- Location
- Port Orchard, WA
and someone to help, hitch/skid = heavy... and someone else there always makes it more funRichP said:
-XJ_Ranger
-
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Tell me I got hosed...(long, but worth it)
- Thread starter mikeny59
- Start date
-XJ_Ranger
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
Thanks,
have a goood night, apppreciate the advice.
Mike #300
have a goood night, apppreciate the advice.
Mike #300
- Location
- Terra Firma
Dunno about the fuel pump and sender in the new style tanks, but in the older XJs with steel tanks although the sender is attached to the same assembly as the fuel pump and they go into the tank together, they are in fact separate parts and you can buy just a fuel pump.
As I said, I do NOT know if this applies in the case of the newer models. I'll pull out the 2000 FSM and read up.
Don't know about NY but I believe in Connecticut you are entitled to get the old parts back if you specified ahead of time that you want them. Otherwise the shop is not obligated to return them or have them available for inspection, although the shop at my dealership usually does.
As I said, I do NOT know if this applies in the case of the newer models. I'll pull out the 2000 FSM and read up.
Don't know about NY but I believe in Connecticut you are entitled to get the old parts back if you specified ahead of time that you want them. Otherwise the shop is not obligated to return them or have them available for inspection, although the shop at my dealership usually does.
- Location
- Terra Firma
Found it.
Looks like there's a good chance you still have a defective sender in there.
2000 FSM said:
Looks like there's a good chance you still have a defective sender in there.
TNScrambler
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Knoxville, TN
Did he specifically say that he purchased the part from the Jeep Dealer?
I'm a manager for advance auto parts, and I can tell you that many shops source parts from many different places....usually its whoever will sell it to them the cheapest. We even have some shops who contact us, we inturn go to the dealer, buy the part, mark it up and sale it to the customer, now this is only in the case of a commercial customer, as second sourcing usually does not bring in much if any profit, but alows for great customer service.
Also, one of our commercial accounts is a toyota dealer, they take in many used vehicles and source parts from us for such vehicles....but, surprisingly enough they even purchase aftermarket toyota parts from us, as many times our parts are cheaper than their own parts.
However, even if this shop has an account with an autoparts supplier which is payed on a monthly basis, there is a paper trail. Whether or not a part is delieverd, or wheather or not there is tax charged, if it is a commercial account there is a a commercial invoice that is printed which they have to sign even if they pay cash. All of these accounts are are saved not only for obvious reasons, but also for cases just as this where the shop drops the ball, or looses paperwork and needs a warrenty claim, we still have reciept.
This not just with advance auto, but any other part supplier I've worked for, both dealerships and in the aftermarket.
Good luck,
Justin
Also, Advance shows a carter fuel pump for the '98 without the sending unit for $89 retail.....so he could have sourced it from any aftermarket supplier, charged you for a discounted dealer list price and made out like a bandit
I'm a manager for advance auto parts, and I can tell you that many shops source parts from many different places....usually its whoever will sell it to them the cheapest. We even have some shops who contact us, we inturn go to the dealer, buy the part, mark it up and sale it to the customer, now this is only in the case of a commercial customer, as second sourcing usually does not bring in much if any profit, but alows for great customer service.
Also, one of our commercial accounts is a toyota dealer, they take in many used vehicles and source parts from us for such vehicles....but, surprisingly enough they even purchase aftermarket toyota parts from us, as many times our parts are cheaper than their own parts.
However, even if this shop has an account with an autoparts supplier which is payed on a monthly basis, there is a paper trail. Whether or not a part is delieverd, or wheather or not there is tax charged, if it is a commercial account there is a a commercial invoice that is printed which they have to sign even if they pay cash. All of these accounts are are saved not only for obvious reasons, but also for cases just as this where the shop drops the ball, or looses paperwork and needs a warrenty claim, we still have reciept.
This not just with advance auto, but any other part supplier I've worked for, both dealerships and in the aftermarket.
Good luck,
Justin
Also, Advance shows a carter fuel pump for the '98 without the sending unit for $89 retail.....so he could have sourced it from any aftermarket supplier, charged you for a discounted dealer list price and made out like a bandit
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
While I was waiting around to get a ride from the shop, I think I heard him call a local Chrysler dealer on the phone in the shop to locate the part.
