My 89 MJ runs red power steering fluid...this weekend I will be installing a 2001 XJ steering box. I know the 01 XJ's run clear fluid, what should I run once the new box is installed? Is the type of fluid more important for the pump or the box? Please let me know. Thanks!
Power steering fluid question...
- Thread starter Gjeep
- Start date
mudpuddle
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Bristol, TN
Gjeep said:
My 01 owners manual says specifically to use the Mopar brand clear fluid.
It doesn't say which component requires it, but I would say it's the pump,
with it being the active part. It'll cost you $4-5/qt.at your local stealership.
nate
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
I just use ATF. Flows ALOT better when cold. I busted lines with PS fluid in the cold... ATF, no problems.
ROCKREADYXJ
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- New Hampton, NY
nate said:
This is not a good Idea ATF is a detergent not a hyralic fluid like power steering fluid. There are also lubricants and conditioners in the fluid to help prolong the life of your steering system. As far as blowing hoses,Nate, you must have some other sort of problem. maybe bad hoses on you rig. I run powerstering fluid on my rig and I have hydro assist with a pump that is putting out 2000-2200 psi at 9 gpm I have never popped a hose. stock only puts out about 1200 psi ant 3-5 gpm. I would suggest to anyone out ther who is changing there fluid even if you already have atf in there replace it with power steering Fluid. Its worth it.
5-90
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Hammerspace
'S funny - I've pretty much always run ATF is a system once I get a chance to flush out the PS fluid - and just about every GM I've owned ran Dexron in the PS system anyhow.
Both Dexron and PS Fluid run the same base - 10-weight hydraulic fluid (same stuff I used in forklifts as well...) The difference is an the additive package used - and the Dexron is more tolerant of heat and high pressures than the PS fluid. Besides, isn't an automatic transmission just a big, complicated hydraulic system anyhow?
Of course, the operating pressure of the transmission ranges up to about 350PSIG (I've seen some Hd units hit about 500 under normal operation) while the average PS system hits about 1200-1500PSIG, but that doesn't really matter to the base oil. The increased pressure does entail an increase in system temperature, but that's no problem for the AT fluid to handle anyhow.
I also make a point of changing the fluid in the reservior every two years - but that's got nothing to do with the fluid I use - that's just maintenance. ANY fluid will want changing at intervals - and the fluids that aren't engine oil get changed every two years unless I end up doing something heavy.
Granted, I don't want to mix PS and ATF (I don't know what will happen, and why take chances?) but whenever I have to change one of the larger components and can flush out the system, I'll change fluid for simplicity's sake. The simpler I can make my supply chain, the happier I am. The fewer fluids I have to keep track of, the more room I can make in the shop to store spares and kit...
5-90
Both Dexron and PS Fluid run the same base - 10-weight hydraulic fluid (same stuff I used in forklifts as well...) The difference is an the additive package used - and the Dexron is more tolerant of heat and high pressures than the PS fluid. Besides, isn't an automatic transmission just a big, complicated hydraulic system anyhow?
Of course, the operating pressure of the transmission ranges up to about 350PSIG (I've seen some Hd units hit about 500 under normal operation) while the average PS system hits about 1200-1500PSIG, but that doesn't really matter to the base oil. The increased pressure does entail an increase in system temperature, but that's no problem for the AT fluid to handle anyhow.
I also make a point of changing the fluid in the reservior every two years - but that's got nothing to do with the fluid I use - that's just maintenance. ANY fluid will want changing at intervals - and the fluids that aren't engine oil get changed every two years unless I end up doing something heavy.
Granted, I don't want to mix PS and ATF (I don't know what will happen, and why take chances?) but whenever I have to change one of the larger components and can flush out the system, I'll change fluid for simplicity's sake. The simpler I can make my supply chain, the happier I am. The fewer fluids I have to keep track of, the more room I can make in the shop to store spares and kit...
5-90
ROCKREADYXJ
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- New Hampton, NY
5-90 I see where you are comming from but oil is not oil brake fluid has a rating of 10w and it is safe up to 2000 degrees and you cant swap it in your trans.
You are right old school pumps will work fine w/ atf. but they dont pay high dollar engineers to make fonny fluids. they will replace the ATF in you power steering system and improve the life of it. for the reasions I listed. And if you look back I am almost positive I can double check but I think car mfgs have stoped putting atf in p/s systems for ten years.
Not say that every one should run out and swap there fluids right away I am putting it out there for all that are interested.
You are right old school pumps will work fine w/ atf. but they dont pay high dollar engineers to make fonny fluids. they will replace the ATF in you power steering system and improve the life of it. for the reasions I listed. And if you look back I am almost positive I can double check but I think car mfgs have stoped putting atf in p/s systems for ten years.
Not say that every one should run out and swap there fluids right away I am putting it out there for all that are interested.
5-90
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Hammerspace
I'd be interested in seeing what information you have available!
