long run.

 

[RCman]

You could reverse the pads or cut the pads and put them in the middle. The pinionand diff on a Dana 60 is huge and getting it out front will only be better int he long run.

Yup, reversing the pads is exactly what I meant by "cut them off and spin them around". Like I said before I'll have to see how it works out. It already is 1.5" further forward than the stock setup and I don't have any clearance issues as it sits.

 

[Mr.OverKill]

Yup, reversing the pads is exactly what I meant by "cut them off and spin them around". Like I said before I'll have to see how it works out. It already is 1.5" further forward than the stock setup and I don't have any clearance issues as it sits.

my current front axle is 2.5 inches forward, i want 2 more when i go to my 60's and i have and don't anticipate having any issues with the steering or track bar, but if i do i just fix it LOL...:cheers:

by the way, thanks for the complement on crackers 609 axle ( i made that )

 

[RCman]

my current front axle is 2.5 inches forward, i want 2 more when i go to my 60's and i have and don't anticipate having any issues with the steering or track bar, but if i do i just fix it LOL...:cheers:

I'll have to move it around and check. At most I'll move it forward another inch or so to get 2.5-3.0" total push forward. As it is (with only a 1.0-1.5" front stretch) I'm at a 115" wheelbase.

by the way, thanks for the complement on crackers 609 axle ( i made that )

Nice work!

 

[pb_beaker]

all i can say is WOW man, looking good.

 

[RCman]

all i can say is WOW man, looking good.

Thanks!

I did get some work done this past weekend, but didn't have time to snap some pictures or post updates. I'll keep the suspense going (not really much to look at anyway) for this weekends update.

 

[asp]

still looks awesome. i'd love to wheel with you when you're done, but i imagine anywhere you'd want to go in that would be impossible for me haha