front dana 60 parts list for build?

[RWKHausSupply]

Ok well searching did nothing here and one PBB it was a too many hits type reply.

I am now ready to sell off my super fully polished D30 and now dont know where to go. HP D60 I feel is where I want to go, but questions are numerous.

Will a HP60 fit in the front with only 6.5" of lift, or will it interfere with the Exh. or oil pan or?

I hear all this about Ford and only certain yrs. All I know is non cast in mounts? Right?

What do I do about knuckles? High steer right. So can any outer be machined for arms? or just certain ones?

Who makes the least expensive arms?

What do I do for brakes? Specifics please. I am ignorant on this.

the center section of this can be welded correct? Its cast? so pre/post heating right?

What hubs? I was told stock spicer 35sp axles are even a million or at least close to, stronger then my chromo D30 axles? So 35 spline? Are stock 35sp? In other words can I go down and get some stock axles from my local axle shop I use?

What is the difference of the SRW and DRW axles? What are the WMS of these?

And more better then any thing.. Web pages that contain this info is MUCH appriciated..

Thanks

 

[Matt S.]

I cant add much more than this. I helped a guy swap dodge d60s with a 4.5" lift. it was really freaking tight clearances, but it was ok i guess.

Why not look at a 609?

 

[cracker]

Robert,

Will a HP60 fit in the front with only 6.5" of lift, or will it interfere with the Exh. or oil pan or?

6.5" should be fine. The axle will have to go forward some. I would run a three link (UCA on the passenger side) to help out with the tight fit.

the center section of this can be welded correct? Its cast? so pre/post heating right?

You will NOT have to weld to the cast if you do it this way . I have about 7" and the 609 pushed WAY forward fits good (UCA on the passenger side as well).

What do I do about knuckles? High steer right. So can any outer be machined for arms? or just certain ones?

If you go kingpin to start, knuckles are done you just need the high steer arms

What do I do for brakes? Specifics please. I am ignorant on this.

As far as brakes I run the Chevy 1/2 ton stuff with simple caliper brackets.

What hubs? I was told stock spicer 35sp axles are even a million or at least close to, stronger then my chromo D30 axles? So 35 spline? Are stock 35sp? In other words can I go down and get some stock axles from my local axle shop I use?

I thought a recent mag mentioned that a stock spicer 35 spline shaft was twice as strong as an alloy D44 stub :dunno:

If you go kingpin you will be stuck with hub. With ball joints you have the option of unit bearings.

Some good info on which axle to buy (get the 78-79 Ford stuff)
http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/Dana60.htm

Here is all my stuff I had to acquire in order to get it all running:

-Avery

 

[heapxj]

I am putting an F350 Dana 60 from a '79 in my XJ and the only problem I forsee is the center section hitting the trac bar mount when compressed. This is no big deal. I have a Rusty's TB mount. I'm just going to cut it and mount the trac bar higher in it.

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

look up Bill A Vista's Dana 60 bible on google or Pirate. There is a lot of information there. I'll see what I can post from my brain.

Stock Ford front Dana 60's are drivers drop and high pinion. Stock Dodge (older) and Chevy Dana 60 front axles are passenger drop and low pinion. I believe newer Dodge trucks use a drivers drop low pinion Dana 60 with a passenger side axle disconnect, ball joints and unit bearings, but I'm no expert on these.

High pinion cases are maxed out a 5.38:1 gears. Low pinion cases can go way low like 7.17:1 or something.

Older kingpin axles from Dual Rear Wheeled vehicles use front wheel hubs that place the wheel mounting surface way offset to the outside. One can replace these wheel hubs with units from a single rear wheeled vehicle. I don't know how the wheel mounting surfaces differ between DRW and SRW late model unit bearing axles.

Late model Dodge and Ford Dana 60 front axles are ball joint and use unit bearings. I believe Ford's changed from king pin to ball joint around 1990.

On king pin axles, one can use Ford or Chevy/Dodge steering knuckles. The ford units use a shorter outer axle stub but are supposedly weaker than the Chevy units. The ford outer steering knuckles use a bolt on caliper mount that mounts huge dual piston calipers. They are heavy and many folks switch to some other sort of brake. I'm not real familiar with the various braking options, but I believe the simplest method is to use flat plates (like those shown on Avery's pictures) that mount 1/2 Ton Chevy calipers which are cheap effective, and abundant. Going this route, one can reduce the size of the braking components and more easily fit 15" wheels over the big Dana 60 steering knuckles as well as reduce weight.

Stock king pin style axles used 30 spline outer axle shafts. I think the only stock 35 spline outer axle shafts were from Dana 70 axles and are Chevy/Dodge length. The aftermarket now makes alloy Ford and Chevy length 35 spline shafts. The late model Dodge unit bearing outer axle shafts are 33 spline I believe and nobody makes alloy commercially available replacements. A few California boys on here had Jack make them some custom alloy units for their projects though.

All stock Dana 60 wheel hubs (unit bearing or king pin style) use 8 bolt wheels. Both styles can be modified to mount 6 on 5.5 or 5 on 5.5 wheels.