As far as the brake fluid comparison goes, you're comparing apples and oranges. While brake fluid (DOT3/4 and DOT5) may be rated for 10-weight viscosity, it is nowhere near the same fluid and the comparison is neither fair nor valid. I've never seen a hygroscopic oil, yet that is a common problem with brake fluid, which is why regular bleeding and fluid changes are so necessary to effective brake performance, while PS systems can run so long between fluid changes. The base fluids aren't at all close - petroleum oils are liable to catch fire at the temperatures of medium-to-high speed or performance brake systems.
It should also be borne in mind that the differences in the fluids' reaction to water inclusion is different - while oil will simply form an emulsion when water is mixed in with effort, brake fluid has no trouble with attracting water, and the physical properties - the important ones - are significantly altered in the process.
Something else to think about...
5-90
As far as the brake fluid comparison goes, you're comparing apples and oranges. While brake fluid (DOT3/4 and DOT5) may be rated for 10-weight viscosity, it is nowhere near the same fluid and the comparison is neither fair nor valid. I've never seen a hygroscopic oil, yet that is a common problem with brake fluid, which is why regular bleeding and fluid changes are so necessary to effective brake performance, while PS systems can run so long between fluid changes. The base fluids aren't at all close - petroleum oils are liable to catch fire at the temperatures of medium-to-high speed or performance brake systems.
It should also be borne in mind that the differences in the fluids' reaction to water inclusion is different - while oil will simply form an emulsion when water is mixed in with effort, brake fluid has no trouble with attracting water, and the physical properties - the important ones - are significantly altered in the process.
Something else to think about...
5-90
nate
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
Interesting.
As for me busting a line...
What happened is I went to my buddies house to use it garage. It was around -10*. I drove around 5 miles to his house, parked in the driveway and went in the house. About 20 minutes later, I hoped back in the Jeep as he opened the garage door for me. Well, I lost power steering pulling into the garage. What happened is the return line slip in half for a few inches. The whole line was plugged with slushy PS fluid. I don't understand why it was fine for the drive there, but that's what happened.
After seeing the slush, I thought maybe I had water in the system.
What I did is I took the quart of PS fluid and the quart of ATF I had in the Jeep (carry spare stuff with me) and set them outside for a little bit so they were good and cold. The PS steering fluid turned to a slushy glop, same as what was in my line. While the ATF poured like it was 70* outside.
Maybe it was bad PS fluid? I didn't think of that.
I've been running ATF for over a year and I've had no problems. I remembered GMs running ATF in their systems. I figured it's the same basic saginaw system, so it should be ok. Perhaps it's causing accelerated wear that I won't see for a while? I never stopped to really think about it.
As for me busting a line...
What happened is I went to my buddies house to use it garage. It was around -10*. I drove around 5 miles to his house, parked in the driveway and went in the house. About 20 minutes later, I hoped back in the Jeep as he opened the garage door for me. Well, I lost power steering pulling into the garage. What happened is the return line slip in half for a few inches. The whole line was plugged with slushy PS fluid. I don't understand why it was fine for the drive there, but that's what happened.
After seeing the slush, I thought maybe I had water in the system.
What I did is I took the quart of PS fluid and the quart of ATF I had in the Jeep (carry spare stuff with me) and set them outside for a little bit so they were good and cold. The PS steering fluid turned to a slushy glop, same as what was in my line. While the ATF poured like it was 70* outside.
Maybe it was bad PS fluid? I didn't think of that.
I've been running ATF for over a year and I've had no problems. I remembered GMs running ATF in their systems. I figured it's the same basic saginaw system, so it should be ok. Perhaps it's causing accelerated wear that I won't see for a while? I never stopped to really think about it.
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ROCKREADYXJ
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- New Hampton, NY
I dont know man whatever you want use. There is not much pressure in the return line. So use can use what ever you want I not going to argue with you.That still wont explain why cars havent run atf in the last 10 years.
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
When I bought my '98 new I was told by my local Jeep parts manager (who has since become an ally for me when dealing with dc, or any other problem for that matter) that the ps pump took a very expensive "specialized" fluid. A couple of years later when I went back to buy more, he said that dc sent them a tsb and said that regular ps fluid or even tranny fluid (as long as a total flush was done) was ok. He couldn't tell me if Mobil 1. for instance was safe, but I've been using it for 30-40k w/no problems.
I'd definitely verify this with your local dealer, though. BTW, I can't remember after seven years what color the original/special fluid was.
Mike #300
I'd definitely verify this with your local dealer, though. BTW, I can't remember after seven years what color the original/special fluid was.
Mike #300
nate
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
I wasn't trying to say that running ATF is ok and argue with ya.. I was just saying why I filled it with ATF.
I never actually thought ATF would make a difference until this thread was posted. The Jeep is the newest rig. The other stuff I've owned was older Chevys.
I never actually thought ATF would make a difference until this thread was posted. The Jeep is the newest rig. The other stuff I've owned was older Chevys.
rockreadyxj said:
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