I broke a rear ujoint during the summer and thrashed the yoke on the Chrysler 8.25, I remember him calling around and finally found one at the local Dodge dealer.
The sender is still bad (unless it's actually the gauge that went) I don't know which part usually fails more often than the other, wouldn't you think that a brand new oem unit would've solved the gauge problem, and if it didn't, he'd try to sell me a new gauge?
BTW, I learned that his shop is not a NYS registered repair facility. I should have known, it's attached to one of those strictly used car dealers, but I guess that doesn't necessarily prove anything.
My ususual mechanic was my best friend who passed on a number of years ago, I managed to do everything on my vehicles except when stranded, and the reason I chose this guy was because his kid was one of my students where I teach.
Thanks again for all the responses over the last few days. The info has made me rethink alot of what happened and what now to do.
Mike #300
I broke a rear ujoint during the summer and thrashed the yoke on the Chrysler 8.25, I remember him calling around and finally found one at the local Dodge dealer.
The sender is still bad (unless it's actually the gauge that went) I don't know which part usually fails more often than the other, wouldn't you think that a brand new oem unit would've solved the gauge problem, and if it didn't, he'd try to sell me a new gauge?
BTW, I learned that his shop is not a NYS registered repair facility. I should have known, it's attached to one of those strictly used car dealers, but I guess that doesn't necessarily prove anything.
My ususual mechanic was my best friend who passed on a number of years ago, I managed to do everything on my vehicles except when stranded, and the reason I chose this guy was because his kid was one of my students where I teach.
Thanks again for all the responses over the last few days. The info has made me rethink alot of what happened and what now to do.
Mike #300
RichP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Effort, Pa
The fuel gauge itself is part of the dash board and has to be replaced as a unit. Cost is over $600 from dealer. I replaced my 98's idiot light panel with a used 97 gauge panel I got for $35 and it has worked fine with only two differences, the 'security' and 'low washer fluid' lights are reversed, now when my windshield washer fluid gets low the security light comes on. I got the panel thru one of the boards, either here or blue mountain jeep alliance, forget now but there are several www sites that sell them from wrecks for around $100 or so.
One of the other things on my 98 that I found was that the big bulkhead connector down by your left foot, big grey box, was loose and almost falling out and contributing to several problems including resetting the radio presets and loosing clock time when I'd hit a bump, found it while I was installing the fog light kit. Took it apart, cleaned it out and put it back together. The combined fixes of cleaning the plugs behind the instrument panel and tightening the bulkhead connector have eliminated all my problems EXCEPT the gas gauge problem and that is from the junk factory sender. Until my fuel pump goes or for some reason I drop the tank I am not going to replace a perfectly good $200+ fuel pump for a bad sender, I just use my trip meter and never let it go for over 300 miles before filling up.
In a way I was in the same boat as you, had a very close friend that took care of our vehicles that I trusted. He sold the business and moved 300 miles away to upstate watertown NY about 5 years ago, it is only recently that I have formed another relationship with a fellow friend and church member who opened up a shop and I have been taking care of his computer needs [this stuff he's buying is state of the art snap-on/Mitchell, bluetooth wireless, etc].
While going after this guy may give you some satisfaction I would personally chalk it up to personal experience and file it away. It's not worth the extra time to take him to court just make sure to never recommend him to anyone. Order a new pump from the dealer and install it while you have the tank down. If the problem is still there then I would go for one of the used panels unless you have deep pockets.
I've been playing with my old idiot light panel and will continue to play with it this winter by replacing the idiot lights with stewart-warner gauges in all 4 corners, it may not work but we'll see. Good luck with whatever you decide and remember he's not worth a single tums....
One of the other things on my 98 that I found was that the big bulkhead connector down by your left foot, big grey box, was loose and almost falling out and contributing to several problems including resetting the radio presets and loosing clock time when I'd hit a bump, found it while I was installing the fog light kit. Took it apart, cleaned it out and put it back together. The combined fixes of cleaning the plugs behind the instrument panel and tightening the bulkhead connector have eliminated all my problems EXCEPT the gas gauge problem and that is from the junk factory sender. Until my fuel pump goes or for some reason I drop the tank I am not going to replace a perfectly good $200+ fuel pump for a bad sender, I just use my trip meter and never let it go for over 300 miles before filling up.
