L.A.p.d.

[8Mud]

I´ve been saying for close to thirty years, the LAPD is broken and needs fixing. The L.A. County Sherriffs department is worse. Like somebody has been puting steroids in the doughnuts or something.
The last time I checked, there were 3 actionable complaints a day, for the Sheriffs Department and the Sheriffs Department, actually isn´t that large. The number of actionable complaints is probably a very minor fraction of the actual incidences.
You can rationalize what they do, but seriously, people are people and the people in LA, can´t be that much worse or that different from other people, that they require having to put up with the LAPD and Sherriffs Dept. tactics.
I´ve been pulled over and harrased, more times in a month in LA, than in thirty years here. In fact I´ve never been pulled over here. Have been stopped at a few drunk checks, have had a few radar tickets. Have had the police over twice, both times pretty minor stuff, they just scowled at me a bit and left. Traveled coast to coast in the states numerous times by road. Rarley ever, to never, had any problems, except in So. Cal and L.A. in particular. I just think so much of the crap, is just so unecessary.
Some policeman here, firing 50 rounds into a car, because the driver failed to stop, is about as likely as an asteroid strike. The Police firing 60 rounds into a house, is probably less likely, with an infant inside, close to zero. The Police, beating the heck out of anybody trying to run away, is highly unlikely. They figure if they are fleeing, at least they aren´t attacking and the reward for fleeing is actually, less likelyhood of a beating or being shot. If you get stupid with a German cop, he´ll sure enough put some knots on your head, but they sure don´t go looking for it. Police here in Germany that screw the pooch, find themselves civilians jiffy quick. If a policeman here, beat up a carload of illegal aliens, because he was having a bad day. He´d be in court the next day facing charges, shortly a civilian and in serious chit.
I´m sure not saying everything German is better, but most ways, there law inforcement policies, just seem to work better. German Police, work hard, at not teeing of the population, a whole lot less chance of teeing off somebody enough to want to shot at them. The only real improvement, I can think of, is if there were a few more police, they are kind of understaffed.
Don´t think you´d find many people in L.A. wishing for more cops?
But when the fit hits the shan, the German police, seem to handle it OK.

 

[drifto77]

I do agree. German Police got it going on!

Just DONT f-with 'em ..... Or else.......

 

[Dirt]

I don't have experience with either of these places. I know America is fuc#ed up but this is my home an there's no place else like it. I've been out of the country on more than one occasion for pleasure and the places in Europe an Mexico were nice but there's no feeling like coming home. I would imagine the cops in LA are highly HIGHLY stressed out. they have to deal not only with illegles like you stated above but what about the hippies? Imagine a profession where every one hates you as soon as you clock in. I'm not a fan of cops God knows I've had my run ins with them. I'm just saying those guys out there have to be on edge because they're under so much more scrutiny than anywhere else. Thanks for the info though I'll definatley stay the f#ck out of So Cal.

 

[8Mud]

What I was trying to say was, most of it seems to be institutional, policy or just the way they operate. Young cop comes in and is screwed up by the old timers. The CHP operates right next to them and often right through the middle of them and are generally courtious, even if they are dealing with a hippie or whatever.
The way the LApd and the Sheriffs office operate always reminds me of the story of the guy who was trying to house break his dog, he asked for advice and a friend told him to stick his dogs nose in his mistake, scold him and put him outside. A couple of weeks later, the friend asks how the housebreaking is going and the guy said not well. I did like you said stuck his nose in it, scolded him and threw him out the window. Now he craps on the floor, sticks his nose in it and jumps out the window.
The system is flawed, the goals are clear, the method is flawed.
Or the kid who comes down for breakfast and asks his Mom for some firggin corn flakes, his mother slaps him across the mouth. Dad comes down and asks what all the crying is about and the kid says i don´t really know, but whatever you do, don´t ask for cornflakes. Or the goals are unclear and the methode is correct.
Whatever the LAPD are doing, it isn´t working, hasn´t worked in over thirty years or so.
As far as hippies go, I´ve got a beard and as far as I´m concered if God wanted me to have naked face, he would have given me teats. Really shouldn´t make much of a difference.
Had a boss tell me to shave, it was a dominance thing, I´d been working for the company for ten years with a beard, he was the new alpha leader. I came in the next day and he said, I thought I told you to shave, I said I did, my armpits, my chest and my crotch. You really can´t expect happy compliance, if you begin every day with attitude.
Shooting 60 rounds at a house, over period of three hours, with some guy gone postal, in the house with his infant daughter, sounds dumb. They reportedly killed him and his daughter. Broken system at best, probable incompetance. At the end of the whole thing, the commisioner comes on TV and says he is behind his police one hundred percent. Wonder what he would have said, if he was the hostage.
Recently here in Germany, some guy took a hostage and the police followed him around for most of two days, he finally got tired and gave up. Whats the rush?