Parts Mike's web site has some good pictures and information on it.

Dynatrac is now making spindles/hubs/lockouts/outer axle shafts for king pin axles that are significantly shorter than stock parts. I don't know what they cost, but I'm pretty sure it is a LOT!

Late Model Ford Ball Joint axles use lockout hubs with a unit bearing. Late Model Dodge ball joint axles do not use lockout hubs.

I would say if money is no object, the best axle would be made from custom aftermarket parts. Avery's project is one good way to go. Custom 9" housing, aftermarked inner knuckles, True Hi 9 center section, 35 spline axle shafts with Dana 60 sized u-joints, aftermarket steering knuckles, Ford spindles, Ford wheel hubs (modified to 5 on 5.5 bolt pattern), aftermarket drive slugs, Chevy 1/2T calipers, custom caliper mount, and whatever rotor works with the hubs, caliper mount, and caliper. If he used Unit bearing/Ball joint outers that would have been a great way to go too.

I think all the information I presented is accurate and a good start for you. Jeff

 

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Ok well searching did nothing here and one PBB it was a too many hits type reply.

I am now ready to sell off my super fully polished D30 and now dont know where to go. HP D60 I feel is where I want to go, but questions are numerous.

Will a HP60 fit in the front with only 6.5" of lift, or will it interfere with the Exh. or oil pan or?

I hear all this about Ford and only certain yrs. All I know is non cast in mounts? Right?

Reply:Ford front 60's are high pinion. Up till something like 1990, they were king pin. After that, they were ball joint. I believe when they went ball joint they went to unit bearings, but I'm not positive on that. The Ford unit bearing front HP Dana 60's retained the lockout hub feature. Dodge unit bearing front 60's did away with the lockout hub. :Reply

What do I do about knuckles? High steer right. So can any outer be machined for arms? or just certain ones?

Reply: The stock king pin steering knuckles can have a high steer arm bolted on top of them without modification. Ball joint knuckles require work and I believe there are multiple ways to modify them. Aftermarket knuckles also use various methods. Some of the kin pin knuckles use a keyed high steer arm and some use extra bolts. :Reply

Who makes the least expensive arms?

What do I do for brakes? Specifics please. I am ignorant on this.

Reply: Stock king pin Ford axles used large dual piston calipers with bolt on caliper mounts. Stock Chevy king pin axles used a larger version of the 1/2Ton style caliper I believe. I think either of these king pin steering knuckles can have custom caliper brackets bolted to them that allow for 1/2 T calipers to mount up. I believe one has to run a different rotor (most likely 5 on 5.5) with a modified wheel hub with this setup. The advantage is lighter weight and ability to fit 15" wheels. :Reply

the center section of this can be welded correct? Its cast? so pre/post heating right?

What hubs? I was told stock spicer 35sp axles are even a million or at least close to, stronger then my chromo D30 axles? So 35 spline? Are stock 35sp? In other words can I go down and get some stock axles from my local axle shop I use?

What is the difference of the SRW and DRW axles? What are the WMS of these?

And more better then any thing.. Web pages that contain this info is MUCH appriciated..

Thanks

 

[vetteboy]

Yep, that all sounds pretty good to me.

I'll just add that the stock Spicer 35-spline D70 outers are pretty much a direct swap into a Chevy/Dodge spindle setup. It's the same u-joint, same spindle bearing, just doesn't neck down after the bearing like the 30-spline ones. Then you find some 35-spline drive slugs (or Warn makes 35-spline premium lockouts) and you're good to go.

The passenger drop axles aren't a terrible way to go, as it'll clear up a lot of space by the panhard area on the frame. With a hi-steer arm on the passenger side you'll end up mounting the drag link high enough that you can raise the panhard mount on the axle up to clear the diff easily. Then it's not the worst thing in the world to clearance the passenger floor a little bit to clear a non-flipped D300, and you'll have twin stick capability too.

The older Dodge axles generally are harder to build around...the section of tube on the passenger side is really small and kind of hard to get a LCA mount on. Also the factory setting between caster & pinion angle puts the pinion the lowest out of the 3. They use external hubs or drive flanges which stick out more than Ford or Dodge ones.

However, the large single-piston brakes from Chevy or Dodge aren't a bad choice...they're a little lighter than the Ford dual-piston ones, and if you have 16" wheels it's a non-issue.

Depending on where you locate the axle it'll probably be difficult to run full hi-steer....the best I was able to do was a crossover with the tie rod over the knuckle. Otherwise the tie rod and pitman arm would be all over each other (and that's at about 8" lift).

 

[RWKHausSupply]

I cant add much more than this. I helped a guy swap dodge d60s with a 4.5" lift. it was really freaking tight clearances, but it was ok i guess.

Why not look at a 609?

I would do the spidertrax but I dont have the couple grand to get the hi9 center section.

I should be able to get away with the whole HP60 for that. If I just wait and get what I can when I find it at "have to sell" prices.