In a way I was in the same boat as you, had a very close friend that took care of our vehicles that I trusted. He sold the business and moved 300 miles away to upstate watertown NY about 5 years ago, it is only recently that I have formed another relationship with a fellow friend and church member who opened up a shop and I have been taking care of his computer needs [this stuff he's buying is state of the art snap-on/Mitchell, bluetooth wireless, etc].
While going after this guy may give you some satisfaction I would personally chalk it up to personal experience and file it away. It's not worth the extra time to take him to court just make sure to never recommend him to anyone. Order a new pump from the dealer and install it while you have the tank down. If the problem is still there then I would go for one of the used panels unless you have deep pockets.
I've been playing with my old idiot light panel and will continue to play with it this winter by replacing the idiot lights with stewart-warner gauges in all 4 corners, it may not work but we'll see. Good luck with whatever you decide and remember he's not worth a single tums....
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
Rich,
Before the weekend's out I'll drop the tank and ascertain if the present pump has even been removed. This happened only about a month ago and if it's new it should much cleaner than the surrounding tank area.
If amex credits my account and debits his (I'm about to call to see how this works) and providing the old pump is still there, the $600 or so I get back will feel much better than me stewing over this every day. I looked at my bill and nothing is itemized, part, labor, and tow are grouped together. He specifically said the oem unit was $340 my cost, but I guess due to his detailess bill, he could dispute that.
His shop is not listed with the BBB.
Thanks for the words.
Mike #300
Before the weekend's out I'll drop the tank and ascertain if the present pump has even been removed. This happened only about a month ago and if it's new it should much cleaner than the surrounding tank area.
If amex credits my account and debits his (I'm about to call to see how this works) and providing the old pump is still there, the $600 or so I get back will feel much better than me stewing over this every day. I looked at my bill and nothing is itemized, part, labor, and tow are grouped together. He specifically said the oem unit was $340 my cost, but I guess due to his detailess bill, he could dispute that.
His shop is not listed with the BBB.
Thanks for the words.
Mike #300
Steele
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Syracuse, NY
Where abouts in NY is this shop. You might of screwed your self by going to a non registered state of NY shop, its kinda like having a back yard mechanic do the job for ya and then try to settle a despute. I doubt the BBB would even touch this case, because technically its not a licensed and insured NYS motor vehicle shop. Its too bad you lost your reliable mechanic, but there's plenty of good ones out there, and all it takes is one to ruin the reputation of many. I'd avoid the court stuff cause that's gonna cost you more than what you already lost. You might want to contact the NYS DOT who issues the big signs on the front of NY shops, typically big green ones, and see what that particular shop is licensed to do. Hopefully this shop is no where close to Syracuse.....
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
Western Suffolk County, Long Island. Like I said before, I'm going to call amex and see what they'll do. They've backed me up a couple of times - very small disputes - in the last 14 years, I'm in the middle of dropping the tank before I call them.
Thanks,
Mike #300
Thanks,
Mike #300
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
Saturday I visited the Jeep parts manager I do all my business with. He's the coolest, does me favors all the time and once in awhile I bring his dept. food. I asked if he sold my fuel pump that day (day of repair) 30 seconds later the computer shows they do not even do business with the guy who I think ripped me off.
Then he said Monday (today) he'll call around local DC and Jeep parts departments to see if this shop bought my pump that day. When I said that the mechanic/owner said he was giving me the pump at cost ($340), the parts manager said that's the correct price for the part including the sender, and laughed that the mechanic said he wasn't making a dime on the deal.
He also said the gauge should now work, because in all the years he's been at the dealership he has never seen a gas gauge go bad on an xj, but he's sold a fair share of sender units.
I showed him my invoice (I'll try and scan and post it w/o the guys name and address) and absolutely nothing was itemized on it. He said there is no reason I shouldn't get this whole situation reversed, especially when I requested the part returned and not even a part invoice was produced. He said no reputable shop has a part delivered without a copy of the invoice.