 

[nhrocker]

Or the kid who comes down for breakfast and asks his Mom for some firggin corn flakes, his mother slaps him across the mouth. Dad comes down and asks what all the crying is about and the kid says i don´t really know, but whatever you do, don´t ask for cornflakes.

Had a boss tell me to shave, it was a dominance thing, I´d been working for the company for ten years with a beard, he was the new alpha leader. I came in the next day and he said, I thought I told you to shave, I said I did, my armpits, my chest and my crotch.

:laugh: LMAO! I feel the same way about hair, I won't shave just for a job. I'll have to remember that the next time someone tells me to shave!

 

[Kejtar]

Umm what brought this on? and when was the last time you were in LA?

 

[Danno]

we had a Detroit cop move to Tennessee and take a job at a small rural county. He didn't last long cuz he was use to having to pull his weapon on most every stop they made. People here aren't use to that. The inner city where he use to work was really crime laden and they needed to pull their weapon just to stay alive. L.A. is no different. You have to police a neighborhood that has a lot of crime then you suspect everyone. There is no winning the crime war in L.A. and the best they can do is try and keep the lid on it. The gangs have better weapons than the cops. I could see it coming 30 years ago and decided I didn't want to raise a family in that environment and left for Tennessee. The culture in this country is such that we don't respect the law and therefore they don't trust us either. The cops in Great Britain use to not carry weapons because they didn't need to. Last pix I saw the bobbies in London were packing H&K MP-5s.

 

[8Mud]

Saw the report on one of the alphabet news channels this morning, about the LAPD shooting an 18 month old baby.
Or the guy who had fifty bullet holes in his car, because he failed to stop when a cop tried to pull him over. He said he was affraid of the police, guy sure enough has a point.
Westminister, as I remember, is a bit up scale. Been awhile since I´ve been back to LA. Hadn´t much seen a Cop in years, drove cross country, no sooner got into LA county and a cop pulled me over, asked where I was going, dumped my ashtray on the floor looking for roaches, embarrased me in front of my kids. I did a U trun, tanked up and changed my vacation plans to Arizona.
Came back from Nam, was walking my dog on the beach, Cop comes up and tells me I´m tresspassing, He says leave now, I said OK as soon as I get my dog, he says now. I ignored him and went after my dog, him and four of his buddies, fractued my skull, broke my check bone, knocked out a couple of teeth and then lied to the judge, said that I´d attacked them. Never saw my dog again. Decided to go back to Nam, LA wasn´t safe.
I´ve just got a hard on for the Police in general, I look like kind of a hard case and it messes with there testoserone levels. Though to tell you truth, I´m probably the kind of nieghbor you´d want. If you didn´t mind a few Jeeps in the driveway, in various states of repair.

 

[dyna]

Dont feel left out. In our neck of the woods its the same. The sheriffs dept had 4 in custody deaths in less than 2 years. Last one was an unarmed 150 lb man face down in the dirt and 6 sheriffs on top sqeezing the life out of him as he said "stop I cant breath" This is all on tape recorded by a witness. They all walked every time. Shits out of control IMO. I think these people forgot who pays their paychecks, you and me with our taxes.
I remember when I lived in LA, my neighbor became a sheriff, he would swing by on his way home in his uniform in his own car, armed,but sheriff shirt off and always had a beer between his legs. Asd a kid he was typically jacked up on something.
As much as I hate lawyers imagine the shit they would get away with if nobody was against them or for rights.

 

[ECKSJAY]

Saw the report on one of the alphabet news channels this morning, about the LAPD shooting an 18 month old baby.

Lemme Paul Harvey this one for ya...

There were several exchanges, only one of which actually involved the hostage-taker holding the 18 month old baby while exchanging gunfire with the police. It's UNCLEAR AT THE MOMENT whether the distraught man shot his baby or it was the cops. Before the armchair quarterbacking can begin we need to wait for the balllisiticians and coroners to do their jobs.

And now you know....the REST of the story.