 

[xjkevin]

i used this site and bella vistas to find my axles. hope it helps.http://medusa.ih8mud.com/cruiser/D60HD/D60.html

 

[cracker]

I am putting an F350 Dana 60 from a '79 in my XJ and the only problem I forsee is the center section hitting the trac bar mount when compressed. This is no big deal. I have a Rusty's TB mount. I'm just going to cut it and mount the trac bar higher in it.

You'll have to push the axle forward some and push the trackbar bracket forward on the frame rail in order for it to work then you may run into pitman arm complications. You can always place a decent bend in the track bar to help out with clearance.

 

[RWKHausSupply]

You'll have to push the axle forward some and push the trackbar bracket forward on the frame rail in order for it to work then you may run into pitman arm complications. You can always place a decent bend in the track bar to help out with clearance.

So.. WHat forces the move so far forward? And doesnt that further effect the spring bowing.

Is it true that a 9" front housing has the same size issues as the D60HP? I mean hell a 9" housing with outers welded on it is only 550$, but then I would only be able to afford a LP style center.

 

[cracker]

So.. WHat forces the move so far forward? And doesnt that further effect the spring bowing.

The size of the diff is quite large and by moving it forward, it allows you an easier time on getting it under there (you mentioned 6.5").

Is it true that a 9" front housing has the same size issues as the D60HP? I mean hell a 9" housing with outers welded on it is only 550$, but then I would only be able to afford a LP style center.

I think the 60 is still larger but the 9" is still impressivly large (over a gallon of diff fluid in the Spidertrax :shocked: )

I would NEVER do a LP in the front. Remember the limited range of (rotational) motion that a CV drive shaft has coming from the TC. Better yet, remove the drive line from the pinion yolk and let the drive line hang. Now where it hangs is a rough estimate of the lowest the diff can flex down to. Now imagine the pinion being 2.25" lower (for a dana 60 and 4.5" with a ford 9"!!!) than a high pinion and you eat up a good chunk of the drivers side suspension droop.

 

[vetteboy]

Here is a shot of mine at its closest. Frame side panhard mount is in the stock location still.

And from the side...

Remember the limited range of (rotational) motion that a CV drive shaft has coming from the TC...

This is assuming that you're going to continue using a CV at the front output. The CV doesn't necessarily guarantee you a better operating angle, only smoother action at more extreme angles. With a single 1410 at the t-case output you can get 37 degrees, and that's what it's rated for...with some grinding you can get about 40 or so. Most CV's aren't capable of this kind of travel unless you get into the really high-dollar stuff (the High Angle Driveline 1350 CV is only good for 32 degrees).

Then there's the axle side to consider - a 1310 or 1410 joint on the axle gives you a ton more angle to play with than a 1350.

edit: The above really only applies to those running lockout hubs, or those who don't spend a lot of time at high speed.

 

[RWKHausSupply]

ok well heres the next question though....

Isnt the D44HP smaller in size and fit better in the front? If so why would I not just get one, then put on some D60 inner and outers and build it like a 60 with the 35sp arb or ?

Just askin...

 

[cracker]

ok well heres the next question though....

Isnt the D44HP smaller in size and fit better in the front? If so why would I not just get one, then put on some D60 inner and outers and build it like a 60 with the 35sp arb or ?

Just askin...

You can. That is what Jeff 98XJ WI is doing.

 

[vetteboy]

<edited for SPOBI>

Other than that, sure, you can go as nuts as you want for outer hardware. It just becomes a matter of the limit of your budget and patience, and if you mind having your R & P become the weak link.

 

[RWKHausSupply]

You can. That is what Jeff 98XJ WI is doing.

So is the housing that much smaller dia?

And I take it that if I get a full width D44HP that I could have enough material to just cut the inner off and then still have enough tube left to have a D60 inner put on? Or would it be necc. to have all new tubes put in?

This sounds like it might be a better fit and cheaper really? As well as much better ground clearance (if one wasnt to shave the crap out of a D60), then the D60?

 

[RWKHausSupply]

As far as I know, you can only go up to 4.56 for the HP44, so that might screw with any gearing plans.

Other than that, sure, you can go as nuts as you want for outer hardware. It just becomes a matter of the limit of your budget and patience, and if you mind having your R & P become the weak link.

It looks like 5.13 is avail?

 

[cracker]

So is the housing that much smaller dia?

And I take it that if I get a full width D44HP that I could have enough material to just cut the inner off and then still have enough tube left to have a D60 inner put on? Or would it be necc. to have all new tubes put in?

This sounds like it might be a better fit and cheaper really? As well as much better ground clearance (if one wasnt to shave the crap out of a D60), then the D60?

I had heard some guys were having problems finding front axle seals. Jeff will shime in and he aslo has a build up thread on here somewhere. I don't know if the 44 ground clearance is that much better than a 9" but it is definitly better than a 60 but just put 42s on there and you'll be good

It looks like 5.13 is avail?

Actually 5.38 is available for the high pinion

 

[vetteboy]

Hmm, it would appear you are correct. And 5.38 for that matter. Guess I need to update my list...

I would imagine that the pinion gets pretty small at that point though.