York 210 OBA?

[Kingkong0192]

I've been reading a lot about this topic, and i'm more confused now than i was before i started reading.

Before i continued. I have a 1999 Jeep Cherokee 4.0.

The stock A/C in my jeep is a sanden. I was going to convert this, but it doesn't pump out enough volume for my needs. It's all disconnected already. There is no condenser or anything in the Jeep A/C related. I pulled it all out. I'll never use the A/C again.

I'm just trying to figure out how to get a York 210 compressor into an XJ.

I've been reading up on it, and i hear everyone talking about;

- "Putting a V-belt" on the alt to run it"
- "Getting a "Serp Clutch"
- "Go with the spaced pulley on the alt and use that with your clutch on a seperate belt."

I honestly can say i have no clue what any of this means. Can anyone clarify this? What would be the best way for me to get the york 210 into my jeep and pumping out air? I know i need to relocate the battery (this is as simple as extending the "+" and "-" leads and securing the battery somewhere else and reconnecting them, correct?)

Is it possible to remove the stock compressor and put the york there and use my current serp belt on it? Also how would the clutch work? How would i engage the clutch to get the york to pump air?

Either way i plan on putting the york where the stock compressor is and then running 3/8" 1125PSI hydraulic hose from the york all the way over to where the throttle body is and doing all of my piping over on that side. (I read that i needed to move all my fittings at least 4' from the york so the air can cool.) I figured that would be a good approach.

The only thing i think i need to currently buy is a pressure switch. Pictures show everything i currently have to make this work. I have a welder and unlimited scrap metal around so i can fab up a bracket if needed. If i'm missing something, please say something.

The York 210 in the pictures is my friends. I borrowed it from him so i could see where i would mount it. I found another york 210 on ebay with a serp belt clutch on it. I think his is a 2 pulley v-belt? Correct? Which is better? Since i'm going to have to buy my own, which one would you buy?

All piping and fittings are 3/8". Everyone seems to do 1/4" so i figured i'd step it up and do 3/8". All fittings are also stainless steel. The 3/8"x1/4" bushings are for the pressure gauges, pressure switch, etc etc.

Sorry for the lengthy thread, but i think i got everything out there and clear. Thanks to anyone who takes the time to help me figure this out. I will be sure to detail my build and take tons of pictures so people in the future can follow my lead.

Pictures show what i currently have to run this and what it currently looks like under my jeep.

 

[souske]

If you end up going the v belt route, I have one I could sell

 

[johnnyc]

I have a York 210 compressor that I mounted using Kilby's bracket, which places it to the left of the stock compressor. Mounting a York in place of the factory compressor would take some fabrication.

I also got a Kilby alternator pulley, which allows you to run the compressor with a v-belt.

http://kilbyenterprises.com/bracket-kits.htm

The kit for an HO XJ is KE-1700, which is not listed on the website.

 

[Kingkong0192]

If you end up going the v belt route, I have one I could sell

I'm sorry. A V-belt is just a belt, correct? It's not anything else? I think the york i currently borrowed has a v-belt on it, correct? Why is there two pulleys though? I would only need to use one, correct?

I have a York 210 compressor that I mounted using Kilby's bracket, which places it to the left of the stock compressor. Mounting a York in place of the factory compressor would take some fabrication.

I also got a Kilby alternator pulley, which allows you to run the compressor with a v-belt.

http://kilbyenterprises.com/bracket-kits.htm

The kit for an HO XJ is KE-1700, which is not listed on the website.

A lot of fabrication to put it where the stock one goes? As in making another bracket, or what? I'd assume that if i mounted it to the left of the stock compressor i'd be forced to use a V-belt, correct? Does a v-belt simply get power from another pulley welded to the alt pulley?

I seriously know near nothing about this. I'm trying to learn it all right now.

How much is the kirby pulley and the kirby mounting bracket? Do they look that complicated or could i easily make one at home? Do you have any pictures?

If it's not listed on the website, how would i go upon obtaining one?

Thanks for the help to both of you.

 

[Frank Z]

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=939701&highlight=winter&page=5

 

[souske]

Im sorry, I meant a youk with a v-belt clutch on it, not the belt itself

 

[johnnyc]

Here's a pic of the Kilby bracket. You could probably fab one yourself, but I found it easier and quicker to buy one. The Kilby pulley replaces the stock pulley. It still has the serpentine grooves to run the factory belt. And it also has a V-belt groove to run the York.

