Calipers: WJ upgrade

[Fred85]

nevermind

 

[Angus]

Let me know what you want me to take pics of. I will send them to whomever or however, but give me instructions on how to post them.

Angus

 

[cherokeekid]

Cobra calipers are PBR dual piston

 

[ECKSJAY]

Cobra calipers are PBR dual piston

http://www.pabst.com/

 

[Talyn]

http://www.pabst.com/

Thats PBC, not PBR

 

[What Rd]

For you guys who have done this conversion - did you use the JKS spacer and standard hubs? Or were any modifications still necessary to the hubs when using the JKS spacer?
And where did you source your knuckles and calipers, yard or parts store or dealer and what did you wind up paying?
thanx!

 

[Angus]

I used the JKS spacer and even though I weld, I had a professional weld them on. I also used the JKS draglink, tie rod, and tracbar axle relocation bracket. The tie rod ends are stock WJ for now, but if I switch to true high steer I will have to get one right hand drive end for the pitman arm end. I bought my knuckles used from an online yard ($100). My rotors are Advance Auto's higer end WJ 2003's with the bolt pattern redrilled. The calipers I used came in a "update kit" from DC ($150). The kit included 2003-up calipers, pads, brackets, and all the small hardware.

One drawback of using the bearing spacer is reduced bearing to knuckle contact or indexing. The three bolts are not realy meant to hold the whole load. In that regaurd I made a bushing thats OD fits snug to the inside of the knuckle. The ID fits snug to the bearing on the inner tappered part of the bearing housing. If anything it makes me feel better that there is now more of a fit to the two parts rather than just atachment.

Angus

 

[Talyn]

I see you have a 2000 XJ. In that case, which hubs dod you use? The 2000 ones or the earlier ones?

-Chris

I used the JKS spacer and even though I weld, I had a professional weld them on. I also used the JKS draglink, tie rod, and tracbar axle relocation bracket. The tie rod ends are stock WJ for now, but if I switch to true high steer I will have to get one right hand drive end for the pitman arm end. I bought my knuckles used from an online yard ($100). My rotors are Advance Auto's higer end WJ 2003's with the bolt pattern redrilled. The calipers I used came in a "update kit" from DC ($150). The kit included 2003-up calipers, pads, brackets, and all the small hardware.

One drawback of using the bearing spacer is reduced bearing to knuckle contact or indexing. The three bolts are not realy meant to hold the whole load. In that regaurd I made a bushing thats OD fits snug to the inside of the knuckle. The ID fits snug to the bearing on the inner tappered part of the bearing housing. If anything it makes me feel better that there is now more of a fit to the two parts rather than just atachment.

Angus

 

[Angus]

I just used 2000 XJ hubs, even though the front end I used was a '92.. I know there are differences in the different years, but I do not know what or when the dates are. I built up the '92 HP D30 so I would have little down time and I did not want the LP that my XJ came with.

Angus

 

[Gojeep]

How much different is the WJ knuckle to the XJ one? What I would like to know if there was any way of keeping the XJ knuckle and making a bracket to suit the WJ calipers? I done some looking into it and a UT V8 4.6 4WD Ford Expedition has the same 305 diameter and thickness but has a larger hub hole ( 82 verses 72 mm WJ ) and offset ( 56.5 verses 64 mm WJ & 81 mm XJ ). Just wondering if I made a mounting bracket up to carry to the WJ calipers with a offset to carry the different width Ford discs it would mean no re-drilling and a cheaper Ford easy to get discs. Mind you I can get PBR calipers cheap here as they are made here and fitted to the Ford Falcons.

