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Cherokee Turbo Kit

krakhedd

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Buffalo, NY
Hey guys,

Just FYI for you all, I spoke with Zach Steele, the owner of 505 Performance, about the 4.0 turbo kit they offer.

He said if enough people showed interest, they would design a kit for the Cherokee, as opposed to the Wrangler kit they now offer (which requires some modifications to be performed to our XJs).

Also, again FYI, the kit comes with a Split Second fuel management controller, as opposed to the Hesco unit they had been using.

Let's get a group together guys, and they can build a kit for us - anybody interested?
 
krakhedd said:
Hey guys,

Just FYI for you all, I spoke with Zach Steele, the owner of 505 Performance, about the 4.0 turbo kit they offer.

He said if enough people showed interest, they would design a kit for the Cherokee, as opposed to the Wrangler kit they now offer (which requires some modifications to be performed to our XJs).

Also, again FYI, the kit comes with a Split Second fuel management controller, as opposed to the Hesco unit they had been using.

Let's get a group together guys, and they can build a kit for us - anybody interested?

Do they have a CARB EO number for California use?
 
http://www.505performance.com/01prod.html

It says it only passes in states that require only a tailpipe test. I'm pretty sure you're excluded, dude - sorry!

The other thing I wanted to let everybody know (I forgot to post it) is that @ 6 psi (mechanical wastegate setting - other settings available), a 4.0 liter is only using roughly 1/3 of the compressor's capacity - Zach said it will make a reliable, across-the-board 20psi on a 4.0. So this means it's a great addition to your stroker kit, too!
 
wonderhow long it takes for the turbo to spool up mounted so far away. would work well with a stroker since you'll have good power off the line anyways.
 
i would be interested if they can make it fit under the hood without modification and without being ridiculously pricey
:Edit: that and work with the renix system!
 
Yeah, another reason for us to band together. The intake on our XJs is mounted on the exhaust side of the motor - meaning a much closer mounting location. Plus, the stock intake mounting location is on the same side as the exhaust - again, a much shorter path.

When I spoke with Zach, he told me he'd send me everything in the kit, minus the exhaust from the turbine housing to the catalytic converter, for $2200. I think this did NOT include shipping, so assuming $200-$300 for shipping, we're looking at $2500 to our doors.

Anyway, if I had any sort of fabrication experience (and money!), I'd just buy the turbo and the fuel management computer, and the oil system lines, and fab up my own headers and exhaust tubing. I'd personally like to run an intercooler as well, though Zach said the intake charge only goes up 80* F (!!!). Pretty good for 6psi of boost!

Do we have any takers? We should organize ourselves and have somebody talk to Zach about it. It can't be that hard to make turbo headers for the XJ! Maybe a little expensive (good idea to ceramic coat them), but I'd expect the XJ system to perform better than the Wrangler one.

EDIT: As far as working with the Renix system, I have no idea what that would entail. Ask Zach - go to the web site above, and click on the "Contact Us" link in the left window. The plumbing should still be the same, so we may still be able to influence him to make a Chrokee-specific kit - maybe just a different fuel management computer is all that's needed for Renix?
 
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I can make that kit for less than half that. So can everyone else with a little research. Start here. I know its mostly Hondas, and most of you hate them, but this is where I learned everything I know about turbos. I have built countless turbo kits for all types of cars. My recently purchased XJ may get boosted in the spring. www.homemadeturbo.com

P.S. there are countless fuel management options from extra injector controllers, air fuel controllers and larger injectors, piggy backs and even stand alone unit. Be selective with your fuel management. Thats the biggest and most important part of a forced induction set up.
 
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20 PSI? Good lord...Forget the pump gas. Better have a pretty good size intercooler in there, too.

I'm not sure if I'd feel safe about taking a 20 PSI turbo set-up away from civilization...
 
with the right tuning you should be able to run pump gas at 20psi on a forged bottom end (like the stroker kit)
 
Yeah, I would love it.

You know my turbo background. I'm well versed in 7m and 2jz Supra stuff. I've got a 7m motor on the stand right now getting forged internals so we can run 2 bar (29 psi).

I'd rather have the aluminum head to keep the smog guy happy.
 
This whole prospect does sound very interesting. I'd like to hear how this comes out. What kinda performance numbers are we looking at here?
 
Well, according to 505, they got c. 90RWHP increase on an otherwise stock motor (no exhaust mods, to TB spacer, no cam, heads, etc.). That's around a 50% improvement - actually more than 50%! In reality though, since their testing was done at 6000ft altitude, you could expect to see at least 65-70RWHP gain (conservative numbers) at sea level (don't forget, the boost is set to ABSOLUTE numbers, not RELATIVE, so if you're at 6000ft altitude and the ambient air pressure is, say, 13psi, you're actually making closer to 7.7psi of boost from the turbo). That's just about 50% RWHP increase (c.135RWHP stock).