I don't remember how much the bracket and pulley were, as I bought them several years ago. And you can call them to inquire about the KE-1700.

 

[Kingkong0192]

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=939701&highlight=winter&page=5

Exactly what i want to do minus the copper tubing. I'm using hard pipe instead.

I have a few questions though. What kind of bracket is that, and what does the bracket bolt to?

Also, is that one serpentine belt that attaches to everything on the jeep? (water pump, ps, alt, etc etc.)

My only other question is the electrical side of it. Everyone talks about the clutches. Like souske talking about a v-belt clutch.

How does the clutch know when to engage and how does it know when to disengage? That's the only place i'm lost.

Im sorry, I meant a youk with a v-belt clutch on it, not the belt itself

I think the serpentine method is easier if i can follow franks route. His doesn't look complicated at all.

Here's a pic of the Kilby bracket. You could probably fab one yourself, but I found it easier and quicker to buy one. The Kilby pulley replaces the stock pulley. It still has the serpentine grooves to run the factory belt. And it also has a V-belt groove to run the York.

I don't remember how much the bracket and pulley were, as I bought them several years ago. And you can call them to inquire about the KE-1700.

That also looks really easy to make. Is the alt pulley still on their site? I can't seem to find it anywhere.

The only thing i need to figure out is what makes the clutch engage/disengage. I don't see why it would disengage when the pressure switch kicked off.

 

[johnnyc]

There's a wire on the York. Hook that up to a switch and the battery. Turn the switch on to engage the clutch.

 

[souske]

For engaging/disengaging the clutch, use a pressure switch
i got mine from kilby, but check amazon, they can be had much cheaper

 

[Kingkong0192]

There's a wire on the York. Hook that up to a switch and the battery. Turn the switch on to engage the clutch.

Wow. That just blew my mind quite literally. I thought it was going to be some huge complicated process.

I'm assuming i'd have to wire the pressure switch into that circuit as well so when the pressure hit whatever i set it to the pressure switch would disengage the clutch, correct? That seems simple enough.

For engaging/disengaging the clutch, use a pressure switch
i got mine from kilby, but check amazon, they can be had much cheaper

Will do.

Any thoughts on using a 210 with a serp belt clutch or using one with a v-belt clutch off the alt?

As in what's easier, cheaper, cost efficient, etc etc?

I think the serp belt clutch is the way i want to go, i just need to know what bracket frank used to do that.

I have another question. How do i move the battery? Do i simply just extend the positive and negative terminals with the same gage wire and run it wherever i please? Or do i have to calculate Resistance in the wire and all of that? I kind of want the battery in the rear hatch area, or is that a bad idea?

 

[Kingkong0192]

I thought my Stock Sanden A/C clutch was shot, but i just cut off the wire connector and hit the wire on the positive of the battery and the clutch engaged.

I didn't realize that all i needed to do to get the clutch to engage was trip it out on the postive of the battery. Way simpler than i ever thought.

I just started the jeep up and engaged the clutch, and i just about died laughing. This (picture below) shot out of the compressor and is now on my ceiling. Whoops. Hahaha.

 

[johnnyc]

So now that you know your Sanden works, it would be a good idea to convert it to OBA. Yes, you should also wire in a pressure switch to disengage the clutch when your air tank is full.

 

[Kingkong0192]

So now that you know your Sanden works, it would be a good idea to convert it to OBA. Yes, you should also wire in a pressure switch to disengage the clutch when your air tank is full.

I was originally going to, but i figured i might as well use a york because it has an internal oil system as opposed to the sanden that i need to keep feeding oil.

I'll probably get to piping the sanden to on board air, and then when i buy a york just pull the hoses off the sanden and attach them to the york.

What is the best way to oil a sanden? I've read of many people greasing the internals of them, but i don't like that idea.

I'd rather use an inline oiler, but how exactly does that work? I can't seem to find any information that says how to do it step by step.

Do i put the inline oiler on the intake, and then run an oil return kit from my filter to the inline oiler or it doesn't work like that?