 

[PapaPump]

reading all of this and other threads, it sounds like this is kind of a pain in the ass...

of course i guess making that spacer is not as much of a pain as using custom shorter inner shafts, as i have seen in the d44 knuckle conversions

would the wj front end just bolt in? i understand the control arms are wider and that the bolt circle is stupid (as in: weird, WTF couldn't it be 4.5" or 5.5"?), but those aren't that bad...is it low pinion? that would be bad...

okay so the wj axle is not that cool for an upgrade(?) and for the price i could probably get a rubi axle (low pinion )

has anyone tried mustang brakes? the rotors should go on right? except for maybe reboring the hub part...and it dowsn't seem like making a caliper adapter would be that hard either...hmmm

mike

 

[Angus]

I am not familiar with converting Ford parts to XJ's. Since I have done the conversion I am not going to look into it either, sorry. I am happy and justify my setup for several reasons.

1. Larger rotors, calipers, and pads...ie better brakes.
2. Improved steering geometry.
3. Extensive use of off the shelf Jeep parts.
4. Can use easy to find high pinion D30 if you dont already have it. My 2000
did not so I switched to a donor that allowed for very little down time.

I realize that many people can justify a custom D44. Keep in mind on my Jeep it will never get rubber bigger than 33". I don't wheel as often or hard as allot of people. The parts that I might break can easily be replace and installed in a day. This is something important to me as my Jeep is used daily. I did the math and I am cheaper now than trying to get a custom D44 with similar attributes shipped to Kansas.

Angus

 

[What Rd]

One drawback of using the bearing spacer is reduced bearing to knuckle contact or indexing. The three bolts are not realy meant to hold the whole load. In that regaurd I made a bushing thats OD fits snug to the inside of the knuckle. The ID fits snug to the bearing on the inner tappered part of the bearing housing. If anything it makes me feel better that there is now more of a fit to the two parts rather than just atachment.

Angus

This is the aspect of this mod that really gives me pause. Did you turn this bushing out on a lathe? I can't make something like that and haven't seen anyplace to get them. Anyone making these or have some solid dimensions?

 

[gcurtis]

Do a google search on the Hinkley version of the wj upgrade (he is also on ). All of his fab parts are available from JKS mfg and are a direct weld on making this conversion very simple.

 

[Talyn]

http://naxja.org/forum/printthread.php?t=28710

http://www.orgsmfg.com/project/WJinfo.htm

Whats that part about machining the knuckle than using washers to center the caliper?

 

[gcurtis]

Depends which calipers you use. The caliper has to be spaced and washers do the trick.

 

[Talyn]

The people that have done this, have you used a pre 2000 XJ hub or a 2000+ XJ hub, as they are different.

-Chris

 

[Angus]

I used both the JKS spacer to moved the unit bearing out from the knuckle. I also made a bushing/sleeve to gain some knuckle to bearing "fit". I do not remember the demensions, but it's ID is the tapered part of the unit bearing shell. The OD is the ID of the knuckle. The bushing essentialy makes the unit bearings shell one size rather than taper as it does stock. I can try and take some dimensions but you will have to be patient.

Angus

 

[T&A-XJ]

mid 90 and older hubs fit perfect and the shoulder is deep enough (apx.5")to seat tightly in the knuckle past the .25" spacer. This is the best/strongest/safest hub BUT check the lug stud shoulders as they are longer and wider and may not fit through the wheel lug holes. Standard steel wheels may not have this issue but factory alloys will. 2 seconds with a die grinder takes care of it though.

Mid 90 through 2000 or something hubs are thicker from knuckle mounting to rotor mounting and require an apx.25" spacer on the caliper mounting bolts for the rotor to line up correctly. Also these hubs dont have as deep of shoulders to fit past the knuckle spacer so more load is dependent on your welded on to cast spacer and the 3 hub mounting bolts.

This is my 1st hand experiance with both style hubs on 2 different jeeps.

Im not sure on the 2000 or so part difference but I think cast rotors use the mid 90s dimension hub and the composite rotors use the pre 90 dimension hubs.....correct me if wrong.

 

[Talyn]

Im not sure on the 2000 or so part difference but I think cast rotors use the mid 90s dimension hub and the composite rotors use the pre 90 dimension hubs.....correct me if wrong.

Some time in 99 (as some 99s have one hub and some have the other) they change the hub "thickness" I guess you could call it. At teh same time they went to composite rotors. So It would be sometime in 99 to 01 hubs.

-Chris