woke up to this...

Wiser

NAXJA Forum User
Location
92345
turned the tv to msnbc and seen this tid bit of news

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41934769

im hoping we could tap into our oil reserves to ease the pain of $4.00+/gal. At this going rate the price of Unleaded regular will be almost $5.00/gal by this summer. That's something we don't need in our weak economy. Do you guys have any thoughts on this??
 
the idea of using some of the strategic reserve to ease prices is straight out of idiocracy.
its also typical of obama, caving now when its not even $4 yet. i was there for $5/g a gal, and paying that was better than seing our 'strategic reserve' going at $4/g to get suzie and tommy to soccer practice.

YES, some people are hurting, lets help them. but not at the literal cost of national security.q
 
I'm thinking that something can be made out of this.
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20110306/news/703069921

CAMBRIDGE, Mass. — A Massachusetts biotechnology company says it can produce the fuel that runs Jaguars and jet engines using the same ingredients that make grass grow.

Joule Unlimited has invented a genetically-engineered organism that it says simply secretes diesel fuel or ethanol wherever it finds sunlight, water and carbon dioxide.
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The Cambridge, Mass.-based company says it can manipulate the organism to produce the renewable fuels on demand at unprecedented rates, and can do it in facilities large and small at costs comparable to the cheapest fossil fuels.

What can it mean? No less than “energy independence,” Joule’s web site tells the world, even if the world’s not quite convinced.

“We make some lofty claims, all of which we believe, all which we’ve validated, all of which we’ve shown to investors,” said Joule chief executive Bill Sims.

“If we’re half right, this revolutionizes the world’s largest industry, which is the oil and gas industry,” he said. “And if we’re right, there’s no reason why this technology can’t change the world.”

The doing, though, isn’t quite done, and there’s skepticism Joule can live up to its promises.

National Renewable Energy Laboratory scientist Philip Pienkos said Joule’s technology is exciting but unproven, and their claims of efficiency are undercut by difficulties they could have just collecting the fuel their organism is producing.

Timothy Donohue, director of the Great Lakes Bioenergy Research Center at the University of Wisconsin-Madison, says Joule must demonstrate its technology on a broad scale.

Perhaps it can work, but “the four letter word that’s the biggest stumbling block is whether it ‘will’ work,” Donohue said. “There are really good ideas that fail during scale up.”

Sims said he knows “there’s always skeptics for breakthrough technologies.”

“And they can ride home on their horse and use their abacus to calculate their checkbook balance,” he said.

Joule was founded in 2007. In the last year, it’s roughly doubled its employees to 70, closed a $30 million second round of private funding in April and added John Podesta, former White House chief of staff under President Bill Clinton, to its board of directors.

The company worked in “stealth mode” for a couple years before it recently began revealing more about what it was doing, including with a patent last year for its production of diesel molecules from its cyanobacterium. This month, it released a peer-reviewed paper it says backs its claims.

Work to create fuel from solar energy has been done for decades, such as by making ethanol from corn or extracting fuel from algae. But Joule says they’ve eliminated the middleman that’s makes producing biofuels on a large scale so costly.

That middleman is the “biomass,” such as the untold tons of corn or algae that must be grown, harvested and destroyed to extract a fuel that still must be treated and refined to be used. Joule says its organisms secrete a completed product, already identical to ethanol and the components of diesel fuel, then live on to keep producing it at remarkable rates.

Joule claims, for instance, that its cyanobacterium can produce 15,000 gallons of diesel full per acre annually, over four times more than the most efficient algal process for making fuel. And they say they can do it at $30 a barrel.

A key for Joule is the cyanobacterium it chose, which is found everywhere and is less complex than algae, so it’s easier to genetically manipulate, said biologist Dan Robertson, Joule’s top scientist.

The organisms are engineered to take in sunlight and carbon dioxide, then produce and secrete ethanol or hydrocarbons — the basis of various fuels, such as diesel — as a byproduct of photosynthesis.

The company envisions building facilities near power plants and consuming their waste carbon dioxide, so their cyanobacteria can reduce carbon emissions while they’re at it.

The flat, solar-panel style “bioreactors” that house the cyanobacterium are modules, meaning they can build arrays at facilities as large or small as land allows, the company says.

The thin, grooved panels are designed for maximum light absorption, and also so Joule can efficiently collect the fuel the bacteria secrete.

Recovering the fuel is where Joule could find significant problems, said Pienkos, the NREL scientist, who is also principal investigator on a Department of Energy-funded project with Algenol, a Joule competitor that makes ethanol and is one of the handful of companies that also bypass biomass.

Pienkos said his calculations, based on information in Joule’s recent paper, indicate that though they eliminate biomass problems, their technology leaves relatively small amounts of fuel in relatively large amounts of water, producing a sort of “sheen.” They may not be dealing with biomass, but the company is facing complicated “engineering issues” in order to recover large amounts of its fuel efficiently, he said.

“I think they’re trading one set of problems for another,” Pienkos said.

Success or failure for Joule comes soon enough. The company plans to break ground on a 10-acre demonstration facility this year, and Sims says they could be operating commercially in less than two years.

Robertson talks wistfully about the day he’ll hop into the Ferrari he doesn’t have, fill it with Joule fuel and gun the engine in an undeniable demonstration of the power and reality of Joule’s ideas.

Later, after leading a visitor on a tour of the labs, Robertson comes upon a poster of a sports car on an office wall, and it reminds him of the success he’s convinced is coming.