 

[Kejtar]

Saw the report on one of the alphabet news channels this morning, about the LAPD shooting an 18 month old baby.
Or the guy who had fifty bullet holes in his car, because he failed to stop when a cop tried to pull him over. He said he was affraid of the police, guy sure enough has a point.
Westminister, as I remember, is a bit up scale. Been awhile since I´ve been back to LA. Hadn´t much seen a Cop in years, drove cross country, no sooner got into LA county and a cop pulled me over, asked where I was going, dumped my ashtray on the floor looking for roaches, embarrased me in front of my kids. I did a U trun, tanked up and changed my vacation plans to Arizona.
Came back from Nam, was walking my dog on the beach, Cop comes up and tells me I´m tresspassing, He says leave now, I said OK as soon as I get my dog, he says now. I ignored him and went after my dog, him and four of his buddies, fractued my skull, broke my check bone, knocked out a couple of teeth and then lied to the judge, said that I´d attacked them. Never saw my dog again. Decided to go back to Nam, LA wasn´t safe.
I´ve just got a hard on for the Police in general, I look like kind of a hard case and it messes with there testoserone levels. Though to tell you truth, I´m probably the kind of nieghbor you´d want. If you didn´t mind a few Jeeps in the driveway, in various states of repair.

While you make quite a few good points in general, I have to say that you are too removed from the situation (problem?) to be in a position to criticize. I've read about the baby being shot and actually I think I would have to side with the cops there: the way I understand what happened was that they refrained from shooting couple times even though they were shot at, until a civilian was endangered by the shooting. In all honesty, what would you do if you had an idiot (IIRC he was on drugs or drunk out of his mind) with a gun in hand shooting at everything in sight? Yeah he had a baby in his arms, but that doesn't mean he should be let to roam free.
German cops..... hmmmm I remember a run in with them after a punk rock concert a while ago (10 years or so). There was a fight in the crowd and someone got stabbed I think. When the cops showed up (in full riot gear) to the concert they pacified everything in sight. They didn't care if you were walking or running, or standing, they just went through the crowd in a matter of minutes. Am I pissed about it? Yeah, cause it was not too fun being one of those who got pacified. Do I think they were right though in what they did? I think so, as the crowd quieted down in no time and all the scuffles stopped.
Anyways, getting back to your experience after Nam: it was a different time and I don't think that you can really compare that to what is going on now.Remi
P.S. I agree though that cops need to learn how to shoot better as they seem to always shoot and hit everything but their target.

 

[Kejtar]

Lemme Paul Harvey this one for ya...

There were several exchanges, only one of which actually involved the hostage-taker holding the 18 month old baby while exchanging gunfire with the police. It's UNCLEAR AT THE MOMENT whether the distraught man shot his baby or it was the cops. Before the armchair quarterbacking can begin we need to wait for the balllisiticians and coroners to do their jobs.

And now you know....the REST of the story.

Well said!

 

[ECKSJAY]

Well said!

Thanks...

Just woke up so I wanted to make sure I spelled 'ballistician' corrctly. Didn't realize I put three 'l's in it.

 

[red91]

Lemme Paul Harvey this one for ya...

There were several exchanges, only one of which actually involved the hostage-taker holding the 18 month old baby while exchanging gunfire with the police. It's UNCLEAR AT THE MOMENT whether the distraught man shot his baby or it was the cops. Before the armchair quarterbacking can begin we need to wait for the balllisiticians and coroners to do their jobs.

And now you know....the REST of the story.

wow....an LEO, and a commentary specialist! DAMN. :worship:

 

[8Mud]

I hear this stuff and go kind of ballistic, it sure seems it´s business as usual, no matter what ballistician says (isn´t a ballistician somebody who plays the ballalika). I´m not a believer in making new burearocracy, but maybe the LApd shouldn´t be investigating itself,
Seems like after all these years they´d catch on. They drive many of the people with the will or the means out of the city and whats left, is often the bottom of the barrel.
I kind of miss the old place on occasion, but not enough to risk paying big bucks, for a bad taste in my mouth, to go visit again.
I´m thinking of Idaho, how are the cops in Idaho? Rednecks don´t bother me much, I fit right in.
I used to shoot next to the Police at a range in LA. They´d look at my target and get a look on there faces. like they´d ate something bad.
Though my Dad could shoot pretty darned well, pretty close to olympic level, he was a cop, so was my mother, but she wasn´t much good with a handgun, but could shot a rifle, single shot 22 at a running rabbit and hit it most every time.