That being said, there are numerous upgrades. I've heard the stock 4.0 cam is not at all turbo friendly. Of course the heads barely flow for the stock 4.0, much less a turbo'd and/or stroked one. The catalytic converter breathes like an emphysema patient. And the stock muffler is trash, too. I suspect you could pick up at least 30-35RWHP on top of the 65-70 by addressing these issues. Also, you can get an intercooler, but that'll only be worth around 5HP under the most grueling conditions (although during off-highway use, it would certainly help to maintain the amount of power already available), and if you build your motor right, you can get plenty more boost from the turbo, too - you just need to change the wastegate/blow-off valve (which can be ordered from Zach).

Now, as far as building oneself a turbo kit goes, it certainly could be done. I don't have a clue of the price, but it could be done. However, I've searched high and low for a good turbo for my XJ, and still have not found one. I have researched and reviewed compressor flow maps, etc., and don't care to look any more. The only thing that would influence me to build my own kit is if a Cherokee-specific kit were not made. If I'm going through a mud hole/pond, I don't want my exhaust gases being pumped through a submerged pipe, thus reducing their thermal energy. I would want the turbo mounted about 6-12" from the motor, providing a nice, short, direct path both for the exhaust, and for the intake air. Also, if we get enough people interested in the kit, and get a group buy, then I'm sure the cost would come down considerably also.

As far as Hondas go, the only thing they're good for is mowing lawns. Maybe Jesse James should do that on Monster Garage? Take a rice burner with 2HP @ 2000rpm and 600HP @ 7200rpm, and attach some blades to it. Be pretty gnarly, actually - and then at least it would have the right sound for its application!
 
I built a turbo kit for my xj a while back and I took it off last summerI ran 7psi the horse power gain is there but parking a turbo under the intake makes way to
much heat and it suffers for it in the summer I ran without an intercooler and that was a mistake you dont get unuff air flow to keep the turbo cool and the charge air will easly see over 200 deg Intercooler or sprayer system is a must I was seeing heat in such excess under the hood that I melted my clutch line from 5in away and I insulated everything that was near the turbo also had my fuel line unmold itself from the steel tubing too much heat
here is a link to the thread I started a while back the pics arnt workng but I was assured they would be within a day or so Jack

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=21103&highlight=turbo+4.0
 
N20Jeep said:
with the right tuning you should be able to run pump gas at 20psi on a forged bottom end (like the stroker kit)
You would never get away with 20 psi on pump gas. You would see detonation around 13 -14 lbs of boost and thats with decent ignition timing control.
 
i disagree.....with a properly built bottom end and correct tuning...running 93 octane pump gas would not be an issue...the stroker motor is a lower compression motor and can handle a little bit more boost
 
I used to race a Nissan with a fully built engine and on pump gas I couldn't get more than 15 lbs of boost out of it without some detonation setting in. That engine had 8.5:1 static compression and the tuning was nuts on. At the track I would run 23 to 25 lbs of boost but that took C16 race gas to prevent detonation.

Also, I supercharge Silverado's all day at work that run 7 lbs of boost intercooled with roughly 9:1 compression and even then we see the knock sensors sense some detonation and the PCM will retard timing a few degrees.
 
I didn't say I WOULD run 20psi of boost, merely that the turbo provides enough air to put 20psi into a stock 4.0, right up until red line. I would NOT run this much boost in ANY motor without alcohol injection, or a racing blend of fuel.

That being said, I too have been wondering about the heat. I would definately run an intercooler, but I would also want to replace the stock fans. I have cut hood vents in the XJ - BOY do they help! - but including an intercooler, and the extra heat the turbos will be making, the stock cooling system would be completely inadequate for any sort of off-roading.

I would like to get the turbo, headers, and pretty much everything north of the collector pipe (or whatever connects just past the headers, just before the catalytic converter) ceramic coated. This would serve to minimize the amount of heat lost from the surface area of all the metal, and should help to keep underhood temps down, but would cost quite a bit more. Also, I would have to pretty much seal the truck from the bottom, so that should I be going through a "puddle", my turbine housing doesn't warp or crack.

Lots of variables still. I want to turbo it, but the more I think about it, the more I realize all the obstacles and problems I may encounter, not the least among them being the cost! I still would like to persevere and have a turbo'd stroker, though.....
 
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