He motions to the picture.

“I wasn’t kidding about the Ferrari,” he says.

Read more: http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20110306/news/703069921/#ixzz1Fs7S8Dv1

Could be made to kill two birds with one stone if they can make it work like they claim it does:thumbup:
 
the idea of using some of the strategic reserve to ease prices is straight out of idiocracy.

YES, some people are hurting, lets help them. but not at the literal cost of national security.q

^^^ This.

The Strategic Reserve is for emergencies.

We are not in an emergency, we are in OPEC 4, expect this time, it isn't OPEC yanking our chain, but a bunch of greedy So and So's who are playing the market for short term gain and station owners who really are taking advantage of the public's fear to make a profit. There is no shortage. The Saudi King would be just as happy to see $80/Barrel oil because he knows that is sustainable and generally increases his countries production to counter fluctuation in the market.

Right now NG is tanking, and I don't know why because every darn Electric Plant is converting over from Coal. We could be running on that. Or E85, or a host of other viable alternative fuels... Or even electricity for those around town chores.

So instead of crying about the cost of fuel, we stop our dependence on foreign sources, including Alaska, and start doing what we should have been doing back in 73' when we found out for the 1st time that we were not in control of our own destiny. Develop or Create alternative fuels or Technologies to take 80% of the imports off the table.

Notice how that idiot Chavez hasn't said anything for a while? Guess who CITCO is?
 
^^^ This.

The Strategic Reserve is for emergencies.

We are not in an emergency, we are in OPEC 4, expect this time, it isn't OPEC yanking our chain, but a bunch of greedy So and So's who are playing the market for short term gain and station owners who really are taking advantage of the public's fear to make a profit. There is no shortage. The Saudi King would be just as happy to see $80/Barrel oil because he knows that is sustainable and generally increases his countries production to counter fluctuation in the market.

Right now NG is tanking, and I don't know why because every darn Electric Plant is converting over from Coal. We could be running on that. Or E85, or a host of other viable alternative fuels... Or even electricity for those around town chores.

So instead of crying about the cost of fuel, we stop our dependence on foreign sources, including Alaska, and start doing what we should have been doing back in 73' when we found out for the 1st time that we were not in control of our own destiny. Develop or Create alternative fuels or Technologies to take 80% of the imports off the table.

Notice how that idiot Chavez hasn't said anything for a while? Guess who CITCO is?
100% agreed. A while ago something like 80% of trades in oil futures were done by banks and large automated trading firms that never intend to take delivery, they are only in it to make money off it. We buy something like half a percent of our oil from Libya and the Saudis are cranking up supply to compensate... but you won't see that in the prices on the market.
 
I'm waiting for a 450hp hybrid Jeep JK that runs on natural gas and costs $20k........Obama has frozen offshore drilling and failed to come up with any semblance of an energy policy that helps the US become energy independent. Instead of dropping hundreds of billions on entitlement projects, how about a couple of billion $ in prize money for the first company that comes up with affordable alternate energy technology?
 
the idea of using some of the strategic reserve to ease prices is straight out of idiocracy.
its also typical of obama, caving now when its not even $4 yet. i was there for $5/g a gal, and paying that was better than seing our 'strategic

those were opportunistic gas stations, not a national average, I lived out in cali when the prices spiked, drove east and found gas in MO for 2 dollas cheaper

I'm following the beantown boys to get those microbes to get up and running, by the end of next year they'll be found out one way or another
 
I'm waiting for a 450hp hybrid Jeep JK that runs on natural gas and costs $20k........Obama has frozen offshore drilling and failed to come up with any semblance of an energy policy that helps the US become energy independent. Instead of dropping hundreds of billions on entitlement projects, how about a couple of billion $ in prize money for the first company that comes up with affordable alternate energy technology?

Obama and his goons in congress would need a semblance of brain matter before they could maybe just maybe come up with a semblance of intelligent policy....beyond spend until we drop.
 
Opening up the reserves will have no effect on the price, that oil will go on the open market, the feds though will make a killing on, I think oil was at $40 a barrel when they filled the reserves last. You will notice it's being controlled, they don't want it to shoot up like last time, the slower price rise will let them see just how far they can squeeze without breaking like last time.
 
those were opportunistic gas stations, not a national average, I lived out in cali when the prices spiked, drove east and found gas in MO for 2 dollas cheaper

I'm following the beantown boys to get those microbes to get up and running, by the end of next year they'll be found out one way or another

Yes that is interesting, also waiting for the coal to lpg plants to start putting out gas and diesel for $55 a barrel. If we could turn the Environmental Prohibition Agency into the Environmental Solutions Agency we might turn things around here in the US.
The scary part is if that bacteria method works it might vanish over nite like it never existed, it would up set trillions of dollars worth of apple carts. Hope those corp engineers have good body guards.
 
Or E85, or a host of other viable alternative fuels... Or even electricity for those around town chores.
E85 is fool's gold.

Algae/bacterium fuel production makes the most sense in the short term.

honestly I think the best solution is to make all of the traders in the oil commodity market actually take delivery, and be forced to hold it for one-week before selling. Let's see all of the day traders making 10 cents a barrel inflating the prices take delivery of a few thousand barrels of crude.

It would effectively put the pricing back in the refiner's hands, not a bunch of idiots on Scott-Trade trying to make a quick buck trading some paper.
 
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