 

[ECKSJAY]

I hear this stuff and go kind of ballistic, it sure seems it´s business as usual, no matter what ballistician says (isn´t a ballistician somebody who plays the ballalika). I´m not a believer in making new burearocracy, but maybe the LApd shouldn´t be investigating itself,
Seems like after all these years they´d catch on. They drive many of the people with the will or the means out of the city and whats left, is often the bottom of the barrel.
I kind of miss the old place on occasion, but not enough to risk paying big bucks, for a bad taste in my mouth, to go visit again.
I´m thinking of Idaho, how are the cops in Idaho? Rednecks don´t bother me much, I fit right in.
I used to shoot next to Police at a range in LA. They´d look at my target and get a look on there faces. like they´d ate something bad.
Though my Dad could shoot pretty darned well, pretty close to olympic level, he was a cop, so was my mothjer, but she wasn´t much good with a handgun, but could shot a rifle, single shot 22 at a running rabbit and hit it most every time.

I wish I had the energy to read every post of yours...I really do. However, because of my ability to articulate the English language I read your comma-ridden sentences the way a morbidly obese man would speak after seeing a Snickers commercial.

 

[Kejtar]

I hear this stuff and go kind of ballistic, it sure seems it´s business as usual, no matter what ballistician says (isn´t a ballistician somebody who plays the ballalika). I´m not a believer in making new burearocracy, but maybe the LApd shouldn´t be investigating itself,
Seems like after all these years they´d catch on. They drive many of the people with the will or the means out of the city and whats left, is often the bottom of the barrel.
I kind of miss the old place on occasion, but not enough to risk paying big bucks, for a bad taste in my mouth, to go visit again.

They didn't drive you out: you chose to leave. If you want change, you should work towards it, not complain about lack of it. As Eksjay said: armchair quarterbacking is very easy.

 

[8Mud]

I wish I had the energy to read every post of yours...I really do. However, because of my ability to articulate the English language I read your comma-ridden sentences the way a morbidly obese man would speak after seeing a Snickers commercial.

Sorry my smell checker and grammar program are in German. And most of my writing has either been tech. speak or spot reports.
My mouth is closed ( insert comma here) I have removed the comma key from my key board and I will slink quietly away into the distance. :wave:

 

[Eagle]

Lemme Paul Harvey this one for ya...

There were several exchanges, only one of which actually involved the hostage-taker holding the 18 month old baby while exchanging gunfire with the police. It's UNCLEAR AT THE MOMENT whether the distraught man shot his baby or it was the cops. Before the armchair quarterbacking can begin we need to wait for the balllisiticians and coroners to do their jobs.

And now you know....the REST of the story.

I believe in the final exchange, also, he had run out of the house and was firing indiscriminately at the officers while holding the baby. I'm not particularly famous as an LEO-lover, but in this instance I think the cops were handed a no-win situation. They had tried waiting the guy out. He bolted. If he had just run to his truck and started driving, we could have had an instant replay of OJ and the white bronco, but when the guy is running around and spraying bullets all over the neighborhood, they pretty much have to take a shot. And he wasn't a stationary target, so all the arm chair quarterbacks who are complaining that "a good sniper could have taken him out with a single head shot" don't have a clue.

This was just an exceptionally unfortunate incident.

 

[GSequoia]

I can't say much on the current issue except to say that it will be a major shit storm.

As for LAPD/LASD how 'bout some history. I'm not sure if it's still like, so take it with a grain of salt. The Sheriff's department's idea of training at least used to be stick new deputies in the jails for a period of time as guards. Problem being that just gets them in the "Everybody is scum" mentality. In my experience in the L.A. area it is the Sheriffs who are usually most likely to harass you in particular neighborhoods (by that I mean certain divisions are more notorious than others). I haven't had any problems with the LAPD but they are no angels of course.

I can't tell you why you've had more negative police experience in Los Angeles than other parts of the world. I had a fair amount of negative experience shortly after I started driving, that all came down to being in a nice neighborhood in an ugly car, that was in the city of Torrance.

One last point in my pointless post. I have never had a problem with the CHP at all. Every single officer I've dealt with (I've witnessed a lot of accidents) has been courteous and helpful, I cannot say the same for LAPD and LASD officers that I have dealt with in the same capacity. Also I have only had one slightly negative experience with the Redondo Beach Police Department, that being pulled over because I had a legal temporary operating permit. The officer did not get me out of the vehicle to search me though, so it wasn't as bad as I was expecting (Torrance trained me ).

It's tough to say why things shake out like they do. I just get tired of people who say that LAPD/LASD are problematic because Los Angeles is an inherently worse place than other major cities, it simply is not true.

Sequoia