Now Utah!
- Thread starter Original_MudButt
- Start date
Boatwrench
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Petaluma, CA
I'm still skeptical. The illegal immigration is out of control, I don't know what the correct answer is. Whether you like the ACLU or not, this sentence from the article makes sense to me....
"This Arizona statute amounts to requiring the carrying of 'papers,' " McCreary said. "We just don't do that in America."
I take a lot of heat for my pro-socialism stances from posters spouting about the erosions of freedoms, and this may be an erosion of one of them. Let's look beyond the folks that have come across the southern border. Let's take an example I know about. A co-workers wife was deported back to her native Australia earlier this year. She had over-stayed her visa by YEARS. No one I spoke to knew she was here illegally, she was just a middle class housewife and mother. None of suspected a thing and I am not sure how here status was brought to the attention of the authorities. So to enforce this law, would the LEO use his best judgement to have probable cause? She has an accent? What would determine probable cause?
Driving across Texas was stopped at an immigration check point and the border patrol looked into my suburban at my four little blonde haired blue eyed girls sitting in the back and inquired "are they all US citizens" I couldn't help but laugh, but that's another story..."This requiring the carrying of 'papers,' we just don't do that in America."
OK, here's a possible solution...Pull a sting at Home Depot, note the contractors trucks picking up 'day laborers', raid the construction site, send the illegals home, sieze the assets of the contractor, i.e. tools, trucks & equipment. They do that for Johns in an effort to curb prostitution and they do it for street buys of illegal drugs...no due process, just straight up seizure. Do the same at resturant kitchens, hotel maid services. etc...seize the assets.
I mow my own lawn, rake my own leaves can't tell if the hispanic man that offered to do this for $100 4x a month is legal or not.
"This Arizona statute amounts to requiring the carrying of 'papers,' " McCreary said. "We just don't do that in America."
I take a lot of heat for my pro-socialism stances from posters spouting about the erosions of freedoms, and this may be an erosion of one of them. Let's look beyond the folks that have come across the southern border. Let's take an example I know about. A co-workers wife was deported back to her native Australia earlier this year. She had over-stayed her visa by YEARS. No one I spoke to knew she was here illegally, she was just a middle class housewife and mother. None of suspected a thing and I am not sure how here status was brought to the attention of the authorities. So to enforce this law, would the LEO use his best judgement to have probable cause? She has an accent? What would determine probable cause?
Driving across Texas was stopped at an immigration check point and the border patrol looked into my suburban at my four little blonde haired blue eyed girls sitting in the back and inquired "are they all US citizens" I couldn't help but laugh, but that's another story..."This requiring the carrying of 'papers,' we just don't do that in America."
OK, here's a possible solution...Pull a sting at Home Depot, note the contractors trucks picking up 'day laborers', raid the construction site, send the illegals home, sieze the assets of the contractor, i.e. tools, trucks & equipment. They do that for Johns in an effort to curb prostitution and they do it for street buys of illegal drugs...no due process, just straight up seizure. Do the same at resturant kitchens, hotel maid services. etc...seize the assets.
I mow my own lawn, rake my own leaves can't tell if the hispanic man that offered to do this for $100 4x a month is legal or not.
drifto77
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Sherman,TX.
- Location
- Wasatch Range
The ACLU lends no credibility to your position, BTW. This organization promotes racism at every turn. They've been mighty quiet on the violation of the civil liberties of Americans who have to deal with the societal and economic fallout that is a byproduct of illegals within our borders.
There is already Federal Law in place that addresses illegal aliens, including those who were here legally but became illegal and are committing a felony by over-staying their visa.
If the US Government would enforce their existing laws, there would be no need for parallel state laws. I agree wholeheartedly with penalizing and imprisoning those who knowingly employ illegals.
The media comparing checkpoints and required papers to what took place in Nazi Germany is as ignorant as it gets.
If I am found within the borders of any foreign country without proper documentation (i.e. in violation of their laws) then I should expect to receive the punishment for this violation.
U.S. Code Title 8:
Section 1324a states: "Any person who knowingly hires/harbors/transports any illegal alien is guilty of a felony punishable by 10 years jail + $2000 fine per illegal alien + forfeiture of the vehicle or property used to commit the crime".