BTW, the mechanic/owner filled the gas tank when I picked up the xj, no charge, the parts manager chuckled and said of course he would, he just made $600 for doing squat.
I'll keep you informed.
Mike #300
Then he said Monday (today) he'll call around local DC and Jeep parts departments to see if this shop bought my pump that day. When I said that the mechanic/owner said he was giving me the pump at cost ($340), the parts manager said that's the correct price for the part including the sender, and laughed that the mechanic said he wasn't making a dime on the deal.
He also said the gauge should now work, because in all the years he's been at the dealership he has never seen a gas gauge go bad on an xj, but he's sold a fair share of sender units.
I showed him my invoice (I'll try and scan and post it w/o the guys name and address) and absolutely nothing was itemized on it. He said there is no reason I shouldn't get this whole situation reversed, especially when I requested the part returned and not even a part invoice was produced. He said no reputable shop has a part delivered without a copy of the invoice.
BTW, the mechanic/owner filled the gas tank when I picked up the xj, no charge, the parts manager chuckled and said of course he would, he just made $600 for doing squat.
I'll keep you informed.
Mike #300
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
http://community.webshots.com/scripts/editPhotos.fcgi?action=viewall&albumID=206280455
AMEX is giving me temporary credit until thet settle the dispute, 4 to 8 weeks. They want to see my diatribe and photos I'm sending to NYSDMV, they said I have a very compelling case, especiall with the lack of guarantee and non itemized bill.
Here are some photos that show the condition of the top of the tank (no fingerprints in other photos anywhere on top of tank or pump) after about 4 weeks of driving around.
Mike #300
AMEX is giving me temporary credit until thet settle the dispute, 4 to 8 weeks. They want to see my diatribe and photos I'm sending to NYSDMV, they said I have a very compelling case, especiall with the lack of guarantee and non itemized bill.
Here are some photos that show the condition of the top of the tank (no fingerprints in other photos anywhere on top of tank or pump) after about 4 weeks of driving around.
Mike #300
Beej
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- The Wet Coast of BC
I could not see that link. It says you have to be the owner of the album to see it.
B.
B.
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
Fuel Pump Revisited - tell me if this looks like a one month old install
http://community.webshots.com/user/pribblesoon
Mike #300
http://community.webshots.com/user/pribblesoon
Mike #300
Jeepin_rebel
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Ft riley Ks
Re: Fuel Pump Revisited - tell me if this looks like a one month old install
From what i have heard it sounds like the fule pump relay went out on it. I had this happen to mine and replaced the pump and a bunch of other crap befor i took it to the shop. It was there all of an hour befor they gave it back to me and charged 15 bucks for the relay. It sounds like you got hosed... you might wana take a look at your relays and see if there is a new one. He might have just replaced that and told you the other stuff was bad. just my .02
From what i have heard it sounds like the fule pump relay went out on it. I had this happen to mine and replaced the pump and a bunch of other crap befor i took it to the shop. It was there all of an hour befor they gave it back to me and charged 15 bucks for the relay. It sounds like you got hosed... you might wana take a look at your relays and see if there is a new one. He might have just replaced that and told you the other stuff was bad. just my .02
RichP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- Effort, Pa
That does not look like anywhere near a new fuel pump.
mikeny59
NAXJA Member #300
- Location
- NY and/or Fl.
AMEX already credited me the $599 and change and said just to send them the same stuff (pix/description of incident) to them that I'm sending to DMV.
Thanks for looking at the pix.
Mike #300
Thanks for looking at the pix.
Mike #300
redyouch
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- New Milford, CT
you def got hosed, good thing you dropped the tank and took pictures. good thing u got your $$ back. good job catching a cheater.
JEONLYEP
NAXJA Forum User
- Location
- N 37° 48.485 W 100° 20.903
Sounds like things are pretty much solved. But I did want to say that I get all my "Jeep" parts from my "Dodge" dealer. The Jeep dealer around here is awful. The way I understand it is any D. Chrysler part is available at any D. Chrysler dealer, brand not withstanding.
.02
.02