 

[souske]

Air oiler only oils the top end, you need to
keep the sump wet as well

Google: wobble plate motors

Kind of an odd concept,.but a similar design is used to power torpedoes
the compressor is only half of an oba system, converting the sanden, then going to a york was my original plan, but the sanden has worked well enough not to bother with the york

 

[Devilfrog]

The sanden is designed to be "splash oiled" in a sense, in this case distibution is by means of oil and A/C mix and a crankcase full of presurized mix (via the port on the suction cicuit).
With the grease mod, the front bearing usually doesn't get lube (small oiling ports, and grease tending to stay put) and eventually seizes up.
I'm doing the grease mod, plugging the crankcase vent, but going to run oil in the crankcase and vent the body to prevent over pressurizing it.
Will it lead to longer life of my Sanden OBA? Dunno, but when I can get a new Compressor for $20 (what I paid for the one I'm modding, with bracket ... and my stock one is still doing idler duty so I have a spare) I plan to find out.
From what I've read so far the oil route may live longer in the end, if not I'll just grab a couple spares and swap them out as needed.

 

[Kingkong0192]

Air oiler only oils the top end, you need to
keep the sump wet as well

Google: wobble plate motors

Kind of an odd concept,.but a similar design is used to power torpedoes
the compressor is only half of an oba system, converting the sanden, then going to a york was my original plan, but the sanden has worked well enough not to bother with the york

Do you have any pictures of your design? I'm starting to grasp this concept a whole lot better now and i'm beginning to understand it and can picture it.

The sump is in the compressor, correct? How would i oil that? This is why i originally wanted to go with the york due to its internal oil. Would eliminate all of these problems.

How long have you been using that Sanden? Any problems yet?

 

[Frank Z]

Blue....

Exactly what i want to do minus the copper tubing. I'm using hard pipe instead.

I have a few questions though. What kind of bracket is that, and what does the bracket bolt to? I built my own, mounts using the bolts on the A/C compressor and one of the alternator bolts too.

Also, is that one serpentine belt that attaches to everything on the jeep? (water pump, ps, alt, etc etc.) Yep, one belt.

My only other question is the electrical side of it. Everyone talks about the clutches. Like souske talking about a v-belt clutch.
How does the clutch know when to engage and how does it know when to disengage? That's the only place i'm lost. I used an Unloader.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ww...ueryString=FHG12J52X+&submit.x=17&submit.y=10

Not only controls when the compressor comes on, it also relieves the head pressure so the compressor doesn't have to start against 125-150psi of head pressure.

I think the serpentine method is easier if i can follow franks route. His doesn't look complicated at all.



That also looks really easy to make. Is the alt pulley still on their site? I can't seem to find it anywhere.

The only thing i need to figure out is what makes the clutch engage/disengage. I don't see why it would disengage when the pressure switch kicked off.

 

[souske]

I can do pics on monday.

For oiling the wobble plate I drilled and tapped a 1\8 npt port in the compressor body, and whatever oil I have handy once a year or so. At first it was lucas, but lately its been dex III.
been 3 years on the same compressor now with no issues.
the last one I burned up due the sump running dry ( only running an inline oiler back then)

 

[Kingkong0192]

Thank you.

Do you have any pictures of that bracket before you mounted it? I think i could build one myself, i just need to get a picture of someones bracket that worked.

Thanks for the link. I'm going to buy that switch. Do you have a check valve in your setup? I want to have a connection at the front bumper and the rear bumper of my jeep. I made up some custom brackets that should work perfect for that.

Does anyone have a clue on how much pressure the sanden pumps out? How many PSI do most of you let build in your OBA setups?

I plan on following this. (In terms of location of fittings.)

I can do pics on monday.

For oiling the wobble plate I drilled and tapped a 1\8 npt port in the compressor body, and whatever oil I have handy once a year or so. At first it was lucas, but lately its been dex III.
been 3 years on the same compressor now with no issues.
the last one I burned up due the sump running dry ( only running an inline oiler back then)

That works. So you basically drilled a hole straight through the compressor, or no? Do you add oil regulary, or do you have like a nipple coming out of the 1/8 tap that you fill up with oil and the wobble plate sucks it in as it needs it?

Once i get everything figured out, i'm going to do a writeup with pictures and what not, and maybe it will help people in the future out. There is literally no thread that entails everything you need to know.