Section 1324c states, "All officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws shall have authority to make arrests for a violation of any provision of this section" (affirmed U.S. v. Perez-Gonzalez 2002 Fed App 0360, 6th Circ.).
Section 1644, same title states, "No local ordinance, rule, or measure shall stop law enforcement officers from enforcement of this section" (affirmed Southern District Court of NY, U.S. v. Rudy Guiliani,1996).
Section 1324c states, "All officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws shall have authority to make arrests for a violation of any provision of this section" (affirmed U.S. v. Perez-Gonzalez 2002 Fed App 0360, 6th Circ.).
Section 1644, same title states, "No local ordinance, rule, or measure shall stop law enforcement officers from enforcement of this section" (affirmed Southern District Court of NY, U.S. v. Rudy Guiliani,1996).
Last edited:
atriot:
Darky
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- 29 Palms, CA
Isn't it a federal law for immigrant to carry their papers on them anyways? If so, it sure would seem that "this carrying of papers" we do do that in America. I know when I travelled to France, I had my US ID and passport on me everywhere I went. When on Oki I had my military ID on me at all times. I have no problem with the idea of non-citizens having some sort of ID that shows they're legal status here.
Boatwrench
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Petaluma, CA
Whoa there cowboys. I have no problem with foriegn nationals having to carry documentation. That is the law. I have no problem with the deportation of persons over staying their welcome (visas) My problem is how do you differentiate those that are here as naturalized citizens but retained their accents. When you ask those Americans for documentation...well...it is easy to draw the 'show me your papers' parallel.
Myself a born and breed US Citizen was stopped at a border patrol checkpoint on I-10 in Texas, driving a vehicle with my military pass sticker, probably wearing a USCG tee-shirt and then asked about citizenship...I wasn't ok with it then, and am not sure I am OK with it now.
We could be on a slippery slope, that's all I'm sayimg.
Myself a born and breed US Citizen was stopped at a border patrol checkpoint on I-10 in Texas, driving a vehicle with my military pass sticker, probably wearing a USCG tee-shirt and then asked about citizenship...I wasn't ok with it then, and am not sure I am OK with it now.
We could be on a slippery slope, that's all I'm sayimg.
Original_MudButt
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- In the eighth dimension
Yes, but see that is one of the tactics of the OBL's....
They jump up and down and whine like little kids and claim "racism" if they find out that a state or city LEO asked someone of the their status... They claim it's a federal issue only and states cannot do anything about illegal aliens....
Then of course when ICE steps in and makes a workplace raid, they change tactics slightly....
They still jump up and down and whine like little kids and claim "racism", but now they claim the U.S. is tearing families apart..... (cough.... bullsh*t.....cough)....
The new AZ law un-shackles local LEO's and allows them to inquire as to someone' status in this country.....
Here's the thing.... As it stands now, when a LEO in AZ makes contact with anyone for any reason, they are not allowed to ask about their satus because it's a federal issue....
The OBL's would have you believe that as soon as the law goes into effect, there will be hoards of cops with torches and pitchforks hunting illegal aliens. Or they will set up in groups behind bushes or cars and jump on the first unsuspecting passer by screaming "SHOW ME YOUR PAPERS!!"
Not gonna happen. Cops in AZ got better things to do.
All this new law does, is allow local law enforcement, when making contact with an individual, finally be able ask one simple question.....
"Are you in this country legally?"
Until that law goes into effect they cannot ask. Thus the government's 287 g program.....
scottmcneal
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- not here
They ask me every time i come back from AZ...OH, when i go to the dunes they ask me to..I say yes i am and i move along..They are doing there job..
Darky
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- 29 Palms, CA
If your a citizen, all you need is a license/ID. I have no problem with that. I don't see the problem with asking if you're a citizen either. :dunno:
joe_peters
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Grants Pass, OryGun
Same Progressive Socialist "the sky is falling" crap they scream against "Castle Doctrine" laws and "Right to Carry" laws and their insane claims of "Global Warming" and "Man-Made Global Climate Change".
